You need to read this article about the Leeds red light district.

[DJLippy]

I read this blog about the Leeds red light district from someone who lives there. It's so illuminating. This needs a wider audience - please share on social media. This is what decriminalisation looks like.

littlegirlblue.blog/2018/05/25/living-in-the-red-light-district/

She is writing about living in Holbeck.

She is not writing about herself and how she personally is so much worse off than other people.

She has in fact written about the reasons she has more privilege, that’s how you know about them to judge her.

She’s not asking for your help out of poverty nor is she asking for judgement re deservingness, which is what you are doing.

You are dividing poor people into ‘no fault of their own’ and ‘treat with suspicion’ and if you can’t see how that dynamic is a massive way poverty happens in the first place you shouldn’t be working with people living in poverty.

You are dividing poor people into ‘no fault of their own’ and ‘treat with suspicion’ and if you can’t see how that dynamic is a massive way poverty happens in the first place you shouldn’t be working with people living in poverty.

YY.

“I am operating under the assumption that greater levels of education give greater levels of opportunity yes.”

It doesn’t guarantee them though... other things still happen that can trap people in poverty.

Education only gives people more levels of opportunity than other people in their circumstances, not universally, other things also impact that.

Education only gives people more levels of opportunity than other people in their circumstances, not universally, other things also impact that

This is why I'm interested to hear more from the blogger as I would be interested to understand what it is that has trapped her in poverty.

Please don't make sweeping statements about the ability of strangers to do their jobs based on a handful of posts you have read offred. I can assure you that I have been very successful in my role for many years and have doubtless had more of an impact on the lives and futures of people in poverty than many people on this thread. Often this is about encouraging education and training which opens doors to employment opportunities and greater prosperity. Hence my desire to understand further the blogger's position as someone with professional qualifications who describes being trapped for 3 years in a place of poverty.

That would be fine if you were being genuine in wanting to understand.

I think it is pretty clear that you aren’t and that what is going on here is what often happens re ‘helping the poor’.

You have been sold a particular narrative. When the narrative is challenged by a person who doesn’t fit into it, you respond with suspicion regarding whether the person is truthful re their circumstances or judgement regarding their deservingness. You assume a mantle of ‘saviour’ and meddle beyond what is being asked.

This is what happens to a lot of people engaged in ‘helping the poor’. It is demeaning, unhelpful and ultimately supports keeping people poor because it is based on a narrative coming from those in power. Those in power who are keeping people poor in the first place.

Have a think about why you needed to make a blog about living in Holbeck, written by someone living in Holbeck, all about whether the writer is ‘allowed’ to be poor.

I think it is pretty clear that you aren’t and that what is going on here is what often happens re ‘helping the poor’.

I prefer improving the poor. Because that's what it's all about. It's positively bloody Victorian.

The victorians were at least pretty honest re improving the poor.

Its actually impossible to win in these situations.

I had a couple of ppl say on another site that they wondered if Helana Dove would be so interested about posting about social housing issues if they didnt affect her personally.

I have no doubt in my mind though that if they didnt affect me personally and i still posted about it id be called something akin to a champagne socialist.

This is why I'm interested to hear more from the blogger as I would
be interested to understand what it is that has trapped her in poverty

Why?
Do you think you can reason with her to just move out and forget about those left behind?
Are you really so short of thinking that you simply cannot fathom any reason why they may be poor at the moment, or still want to live in a deprived area? Not even one tiny reason, let alone the hundreds of reasons why.
And just what does any of that have to do with the managed area?
Whether she is thick as a plank, highly educated or somewhere in between, makes no difference to the area, in particular the managed area.
maybe spend some time thinking about how that can be changed for the better rather than who lives there. They are all deserving of living in a nice place are they not.

Yy Helena, as I’m sure you are aware, that’s the whole point.

had a couple of ppl say on another site that they wondered if
Helana Dove would be so interested about posting
about social housing issues if they didnt affect her personally

I have no doubt in my mind though that if they didnt affect me personally and i still posted about it id be called something akin
to a champagne socialist

And yet most of the posters here don't live in holbeck, but we still want to change what's happening.
Anyone can call me a champagne socialist, or any words in fact. I don't care what they call me so long as something gets done. (Although I have absolutely no idea what can be done)
Social housing issues can affect anyone. Lots of people are just a job/divorce/death/etc away from living in social housing.
I give a shit about social housing issues, I believe strongly that everyone deserves a decent home.

