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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Tamsin sutherland

406 replies

iamawoman · 04/02/2018 20:00

countrysquire.co.uk/2017/10/28/transinister/

Interesting and thoughtful article

OP posts:
infamousT · 06/02/2018 18:32

Feel free to write me off.

It bothers me not. I've taken a pretty lonely stand here, and have been written off by many others.

I'll just say this: if someone had told you 5 years ago that we would all be here now even discussing transgender issues in this way - what would you have said to THEM at the time.

EXACTLY the same as you are saying to me now.

Guaranteed.

Weezol · 06/02/2018 18:34

So, I've just had to blow my nose and I have had a little cry. I have felt under siege for so, so long and it finally got a bit overwhelming.

infamousT. Thanks for being a proper ally to women. There are a few out trans women posting on the feminist boards with serious concerns about self id. I have a friend who transitioned nearly 20 years ago and she's been called Truscum and suchlike by TRAs. And she's a traitor, because I'm a Terf. Or a unicorn or something.

Don't get me started on Owen fucking Jones and Bromentum. Outing myself a bit here, but I live in the city where the Labour Party was founded. And that little runt brought his circus up for a day out prole baiting last year to tell us we're doing politics all wrong. I try really hard not advocate violence but sometimes...

infamousT · 06/02/2018 18:39

Weezol

Indeed. Owen and the Momentum types are, to me at least, a clear and present danger to the UK.

If women are happy to be represented by Madigan, well - really; more fool them.

As an aside, and just to ram the message home, Google the following phrase:

'Women killed in 2017'

Enjoy.

JoeStrummersBullshitDetector · 06/02/2018 18:40

Oh well...I'll throw my hat in, T.

I agree with you, but would take it a step further.

Its war on everything good, right, moral, and in the spirit of my enemy's enemy, there are some unholy bedfellows.

T, people are too safe in their bubbles to follow the money and interest and I fear for you. I hope you find the strength to keep speaking Truth.

Stay safe.

derxa · 06/02/2018 18:44

I support you Tamsin and hope you will be OK. I feel frightened for the future of young children today. The Emperor is wearing no clothes and we're all afraid to say it. Yes those brave women and girls protesting against the hijab in Iran and here a head teacher cannot ban the hijab for under 8s in her school.

GuardianLions · 06/02/2018 18:51

This has led to a form of societal 'Omerta'. I'd wager that there are millions of guys out there that dare not say a word, as they are essentially being blackmailed - and fear being 'outed'.

I definitely get the sense of this being true. For example that QC who supported the labour AWS crowdfunder publicly, then did a 180 within a few hours, apologising, stating he'd got a refund for his donation and given the money to a trans charity instead.

It was so dramatic and extreme it was quite chilling, I'm sure I wasn't the only wondered - what have they got on him?

SleepFreeZone · 06/02/2018 18:52

I support you too as it goes. I think you will struggle here simply because you are not left leaning. I think the feminist labour voters are struggling at the moment with wanting to keep left but being horrified at their rights being eroded in front of their eyes.

Weezol · 06/02/2018 18:54

A lot of us on the feminist boards speak of feeling politically homeless at the moment.

Year of The Woman my arse.

GuardianLions · 06/02/2018 18:56

I've taken a pretty lonely stand here, and have been written off by many others

I always trust people like you the most.

People who don't compromise for popularity and group inclusion.

frogsoup · 06/02/2018 19:07

I'm left leaning, but no momentum fan. Authoritarianism and left-wing movements have an unhappy history. But please trust me on this, if the anti-trans cause becomes associated with the kind of stuff that is being mentioned here, namely rapist immigrants and Islamist/Jewish conspiracy theories (quite how Soros and wahhabists fit together in this worldview is an open question!!!), then We Are Stuffed. As a result of this thread, I no longer feel able to tell friends who need persuading to come on over here and read what we have to say, because it is total tin-hat territory, with a side of far-right anti-immigrant rhetoric. Truly, it's not a good look. Its like whoever cited an article on Breitbeit - be aware of how badly this comes across.

LangCleg · 06/02/2018 19:12

I don't agree with T about Islam.

But I do think T has a point about postmodernism/social constructionism. These have now completely monopolised liberal arts and social science thinking in Western academia. And now, they are seeping into our politics and our culture-directing media. I do wonder if this mission creep can be reversed and if we are seeing the end of the Enlightenment thinking and values that have defined the West.

At the same time, there is the rise of China and we can be pretty sure that in a generation or so's time, China will be the world superpower with its New Silk Road and Eurasian trade bloc and Europe and North America will be the second level players.

