David Aaronovitch comment in Times

[Igneococcus]

David Aaronovitch in today's Times about free speech and the GRA:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/assaults-on-free-speech-are-led-by-the-left-l2r8t9t9p?shareToken=d99c908ebaf10ccf760a000cb98a2bd1

Very good article. Thank you for sharing it.

I'm glad more and more people are starting to wake up to this.

Ooo that's good. Doesn't matter what side of the debate you're on it's about belief in free speech. Should women be muzzled because other people dislike what they say.

DA usually gets hundreds of comments. It's a good place to get some points in. I'll be hanging out there today when I have the time.

Very good article. Just what is needed.

Agreed. An excellent article. Thank you David.

Thank you for common sense and hopefully some more mainstream support to stop the aggressive targeting and silencing tactics being employed against GC feminists - where some police are joining in the strong-arming enabling abuse by proxy

Thank you David Aaronovitch.

Thanks for sharing; it's very positive that more mainstream male opinion writers are breaking cover to speak out about the issue. I've noticed people like David and Nick Cohen retweeting Hadley Freeman/Janice Turner. The article doesn't only highlight the free speech element, which is key, but also what should be obvious to anyone - the consequences for women's sport and the obvious different experiences for someone born and raised with a penis and someone not.

Came here to see if this had been posted. I am delighted to see David Aaronovitch cover this. I can't help but feel "ah now! Now the men agree, people will take us seriously at last". But it's a great piece and lead comment bit in the Times.

Bravo, and brava to A Woman's Place for doggedly organising these events.

"There is no "but" after "open debate" excellent!

Actually, while I'm at it: also brava to all you lot, who keep on making the argument on here and on Twitter and in RL, and writing to your MPs, and going along to discussions on this even when you know there may be violent opposition. You're all marvellous.

Please can a MNer with a Times log in post the petition under David’s article: petition.parliament.uk/petitions/214118

Good article.

We are all in the same boat when it comes to free speech.

Really glad to see a big hitter like David Aaronovitch take this on. Am only surprised that Nick Cohen hasn't written anything yet.

Did anyone roll their eyes at this bit?

"She cited the frequency with which trans people are murdered as a further argument against accommodating anti-trans activists on campus.”

The frequency? ie, almost never - in this country at least. Does anybody ever challenge these people to produce statistics to show that trans people are more at risk of being murdered than others?

Hackmum I agree. But I noted that the article carefully didn't comment on the substantive issue, only the #nodebate tactic.

In the article in the Times, formerly considered the establishment paper, the paper of record, DA implies that the GRA would give transwomen the legal right to complete in women's sports. This is a load of bollocks. Both the GRA and the EA have exceptions for women's sports. If this was a one off, it could be viewed as a mistake, but given the long line of transphobic articles in the Times, it does not look like a mistake.

There is a legitimate debate to be had around GRA reform. What will the legal differences betwen old and new GRCs be? If the government revokes a GRC, what will the appeals procedure be? But this is hardly the stuff of FWR, let alone national discourse.

Trans supporters object to transphobic hatred being dressed up as debate and then when the hatred is called out, the haters cry freedom of speech.

Comments are still pending. I think there will be many once they start showing.
I'll put a petition link in if there isn't one already.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/aa45affc-6f5a-11e8-bea3-bf1a5a054f3a

Does anyone have a share token for this? I have used up my two articles and it would be interesting to see if it is relevant.

There are exceptions for women's sports, but these are starting to be ignored, to name a few: Laurel Hubbard, Fallon Fox, the recent Connecticut race...

How was it transphobic? I thought it was a very balanced article. He doesn't come down for or against the changes, but highlights the issues feminists have faced when trying to voice their concerns - which is completely true!

Here melamin

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/web-giants-are-fuelling-child-mental-health-crisis-gqxc29q0x?shareToken=ff0e138dcb055ace93c1df14de0af183

Everything is transphobic!

Thanks

The exceptions in sports are all very well, but no one has the power to enforce them without being able to justify themselves in court. That's why they get ignored.

‘Turfed off’, hah. He’s got a way with words.

The way the GRA interacts with the EA, other legislation and the changes in culture, numbers, policies, impact on women all need discussed, Sarah. You can't just hide behind 'that's transphobic' any more when others affected want their say on their own rights. Too many people have noticed the stealthy and increasing chipping away at women's rights ('oh no nothing to see here this is just about trans stuff, move along now) and can now start to see the impact. They want to discuss what that means for women and girls and how to protect their dignity, safety and fairness. Calling that transphobic would have to assume that you see transgender ideology as inherently anti-woman. Which it's not, right?