Germaine Greer on rape - controversial

[Cwenthryth]

twitter.com/channel4news/status/999946049530859527

Just came across this on Twitter. Only seen the clip so far going to watch the whole thing shortly.... haven’t seen this discussed anywhere else here yet.

I get what she’s saying - don’t let the shitty things that happen to you define you.

But saying “I didn’t want my story to be I was raped, that’s not my story”. But it clearly is a part of your story, Germaine, whether you want it to be or not. You weren’t ‘in the wrong place’ as if lightning struck you, your rape wasn’t an inevitability, it was an act of sexual violence by a man against you that should not have happened.

And whatever someone’s reaction is to shitty things that happen to them - their reaction is their reaction, there isn’t a right and wrong way to react and this clip sounds dangerously close to shaming rape victims if they react in a different way to you. KGM wasn’t helping trying to put the “not that bad” soundbite in her mouth though.

Look at porn with the sheer number of porn videos and stories with ruined/destroyed in the title. If men get off on the notion of destructive acts towards women as wank fodder, is it not therefore possible to say that's a big part of a rapists motivation. I sometimes feel, and I could be wrong obviously, that the rapist enjoys his notion of the lasting damage he is causing more than any sexual gratification from the rape itself. If this is not the case, why do impotent rapists utilise objects in place of their floppy cocks.

I agree with GG up to a point, while not looking down on any woman who is traumatised long term as everyone has the right to their own feelings, because lasting harm is the rapists goal and they shouldn't be allowed the continuing pleasure of thinking they've had a lifelong impact on their victims.

I do think it’s the goal yes and then there is a lot of difficulty re that being your actual experience. Because women are generally held collectively responsible and men are generally held only to be responsible for themselves women may well be vulnerable to feeling that the common narrative has to apply to them or their feelings aren’t valid or that if their feelings do correspond with the narrative that they are letting everyone down and the rapist has ‘won’.

We blame ourselves, we shut our mouths etc because every single woman is held responsible for everyone else in society.

IMO rape should remain a serious crime and we should get better at investigating it and prosecuting it and better at supporting victims to be witnesses in court.

More rapist should be sitting in jail feeling sorry, feeling pleased or feeling angry, as long as more of them are sitting in jail. Parole boards should take into account which type they are before they agree their release but apart from that as a victim your reaction is your reaction the rapists feelings about it are not relevant.

GG’s idea re civil damages is not relevant to women who don’t trust or understand the court system, who don’t have economic power to bring a case, to women whose rapist is their husband or partner or father of their children, to women who need protection, to women who are raped by someone who isn’t wealthy....

So basically almost every woman who is raped...

Most women don’t want money. What they want is justice and protection.

And I thought she wasn’t really adequately understanding the significant pressure many of the women who signed non-disclosure agreements were under.

Women who want something done that is.

Many women simply want to just get on with their lives.

I heard about the civil damages approach a few months back from GG, i didnt realise then it was a viable option. Some how to guides to get the info out and a charity set up to cover victims solictors fees would be good. Honestly if I was raped now unless it was a stranger attack I wouldn't go to the police but I would be desperately angry and want to do something .

Out of interest would a rape civil court case between husband and wife be available on Clare's law if a new partner asked?

(Obviously ideally rapists should be in prison but that doesn't seem to be happening.)

I work with several police surgeons and one of the main difficulties in getting more successful prosecutions is the number of women who drank heavily on the evening they were raped and have hazy often inconsistent accounts of it. If you put this with a man saying she consented and people who saw them together looking very amorous then it is hard for those making the decision to be sure putting a man in prison and on the sex offenders register is the right thing. Making rapists' sentences harsher just makes this a more difficult decision especially if you combine it with a man who is poor at reading nonverbal signals and a woman who is poor at giving verbal signals.

Fascinating and really enjoyable interview. I have heard her say similar about rape in the past - something along the lines of 'for god's sake it's only a penis'. I really admire her determination not to be defined by her attack, and I thought her explanation for not reporting it was crystal clear and very pragmatic. It's a very interesting approach and extremely thought provoking, as ever with Greer

I loved her fury at Mrs Brown's Boys too and her explanation of the difference between sex and gender was just great