Woman's Place UK meeting in London, 27 Feb

[PlonitbatPlonit]

Just announced on their twitter and Facebook, Woman's Place UK are doing a meeting in London. If it's anything like the Bristol event it will sell out....

www.eventbrite.co.uk/e/a-womans-place-is-making-a-stand-tickets-42865237078

Wow this sounds brilliant.
I am so happy the lib dem woman was there. Might start getting more involved now to try to influence their policy

It was a really uplifting evening.
People who dismiss concerns should hear the range of people and experiences, beginning with the woman who talked about her detransitioning and the growing influence of transideology in making many lesbians feel they are in the wrong body.
We are in danger of sleepwalking in to the loss of sex-based exemptions because, as the fab Scottish woman from @object! said, women are too nice and too accepting. Lucy Masoud fought hard for women’s spaces in the Firebrigade and said bosses are watching this debate playout and will jump on the chance to save money, tick the right-on box and just make everything gender-neutral.
It's clear that if the WEP/Labour/Greens can't define what a woman is, then we just have to hope Tories see enough political mileage to backtrack, as per recent comments from Justine Greening/Amber Rudd – consultation begins in March, I thought I understood?
It was great to have transwomen Debbie Hayton and Kristina Harrison say that they were with women on this, as well as MirandafuckingYardley, so people can stop thinking that all transpeeps are down with the aggressive translobby too.

So pleased to meet up before. It was like a “Mrs Brown goes to town and buys…” game of everyone’s MN name – I think I can do Empress/Beupstanding/LifelongVagina/Pencils/Datun/Erishka/Goodenough/Sweet grapes/Huloo/I seetrouble/Archery/Noraclavicle, someone with a TS Elliott poem user name - also spoke to the lovely Astraia (terfragette) on the tube.
Sad I can’t make the March 14th one at Millwall, but would like to meet up again.

A variety of women were there too... really old to the really young, walking sticks and wheelchair (in that weather!!) , conforming, non conforming, BAME.... a good mix. And I am guessing that for everyone who made it, there are another 5 who couldn't and a lot more women lurking, reading ...

Really great to see and hear so many strong women all in one place!!!

I would loved to have been there. What's next though? The meetings are a great idea, but does anyone know what future plans are? I would like to take part in a march on this, and take part in further action but can't see where it's heading.

There's the Million Women Rise march through London on March 10.

People who know tell me that unlike the Women's Marches, this one really is about women & girls.

I came away a bit conflicted about the evening. Very much enjoyed the speakers and thought they spoke very eloquently. Particularly Pilgrim Tucker talking about how this issue is motivating people who have never been politically active before. Then it kind of got a bit exclusive, i felt. Lots of talks about being socialists, trade unionists etc and nothing for people who aren’t left of centre. I thought both the Liberal Democrat woman and Sophie Walker were brave to stand up and highlight their lack of leftist credentials.

It’s such an important issue that crosses all party boundaries. I brought it up at a conservative women’s meeting last week and had people talk to me privately afterwards that they were grateful I had. Everyone is cross about it and we need to include people from all political persuasions.

I also thought that at the end there could have been some suggestions of what we, as individuals can do. I think WPUK can do a lot of good as a pressure group and it could have been suggested at the end that people might do X or Y, particularly to people new to this who feel a bit helpless.

Knowing what comes next and what we could do en masse make a greater point, or knowing when the next meeting might be in London might have helped.

I do agree Sweary (though I wasn't there last night). I'm centre-left personally, but this is an issue that transcends party allegiances. It's important that we don't alienate Conservative women - especially as the Tory party is currently the only one appearing to have a re-think on self-ID. It would be self-defeating to turn the battle against self-ID into a left-wing one, as that would make the Tories less likely to support it.

Why don't you email WPUK and mention your views? They keep asking for feedback.

Oh I so wish I had been able to go. It sounds like an amazing event. Although I’m a gobshite on here I think I would have sat in the corner like an awestruck teenager, with all these amazing women around me. 😁

Reading this has given me some hope in this bloody twilight zone. Women are so much stronger than the TRA believe. We’ve had to be, in order to survive the crap that misogynist men and indeed women, have thrown at us since we were born.

One of the most or rather only, positive things about the push for self ID is that women are shaking off the ‘shame’ of being feminists. We no longer care if we’re called man haters, ugly, bitter, etc. We know those are insults used to keep us in our ‘place’, while men are simultaneously trying to claim our spaces. I am a REAL feminist and I will continue to centre women. Thank you to all the amazing, strong, articulate women on here, I’m not just happy to tell people I am a feminist, but proud.

What a wonderful night! Thank you BeUpStanding for organising the pombear rendezvous.

There were suggestions for what to do - Scottish consultation (urgent), write to Women's Aid, but mostly just keep spreading the word among ordinary women who are not in the political bubble.

Can't stop looking at Miranda's tweet and giggling

Also get transgender trend's schools pack out to your DC's schools.

