Finally joined twitter

[Nobrain]

Morning all I've finally got my arse in gear and joined Twitter. Ive followed some of the obvious people (drradfem, a womans place etc) just wondering if anyone can recommend anyone else? I don't really understand Twitter! Do I need to follow the TRAs to see what they're saying or will things like that just appear in my feed?

Sorry for all the questions

And fwiw, most of the people doing it with regard to the trans issues are the very people who thought they were above Leavers and had the evidence to vote to remain and this was the rational, evidence based choice.

And yet when it comes to the trans issue, evidence and science have gone right out the window as having value.

These are the people who we are lead to believe are more educated and think science etc is more important.

But when it comes down to it, they too have abandoned anything presented to them which they disagree with, because ideological belief and a 'feeling' is more important.

Which goes to prove that anyone and everyone does this to a certain extent.

Rational and evidence just isn't necessarily important, if there is enough social consensus to throw it out the window.

Anyone who thinks they are immune to it, is a liar.

Battle, that was never my point.

It is, and remain, that people will believe what they want to believe. It does not matter one jot how much you show them to the contrary if that belief is that strongly held.

I think saying that people will eventually see sense because they aren't that stupid, might well be false hope for that reason.

People are stupid. Because they are people. Not because they are less intelligent or less educated or because they come from a particular background. They are stupid because they are human.

most of the people doing it with regard to the trans issues are the very people who thought they were above Leavers

They are, yes. I do find the middle class left to be entirely incapable of self-reflection. And that's why I think there is a Brexit analogy. These people still haven't reflected on that referendum and why they lost it. At some point, this trans bullshit is going to hit the same wall of real people with real lives, who are outside pomo academia and the liberal Twitter bubble. And it's going to crash and burn in some very unpleasant ways.

This seems to have moved on/derailed a bit

but I came on to concur with the Cat Reviewer. There's a dog equivalent –We Review Dogs or similar (on phone and can't easily search for actual handles).

Samuel West, actor, is a lovely follow: tweets about 'normal' everyday things, not just plugs for his work. Among many and varied interests, he's a birdwatcher and language enthusiast. He's a delight.

Satisfying Videos is worth a look.

Author Marian Keyes is a HOOT.

Man Who Has It All is good.

Well people are biased, certainly. That isn't the same as "stupid" (unless they actually are).

People are stupid. Because they are people. Not because they are less intelligent or less educated or because they come from a particular background.

But were all those Leave voters actually stupid? Because it seems to me that they accurately diagnosed their lives as worse than they had been and they accurately recognised that nobody was proposing to ameliorate this within the status quo.

Feminists aren't stupid either.

I agree entirely with you Lang

Stupid is a matter of perspective as you point out. Its about where you are centred in your experience of life. Its about what you value and what makes a difference to your life.

If you think your life will get better or the world will get better, because of x, y or z then what is the incentive to challenge that view if your current situation is one you are unhappy with?

By the same token, what would it taken to get people who really believe in Trans Right Activism to change their mind?

Is it even possible?

Personal experience? When it's too late

I think I see it from the point of view of my mother.

She's sold hook line and sinker on it.

It stops her from thinking about the alternative, and whether my sibling might not be the way they are. And whether she had any role in that. There is no incentive to disbelieve. Her child isn't a criminal. They won't harm anyone. Opening up the debate about men exploiting the system, only serves to stoke fears about her child by extension and put them in danger.

How do I break through that? It doesn't matter what I put to her, she will only ever see it through the prism of her immediate experience.

I agree with everything LangCleg said (I usually do).

It absolutely beggars belief that people are unable to see the connection between Gordon Brown calling that woman a bigot and Brexit. It is even more astounding that they can't draw parallels with this situation.

Twitter enrages me, I just want to yell 'are you on glue' at people and stab them with my knitting needles (I don't)

How do I break through that?

I do think it's true that people vote on the basis of emotion or instinct as much, if not more than, they do on facts. But there are also material realities underlying those emotions and instincts. You'll never win against emotion with a barrage of facts. You have to try to understand the material realities that are provoking those emotions and come up with positive solutions that will improve the reality and therefore lessen the anger borne from insecurity.

And what you don't do, in the case of Brexit is shout RACIST! BE GRATEFUL FOR THAT EU MONEY THAT PAID FOR THE ZERO HOURS CONTRACT WAREHOUSE IN YOUR TOWN. YOUR OLD JOB IN THE STEEL WORKS THAT PAID DECENT MONEY DOESN'T MATTER. YOU IGNORANT RACIST!

And what you don't do, in the case of feminists and transactivism is shout BIGOT! TRANSWOMEN ARE WOMEN! GIVE ME YOUR LABOUR PARTY MEMBERSHIP NUMBER SO I CAN DOXX YOU ON A SECRET SPREADSHEET, YOU UGLY UNFUCKABLE IGNORANT BIGOT DINOSAUR!

RedToothBrush I agree with you.

LangCleg it seems to be working pretty well for them right now.

I have set up an annonymous twitter account myself to follow this stuff. Andy Lewis a UK-based skeptic has tweeted on this issue a few times, and had quite a few posts on the issue recently. He has over 10,000 followers. Many of these would be following him due to his work in critiquing false claims e.g. in medicine.

His account:
twitter.com/lecanardnoir

He criticises the lack of skeptical or critical thought on the trans issue, particularly in relation to children, and he criticises the use of the word terf:

"TERF is an unhelpful label here as it is used to silence and ‘other’. Sceptical thought should be more open and precise in its criticism"

"If you set up a Twitter search column you will see the term used almost exclusively to harass, demonise, silence and threaten violence. it is not a useful term and should not be used by thinking people."

twitter.com/lecanardnoir/status/957562421413056512

twitter.com/lecanardnoir/status/957562626300628992

Waves to Andy if you are reading this (he mentions Mumsnet in one of the posts)

Yeah, it looks like Andy gets it.