In my view the following can help;

1. Actually give a voice to people that are voiceless. Stop having rich, Eton-educated politicians tell us how poor women or poor families are living / feeling. Give a voice to the poor women / poor families themselves.

1. Far wider representation in politics. Sort of an expansion of the above point. This would happen by exploding the status quo of Establishment politics. More women, more BAME, less posh, more practical people.

All this nonsense about being poor. Yes I know how that sounds but the bottom line in a democratic, capitalist society the reality is that there will always be some people who are richer than others ; there will always be some people who earn more than others.

The alternative is communism which has been a miserable failure.

However the fact that the people in Holbeck can't afford to live where I live does not mean they should be condemned to have put up with what they are being asked to put up with just because some man wants to pay £20 to wank into a woman.

Yes I know how that sounds harsh

State run services for the "disadvantaged" often re-victimise as they are full of middle class people "helping" - in other words they know best. Patriarchy in action.

had a couple of ppl say on another site that they wondered if Helana Dove would be so interested about posting about social housing issues if they didnt affect her personally

I've never lived in social housing. I don't even know that many people who have lived in social housing. Why should Helena not post about an issue which affects her personally?

@Lass - harsh maybe, but I don’t think you’re wrong.

I’d be very angry, and would feel unsafe, if it was decided to experiment on my area like this. It’s the casual disregard for the residents - and the normalisation, that it’s okay for men to have sex with a drug addicted care leaver for less than the cost of a takeaway.

the reality is that there will always be some people who are richer than others ; there will always be some people who earn more than others

I don't disagree.

However the fact that the people in Holbeck can't afford to live where I live does not mean they should be condemned to have put up with what they are being asked to put up with just because some man wants to pay £20 to wank into a woman

Exactly. But I do think the fact that this situation has arisen does mean we have to address why, in a supposedly representative democracy, political power aligns itself with the depth of a community's pockets.

Honest rather than harsh lass!

All this nonsense about being poor. Yes I know how that sounds but the bottom line in a democratic, capitalist society the reality is that there will always be some people who are richer than others ; there will always be some people who earn more than others.

One may believe that capitalism is a desirable economic model or that there will always be differences between incomes etc without accepting levels of inequality quite this extreme.

The alternative is communism which has been a miserable failure.

It is not a straight choice between extreme capitalism and extreme totalitarian communism. This is all a bit ‘red under the bed’!

However the fact that the people in Holbeck can't afford to live where I live does not mean they should be condemned to have put up with what they are being asked to put up with just because some man wants to pay £20 to wank into a woman.

Yy

Hope I'm not coming across as too preachy () when I say that I would actually really like to do something to try & change things in Holbeck. My main motivation is helping the women, the sex workers.

My plan is to find out who the following are and write to them outlining my view & opposition to the status quo.

Head of police locally
Head of council locally
PM
Leader of opposition
Local MP

I know you might think it's a bit pointless, but I think as @Celinedayjardnz has proven, words can be v powerful.

I would encourage you all to do the same...

[email protected]
twitter.com/WestYorksOPCC

Mark burns-Williamson police crime commisioner wyp
Supposedly the man to get stuff done.

I agree mummyyessy. Let’s not let the thread get derailed by Tabitha’s reservations, but actually take some action. So far I’ve contacted the MP but don’t expect a response as I’m not a constituent.

Hilary Ben, makes my skin crawl but

[email protected]

Why am I trapped in poverty? It’s quite simple. There aren’t any jobs. If there aren’t any jobs, it doesn’t matter how well qualified you are. You can’t make people advertise jobs by the force of your good grammar. I am also trapped because of the hostile and abusive actions of the DWP, who have refused me benefits I am entitled to, and are doing so to many people in an even worse position than me. I am trapped in poverty because some selfish bastards vote Tory. Hope that explains it to your satisfaction.

I am also trapped because of the hostile and abusive actions of the DWP, who have refused me benefits I am entitled to, and are doing so to many people in an even worse position than me.

I am sorry this has all happened to you, Celine. And it can't be emphasised enough what an abusive institution the DWP has become. It actively hinders people from improving their lives.