Perhaps we're all just seeing the end of one epoch of human civilisation and the beginning of another. Perhaps the pomo nonsense of trans is just one symptom of that.

There. That's optimism for you!

(Goes off for a stiff drink.)

Datun · 06/02/2018 19:13

infamousT

So what can we do? What's the plan?

infamousT · 06/02/2018 19:16

SleepFreeZone you nailed it. I've personally never voted anything other than Labour all my life.

Never again as it stands.

derxa exactly! It makes absolutely NO sense whatsoever!

JoeStrummersBullshitDetector Thanks darling - it chills me to the bone... there is something very big, very dark and extremely... what? 'Evil' going on right now.

70,000 years of Human history is being overturned - and they now have the power to do it in 3 generations.

GuardianLions there is some deeply creepy stuff going on, and people doing an about face all over the place.

Thank you all for your support.

I know I am probably under threat, but have made it plain to all those watching me that I have all my sensitive material held on a secure server, and a plan to have it released to the alt-media if anything happens to me.

We collectively now navigate extremely dark waters indeed.

As I say - I take no pleasure in any of this. Frankly, it scares the bejebus outta me.

I could have had quite a different life if only I'd blithely swallowed the Kool Aid and started spouting the propaganda.

As it is, I'm blacklisted from working in my chosen field, (one that I have a good track record in), and live on pot noodles and boiled eggs.

Only a moron would choose to live like this... but here's the thing - I sleep well at night. My moral compass is still finely tuned, and I shall (to use the social justice nonsense term) 'speak truth to power'.

Even if it eventually gets me killed.

I'm not asking anyone to believe me, just to go read some serious
stuff and draw your own conclusions.

If you come up with something different, let me know - I am desperate to be wrong about all of this. For all our sake's.

GuardianLions · 06/02/2018 19:20

be aware of how badly this comes across.

I'm not a fan of 'I hate this thread I'm off' flouncing.

Its not like everyone is saying that infamousT is a guru and we are all lapping it up. There are different opinions in the thread, but it is interesting to have Ts take on things. I am enjoying the meta conversation. I really can't be arsed with having certain discussions out of bounds because of the way it might look.

Your (frog & hairyball) skittishness is a bit unnerving.

varvara · 06/02/2018 19:37

I don’t agree with everything T says but this is one of the most interesting threads I’ve read on here (and I’m permanently lurking). It’s always really refreshing to read a different take on things.

It’s war on everything good, right, moral

Agree with this, and also

there is something very big, very dark and extremely... what? ‘Evil’ going on right now.

Scary times indeed.

T, I hope you keep posting. Stay safe.

athingthateveryoneneeds · 06/02/2018 19:40

Keep talking, T. I'm happy to have discussions like this, though I'm not very knowledgeable and don't know how to parse truth from fiction apart from obvious stuff.

DarthArts · 06/02/2018 19:46

I don't agree with everything you say @infamousT but you have got me thinking.

Isn't that what discussion and forums such as this is all about?

Equally isn't this what the TRA lobby are trying stifle.......

Weezol · 06/02/2018 19:51

I do often wonder if the whole TRA/Bromentum thing is a 'look over there' to try to distract us from the big stuff.

Luckily I have room in my head for lots of things, even though I still have to think really hard to tell my left from my right.

infamousT · 06/02/2018 19:56

I have absolutely nothing against Muslims - but in a so-called Western Democracy, we now essentially run a dual state with complete exemptions for Islam. The figures are out there to see if you go digging. I'm not an alarmist - but I lived in Luton opposite the mosque for a while in '98, moved to Finsbury Park at the height of Abu Hamza and found myself, once - quite frighteningly - in a self proclaimed 'Sharia Zone' in East London after dark in 2011 and was lucky to suffer nothing more than being spat on.

I've had a fair few Muslim mates over the years. Quite a few that like a sly drink and a smoke, and know the score.

As far as Jewish conspiracy theories are concerned - I'm simply not interested. I myself have mixed race heritage going back, (my G-G Grandfather was a black man from Montserrat that became the Captain of a clipper ship who met, fell in love with and subsequently married a Welsh girl at the end of the 19th Century - I have seen his Ship's Log). I have no axe to grind with anyone politically or religiously that hasn't explicitly stated that it would want to kill me.

I simply follow the money - and being a failed megalomaniac, I have an insight as to how these people think of us - and yeah; to them, we ARE all 'sheeple'.

I have no axe to grind with homosexuals nor, indeed transgenderists - this is a matter of poltics and I can recognise a power grab when I see one. The vast, vast majority of people have no idea how easily played they are - I worked in sales, marketing and advertising, and what we are seeing is like Derren Brown on steroids and LSD

I am though, extremely worried about the future. And I'm not naive enough to think that behind closed doors ate Davos and Bilderberg that it's all pleasant chat over a cup of tea - I recognise a steering group when I see one.