Pencils I am just about to look up what transgender trend is. I've been asked to sign a complaint about a letter they wrote being published in a professional journal, yet the person asking me to sign is so far refusing to show me their letter or the response published by the journal.

He is implying they are some kind of crackpot hate group, yet I found his refusal to share the actual letters more concerning.

In even more upset I couldn't make it after reading this. Very interesting about Sophie Walker. I think Catherine Mayer has driven their policy on his personally (and having met her and found her very rude I'd imagine she's hard to influence). Interested to see if anything shifts.

I have found the letter he is asking people to complain about, and can't see anything wrong with it.

Transgender Trend actually seem to be asking that other options are considered before we rush to dramatically alter children's bodies.

I won't be signing.

I should have said before, the person who asked me is a FtoM trans person, so they obviously have a personal interest in preventing Transgender Trend from discussing the issue.

That’s shocking Hygge. I wonder how many people have signed it without reading the letter? He sounds like an Orwellian character. You will believe it because he says it and you’re not permitted to know your own mind. When you get a copy, take it to him and ask him to explain his issues with it. I wonder if he has actually read the letter himself, or is he just jumping on the transwagon.

Xpost. Hygge Maybe she has some doubts about her transition and the letter is bringing those home. Sounds like sticking her fingers in her ears and going “lalalala I can’t hear you”. I would definitely take it to her and ask her to clarify what is wrong with the letter. It might help if you look genuinely confused and concerned. 😉

Anyone know who the Lib Dem woman was?

Hygge - there seems to be a lot of knee jerk reaction from people who probably haven't even read it.

I was there too but didn’t get to meet fellow mumsnetters.
Overall it was very inspiring to hear the speakers, all 3 were very impressive, balanced, fair and eloquent.
I felt uncomfortable with some of the comments from the floor and felt more strident moderation was required. In particular the standoff / argument between Heather and Sophie was inappropriate and they should have taken it outside(so to speak) when it became apparent it wasn’t just a short statement in response that Heather wanted to deliver. I felt sad that as women this demonstrated a lack of solidarity and we were all in a room witnessing two women at odds with each other.
I also didn’t like the heckling from upstairs when some transwomen spoke. That is not who I am.
And finally, the protesters outside were sad and pathetic and very young, and I felt all attendees should have walked away instead of shouting back at them which is what happened as I was leaving. But that’s just me, I like to take a moral high ground where I can!
Everything else about the evening was fabulous and I have a lot of respect for all the speakers and contributors.

I believe he has read the letter.

It's worrying because I know at least one other person has signed the letter just based on his comments about it.

This is a professional body with a professional journal.

Transgender Trend say that the article published had no recognition that young people who say they are trans may not be 100% certain, and that other options need to be explored before we medically alter their bodies for good.

I agree with Transgender Trend on this, it's such a big issue to change someone's body that we have to know they are certain before we commit to it. It's not something that should be rushed into.

I can see why it might have raised personal feelings for him, but we're in a profession that has to set personal feelings aside. We need to be able to explore other options, or we become like the pregnancy advice clinics who are really a cover for anti-choice organisations. We're forcing our agenda on people who need to explore their own options.

I'll be writing my own letter in support of Transgender Trend for pointing this out.

That's what is bothering me about a lot of the advisory groups on this. So many seem to have a transgendered advisor whose word counts for more than that of others in the group. I think people's innate tendency not to want to offend a colleague comes into it.

Where I work, all reports need to have a 'conflict of interests' statement attached. Currently this means financial interests, but I think something similar might be needed for personal interests at stake too.

I enjoyed it so much - was lovely to meet MNers I hadn't yet met as well as see again ones I had - though I missed plenty, too.

Lucy Masoud from the FBU was the standout speaker for me - although I loved (almost) everyone.

I think we now need business cards made with Datun's message on them, to give out to politicians: "Shit or get off the pot. Yours sincerely, Mumsnetters."

There was disagreement in the meeting! And that's OK! We can't be expected to agree on everything - that's what the other lot want, unquestioning obedience on everything. (I am reminded of something a friend said about Greenham: "ten women around the fire = fifteen different opinions on everything". And that's a plus, not a minus!)

I think I'm going to start a thread about Sophie Walker - I was really impressed with her courage in coming to the meeting, but less impressed by what she actually had to say.

Where I work, all reports need to have a 'conflict of interests' statement attached.

That isn't an excellent idea.

Making it a blanket policy means no-one can say they are singled out.

And having the policy in place at all will automatically raise the issue. It will have to be addressed. No choice.

Datun

Did you really say 'shit or get off the pot' to Sophie Walker?

Fucking awesome.

Can you tell us the full context of what what you said

I hope those protesters had their warm vests on

Loving reading about the meeting. Well done Datun. Sounds like you're as articulate as a public speaker as you are on paper. You should do some telly interviews etc.