Lord Paddick resigns the LGBT LD executive

[RedToothBrush]

LGBT+LD @ lgbtlb
Public statement by the LGBT+ Liberal Democrats executive regarding the resignation of our honorary president, Lord Paddick:
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The LGBT+ Liberal Democrats executive has reluctantly accepted the resignation of Lord Paddick as our honorary president.
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Lord Paddick previously tended his resignation, which we declined when he made certain undertakings about his meeting with a group set up to oppose transgender equality legislation.
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We regret that those undertakings have not been honoured. Subsequently Lord Paddick tended his resignation again, which has been accepted.
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Lord Paddick has form for resigning

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brian-lord-paddick-quits-over-tim-farron-gay-sex-comments-lib-dem-liberal-democrat-general-election-a7789816.html%3famp
Lord Paddick quits as Liberal Democrat Home Affairs spokespeson following furore over leader Tim Farron's views on gay sex
The former Lib Dem London Mayoral candidate said the decision had been made 'weeks ago.'

He quit as LD home affairs spokesperson as he was uncomfortable with Tim Farron's views on gay marriage. The resignation prompted Farron's ultimately. He is an important and influential figure in the party.

I'm not quite sure what's going on here or why. It sounds like the LGBT LD didn't want him to resign. It sounds like its connected to trans issues and Paddick's position. The timing is interesting.

I don't want to read too much into this. But its suggesting a split in opinion and approach. (I don't believe this shows that Paddick is pro-women's rights. I suspect he is more pro-due process, at least at this stage). And that its damaging to the executive as a whole.

When is the meeting with Paddick scheduled for? It could be very interesting now. Looks like Paddick really is sticking his neck out.

In response to the Oxford University statement on their meeting today womans place have tweeted this:

WomansPlaceUk @ womansplaceuk
You will hear a lot of things about us. Some of them are truly terrible. The good news they are simply not true. We are a campaign dedicated to ensuring women's voices are heard and their rights are upheld in any changes to the law.

Its just had a response from Brian Paddick:

Brian Paddick @ brianpaddick
I’ve only met two representatives from @WomansPlaceUK in a meeting that included 3 trans women & an academic. Nothing said in that meeting made me think they were anti trans rights. Participants didn’t agree on everything but it was cordial. Listening doesn’t hurt or corrupt.

This is real progress to have Paddick to say this and support the existence and right of Women's Place even though this is clearly not an endorsement of its views.

Pleased at this.

Thank goodness for another politician speaking up for democratic debate. Ridiculous that this had become such a controversial stance.

Big respect for Brian Paddick for standing up for this.

Whatever his views, the point is he is reaching them by listening to opposing views from both sides and encouraging respectful debate.

That is good news. I am another politician is encouraging respectful debate.

More politicians need to do this, instead of retweeting misleading stuff coming from from data breaches

not just a politician's opinion given Brian Paddick used to be the deputy assistant commissioner in the Met. police.

Thank goodness for that!

This is why debate us so important.

Great. Well done Women’s Place UK. It will be really progress to have people (like Brian Paddick) in the House of Lords who get the issues.

Listening doesn’t hurt or corrupt.

Absolutely. Whereas #nodebate does.

How reassuring. Am following him now on twitter. I wasn't happy with his role in Tim Farron's resignation but this is good.

Listening doesn’t hurt or corrupt.
Brilliant (& is it just me seeing a snark at the LGBT LD with the "corrupt")

Brian P has had many furious responses to his tweet supporting a woman's place, with members of the lgbt+ Lib Dems telling him he's wrong

Too many threads to link to one- but you can see his replies here mobile.twitter.com/brianpaddick/with_replies

Brian's doing himself and lib dems great credit in arguing back, reasonably, and defending both AWP and people's right to assemble

He's tweeted to say he's had enough. Can't say I blame him.

Not surprising. He says he’s seeing hate from both sides. It must be a real eye opener for anyone who has previously accepted the rhetoric that trans people are always victims.

Someone has said that the account is damaging the party by the way it speaks to the public. I agree and I really hope something is done about it.

... and it's all kicked off again.

LGBT Lib Dem are going after Paddick on Twitter. Presumably because he wouldn't do what they instructed him to do.

twitter.com/brianpaddick/status/989272223193141248

I would hope that as a former senior police officer Brian realises why giving angry males access to vulnerable women in their spaces is a bad idea.

I disagree that he's having a particularly hard time, the comments he is getting is nothing compared to the wrath unleashed on women who wrongthink.

LGBT Lib Dem are going after Paddick on Twitter.

IMO, it's really not a good look in the run-up to the local elections.

DH joined the LDs over Brexit, and (although I consider myself a floating voter) we've voted for them fairly faithfully for the past however-many elections because we've generally agreed with their policies.

We are both wavering, not because of the issue per se, but the really ugly behaviour we're seeing. I can actually see myself spoiling my ballot for the first time .