I also understand that MOST of our politicians, now are merely shills, and anti-democratic at that - the furore and hysterical propagandising that have greeted Trump and Brexit are all the proof that I need to show that both these DEMOCRATIC VOTES go against the globalist plan, and they are frenziedly trying to both overturn them both at the same time as sowing the seeds of class war, race war, civil war and every other kind of war right up to nuclear - why? They simply don't care if billions die - in fact, that would suit them right down to the ground.... which segues neatly into tech - the robots are coming and the 4th Industrial revolution is taking shape - once Blockchain technology is applied to politics - it's game over for all of them. There will be NO hiding place left, and Cryptocurrency shall reinvent Capitalism in a new, decentralised and far more egalitarian way. This, they want to stop at all costs.

So, no - I'm not a tin foil hatter. I'm intelligent, experienced and i ask awkward questions, and I have been shut down, no-platformed, and hounded to the point of being Doxxed and having human faeces hand delivered - so heck.... I actually live in fear - as I know the police are NOT on my side having been thoroughly infiltrated by Common Purpose Cultural Marxists.

The overt targeting and gleeful ruination of the lives and livelihoods of Christians by fascistic LGBT agitators leaves me cold, and the antics of Corbynite Antifa thugs utterly frozen.

I'm sorry if I ask awkward questions and arrive at terrifying conclusions.

The arrowhead in all of this is trans rights. Push back. Write continuously to your MPs and halt self ID in it's tracks.

THAT is the big bad gateway that everyone should, frankly, fear.

It's a flood gate - and once opened, it shall never be shut, and we can kiss our Western Democracy goodbye.

I'm no pearl clutcher, nor a slppery-sloper... I use to get paid 350 quid a day for thinking up NLP advertising straplines and predicting tech trends - and I have spoken candidly with MPs in the past - whist I still had a reputation.

Just think long and hard and go look for yourselves. Draw your own conclusions and avoid the Kool Aid.

frogsoup · 06/02/2018 20:00

Guardian actually I do think a lot of people on this thread are lapping it up, and I find that unnerving. And I was trying to sound a note of caution to how this all sounds. Fine if you want to turn discussion into an echo chamber, but if you want to win the fight, you have to take the argument to people beyond your little circle, and try not to put them off by associating with tin hatters. The Left as a rule still struggle hugely with this concept. Corby getting paid to appear on Iranian TV, for instance...

infamousT · 06/02/2018 20:03

Nailed it DarthArts

If it has 'phobia' attached and seeks to stifle free speech, it's fascism, pure and simple.

Do NOT trust mainstream media for analysis. It's lies.

infamousT · 06/02/2018 20:12

frogsoup you seem determined to cast me as a conspiracy theorist and unhinged loon.

Who is paying you? Momentum?

I don't live in an echo chamber - I was invited here to expound on my thoughts and views. Which I have done - you are welcome to take them or leave them, or refute them.

Straw men and character assassination are something I am well used to.

Happy shilling. I hope they pay you well. We all know who too...

GuardianLions · 06/02/2018 20:13

Fine if you want to turn discussion into an echo chamber

Isn't flouncing out more likely to turn it into an echo chamber?

Your view is welcome and important.

But I think you are reading the 'lapping it up' between the lines a bit. T has an interesting take on things and a way with words. But we are free to ponder and reach our own conclusions.

frogsoup · 06/02/2018 20:28

Seriously, paid by momentum? Confused I am not listening to what you SAY you are, I am listening to what you are saying and drawing my own conclusions. You are talking about grand schemes to Islamise Europe and accusing immigrants of being rapists. That certainly sounds like a conspiracy theory to me. Whether that makes you a 'conspiracy theorist' or not I don't frankly care. Likewise, you can say you aren't racist all you like, but if you accuse immigrants of being rapists, then you will come across as a hard right nutter.

If I thought you were a little tin-hatted before, I do even more so now you've accused me of being paid by momentum!!!!! Honestly, that just confirms to me that you see conspiracy everywhere. I can't stand Corbyn and I've never been to a party political meeting in my life. I just want this to be a fight we win, and with friends like you, we really don't need enemies.

frogsoup · 06/02/2018 20:31

Ok you are right Guardian I shouldn't have flounced. But having now been accused of being in the pay of momentum by someone I think holds some deeply dangerous views, I'll admit to being quite shaken up, so if you don't mind I'm going to try to get back to work and forget this thread for a bit.

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