The "Transwomen are women" thing

[Battleax]

Bear with me for a moment.

( @Ekphrasis said something interesting on another thread about what closes ears to what we're saying and I've been thinking about closed ears more generally.)

Would it work better to sidestep the whole "Transwomen are women" mantra instead of taking it on?

Just talk about "natal women" having different needs to "transwomen". Every single time.

Because I think "no they're not" stops the brainwashed from listening.

(That was to deadly.)

I was unable to get a proper handle on what was going on. When I discovered bold, unapologetic radical feminist analyses of gender identity politics, it was like diving into a cool clean pool after wading through sludge. It was a feeling of sheer relief, that someone was finally making sense here. It was a relief to abandon the double-think that men could be 'women', and the guilty feeling that I was a bad, mean woman for doubting it.

Or a bad liberal.

I had my first ‘Hang on!’ moment when the Dolezal story broke just after the Jenner transition; I couldn’t understand why they were treated differently, especially when sex is clear cut and ethnicity not so much.

It took me until late 2017 to find and absorb the radfem take (prompted by some nonsense in my workplace) but, should the need arise, I now feel empowered to disagree with the ideology and don’t give a flying fuck if I get called names.

Thanks, MN

(I’m having to work through some feelings about being set up for the gaslighting by the well meaning leftie liberalism I was raised with, but that’s for another time.)

In all discussions, I'm getting "but think of what transwomen go through!" with a quizzical response when I start talking about self-ID. It's not uncommon to get self-ID on the table and within a few minutes you're back hearing about these incredibly brave transwomen who go through so much.

Some people actively filter self-ID out even when told about it. I get the impression they'd prefer not to blank awareness of this because it makes the issue too difficult to think about.

and don’t give a flying fuck if I get called names.

Why does everybody keep focusing on that as though that's the ultimate risk?

I’m having to work through some feelings about being set up for the gaslighting by the well meaning leftie liberalism I was raised with, but that’s for another time.)

At least the Giardian have redisigned again. That blue masthead was triggering me

Redesigned^

they'd prefer not to blank awareness

A lot of people just fall back on a vague "it's nice to be nice" type feeling and don't want to engage with any of the facts at all, I suspect.

After all, it all appears utterly shouty and quite bonkers, even from a distance.

It is 'nice to be nice' and everyone wants to 'live and let live'. When it comes to laws, you have to define what you mean accurately and that sometimes does not sound 'nice' and is in no way fluffy and hearty, and not always the words that people want to hear.

And when it comes to making laws, you think that the government has your back, will look through things objectively, and make sure that it fits in with all the other laws they have made.

Only they don't seem to have done that with the laws in place, and it looks as if they were trying to be too 'nicey, nicey make everyone happy' with the changes that they have been proposing and have taken their thinking heads off altogether.

No one would have to go round trying to define 'woman' if they had thought about it when putting together the various bits of legislation. They just seem to have assumed that everyone knows....................and left gaps for those who have their own ideas.

Why does everybody keep focusing on that as though that's the ultimate risk?

Oh, come on. In some workplaces, people fear for their jobs once ‘transphobic’ starts getting chucked around.

I’ve been doing some research on Trans support groups, the very first one I looked at > be-north.org , say that they want to get rid of single sex exemptions in the Equality act. They say it’s unfair. Everything I look at just makes me more and more angry.

Oh, come on. In some workplaces, people fear for their jobs once ‘transphobic’ starts getting chucked around.

Oh I see. I was thinking about contexts where in depth discussions might take place. Mainly online, I suppose.

It's interesting that the Scottish consultation (as far as I remember) talks about retaining religious exemptions where a GRC wouldn't "count" but says nothing about sex based exemptions.

How would that work? Are they going to have seperate loos etc. for Muslim women?

Sky-fairy-belief-related exemptions? Of course that can be accommodated.

Sex-based exemptions partly on basis of statistical risks to safety of women and girls? Hurts people’s feels.

Are they going to have seperate loos etc. for Muslim women?

As far as I can remember it's exclusion from being a priest / rabbi / imam type of thing.

But there could potentially be a Muslim/ Jewish /whatever woman in any Female space at any time, they can’t think they can seperate religious and non religious Women , it’s bonkers !

Sorry - having a slow moment. It takes a while for me to follow.

Can someone explain what the sec based exemptions are please? With examples?

Ta.

fairplayforwomen.com/equality-act-2010_womens-rights

sisterhoodispowerful.wordpress.com/2016/06/17/a-uk-guide-for-non-lawyers-about-protecting-women-only-spaces-june-2016/amp/?__twitter_impression=true