They are absolute idiots.

Paddick has a high profile in the media and they've alienated him for the terrible crime of listening to women. He will have nothing to do with them now, he has his reputation to think about, and associating with them in the future will reflect badly on him. So he's out. They are fast running out of allies. No moderates left, just the zealots running the show. Who will, of course, turn on each other in time.

So predictable that they would turn on him. As sure as night follows day.

He needs to get the Party to take action though. That Twitter feed makes the Lib Dems come across as a bonkers fringe party.

Paddick is now saying to people being sympathetic to him on twitter re the way LGBTLD are behaving towards him that they should be in his shoes for a while. He still doesn't get it. We have been on the receiving end, particularly from the LGBTLD account and we've had far worse than he has with people mansplaining why he's wrong. We get threats of violence - this isn't happening to him.

He's still trying to be on the fence in spite of the insane abuse he's getting for daring to speak to women.

He did retweet the comment from the transwoman who said the violence and intimidation is coming from one side only (TRA side).

So of course he is vilified for the abhorrent act of retweeting that.

As Paddick has become more educated on the issues, he's been distancing himself from the TRAs. They really don't like that.

He is doing the best job by far of any politician so far of standing up for listening to all sides and calling out intimidation.

More and more people are understanding what is going on and the dynamics of the debate - and what it actually means for women and the gay community, particularly lesbians.

All parties are going to need answers to the kind of questions Woman's Place UK are answering, because voters will be asking them.

Brian Paddick is getting a lesson in why a lot of us see trans activism as extremist. I feel for him. As he rightly recognises there are also moderates on both sides and we are being drowned out by this. Its not good for anyone. If I were to put it bluntly, even if the LGBT LDs are right in everything they say, society just isn't ready for it and attempting to force it through will not work. You have to bring people along with you and the hostility, rudeness and bad manners from the LGBT LDs has exactly the opposite affect.

My personal experience was not that I was transphobic. It was the behaviour in which even well intended and supportive actions were written off aggressively as not good enough. I walked away because of behaviour not because of identity.

What worries me here is that if Brian Paddick can not manage this and walks away, then its the moderates who all lose out. Moderates who can find common ground and work together to understand each other and bring society forward on trans acceptance.

I am glad Brian is beginning to see this for what it is, even if he's not saying it outright. Its clear he understands the principle of liberal democracy and the need for consensus building.

The LGBT LDs trying to smear him as 'our Tim', I also think is interesting. I know a number of people who regard the way Farron was driven out as illiberal and poor. Yes he clearly has views that are 'dated' but at the same time he never promoted them, and always voted 'the right' way which was in line with the social consensus rather than his own private views. I don't think we should dismiss that as a bad thing. Indeed its admirable to acknowledge the disconnect and put others ahead of your own private thoughts. It all reeked of thought policing.

Wherever you sit politically, in a liberal democracy you can't thought police. Only persuade and nudge views gradually and have an agreed consensus which people go along with as its best for everyone.

He's still trying to be on the fence in spite of the insane abuse he's getting for daring to speak to women.

He's got as far as comparing it to an intractable neighbour dispute in policing. At some point, he's going to have to accept the blindingly obvious: the comparison is not an intractable neighbour dispute; it's to coercive control and domestic abuse.

I feel for him because it must be painful to realise that you were white knighting for an entirely different group of people than you thought you were white knighting for.

And Red is right about consensus building.

Seeing him come up against @HickeyWriter in which everything from sneezing to your left and putting your hand on you head is regarded as transphobic, I must admit to seeing and smiling privately to myself about.

Seeing it and feeling that and being on the receiving even of it is an eye opener about behaviour not about the underlying argument.

Hickeywriter speaks to BP entirely differently than he does to the women he tweets at though. There’s far more respect and far fewer threats.

I get that BP is doing the right thing and is at the start of the journey, but I think the gratitude going his way is so demonstrative of our socialisation. We shouldn’t have to be cheerleading a man being OK at us, we should be allowed to ask him to step up and do better. Politely of course, but saying that’s not yet good enough shouldn’t be something we can’t do.

I agree Brian is struggling with the idea he's been official rep for a group with a point of view that does not accept any dissent. And now he's being publicly shamed for deviating from the one true view, and in a local election campaign period.

And agree that he gets WAY less hassle than women do for daring to debate.

I'm still pleased he's done what he's done though- both he and Sophie from WEP have attempted to engage with "both sides" and got a panelling for their "transphobia" on twitter.

I'm wondering if he feels the feminist "side's" tweets painful in the same way many of us felt like we had our arses handed to us when we first posted on this on this board on the subject I know it's not just me, I deserved to be challenged on my woolly thinking.

Anyway, here's to BP taking a breather before returning to the argument. He seems to be recognising their behaviour as profoundly illiberal, so that is something.

That hickey thread is quite a read mobile.twitter.com/HickeyWriter/status/989251080201670657