Reconciling Trans and Feminism

[LonginesPrime]

I would consider myself to be gender critical but I respect transwomen's assertion that they feel they are women and I'm happy to respect their preferred pronouns.

As a feminist, it doesn't sit comfortably with me when transwomen say things like 'I knew I was female from a very young age as I always loved pink and played with my sister's dolls' and I personally believe that if society didn't place so much weight on gender conformity, especially when it comes to masculinity, lots of people who have transitioned probably would have been perfectly happy living their lives the way they wanted, wearing what they wanted without feeling the need to be recognised as someone of the opposite sex.

Similarly, from lesbians I know who have transitioned to male, I can absolutely see the appeal (whether on a conscious or subconscious level) of taking that step to be recognised as a man as opposed to a 'butch' woman in a society that undervalues women, and whilst I'm pleased for them and the ways their careers have advanced as a result of being perceived as male, it's disappointing to know that it does make a difference, especially when they're dressing exactly the same as they did before (i.e. in 'male' suits and waistcoats (I have some very dapper friends..)).

I have a lot of sympathy for the trans people who hate their bodies and feel they are confined by them. If someone feels they are a woman and wants to be treated as such more fool them, I have no problem washing my hands next to them in the loo or including them in the discussion at a book group. However, I don't think that male sex offenders who transition should be allowed in women's prisons and I don't believe that women attending a rape crisis centre should be forced to have anyone with a penis examine them if they're not comfortable with that.

It has taken a long time to even get to this point of reconciling my beliefs about gender and my support of the trans community and I can't claim to be completely there yet, but I'd be interested in hearing about other women's experiences of reconciling trans support with their own feminist views.

I'm sure I'm not the only one here who started in the middle looking for compromise and common ground - and doesn't identify as a radical feminist in most respects - yet has gradually migrated to a clear-cut gender critical stance as being the only one that makes sense in the current climate. Hence the username. Constructive ambiguity, the kind of fudge that lets us accept as women the kind of people the TRAs describe as "truscum", is a delicate thing; it doesn't work any more, and we have to resort to telling the plain truth more often than our socialised conciliatory natures might expect.

Is it your assertion of belief that there are more than two biological sexes in humans that we simply have not discovered yet?

thebewilderness was that question to me? If so, no. I just realised that my comment was confusing. I should have clarified that I believe that trans people are the sex they were born, not that they are some third sex. However, they obviously deviate from the norm in seeking to present themselves as members of the opposite sex and I recognise that they may face discrimination as a result. Therefore, I have no issue if places want to have a trans toilet or if prisons build a trans wing, or if trans officer roles are created. That is not an issue for me.

What is an issue obviously is the proclamation that trans women are real women (or indeed more womanly than real women) and the insistence that they should be given access to female spaces. We should retain and fiercely protect the ability to segregate on the basis of biological sex.

I'm intrigued, MrsB - how far do you accept or reject translogic, given that you accept that the young people you work with ARE trans?

Not sure what you mean about accepting people are trans? In itself, I don't think gender non conformity is a mental health issue although the stresses and strains of it can lead to anxiety and other issues (as can other issues lead to becoming gnc). In my work, notions of being in the wrong body, believing parts of your body are of the opposite sex and feeling distressed by your sexed body are considered to be mental health issues.

I think it is unfortunate that the two distinct groups are being lumped together under 1 label.

Trans logic/ ideology does not have any significance in my work. My role is to support mental health and emotional wellbeing.

I have little or no truck with the fantastical 'science' that is frequently floated by TRAs.

I also think there is quite widespread misunderstanding about how mental health professionals deal with gender identity issues. We are not required to deny basic biological facts and to buy in to any nonsense about lady brains, lady dicks, wrong bodies etc. I don't think it is something we battle with. The psychologists who are gatekeeper for referrals to endocrinologists etc. do come under a lot of pressure but this is in the form of patients kicking against (and manipulating against) the watchful waiting stance that all that I talk to advocate.

As a result, it appears that most posters come down very squarely on one side or the other of a debate, although I suspect that's because they have a specific view in relation to whatever the issue being discussed, as opposed to their all being completely 'black and white' in their thinking.

I have spent a lot of time trying to find some kind of middle ground. there is none. Give an inch, a mile is taken.

I have watched opinions on here over the past couple of yerars go from 'lets find compromise' to 'there is no compromise, fuck'. Which is probably why many of the views seem black and white, as they have to be,

I have a transsexual family member, which complicates things a bit more for me, but luckily they are also gender critical so I get none of the ranty 'female penis' rubbish from the, They accept they are male, though do like female pronouns, but won't demand them.

Things worked fine for people like her, until the rabid transactivists took over. They have ruined it all, for genuine transsexual people, and its a shame but I am not willing to compromise womens rights in the way thats being demanded. And it is impossible to find any common ground when one side is just screaming that women are not a real thing and male people are actually female