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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

James O'Brien: what a twat

385 replies

SelmaAndJubjub · 14/11/2017 20:39

Explained in this link. Basically, he bullied and shut down a female caller who said she'd be frightened to share a changing room with men. He didn't just take an opposing view - he ridiculed her.

Yet another liberal bro reveals himself as a misogynist. And a stupid one. Even if he doesn't care about women in general, he has 2 pre-teen daughters. Will he really want them changing and showering with men?

OP posts:
Miffer · 15/11/2017 23:54

Shoes

I suppose its how you define danger. I did consider of rewording it to be clearer but I couldn't be arsed as the point remains. As far as I am aware it's not a case of accepting anything more of a statistical fact. I am not invested enough in this to actually look up the stats and am happy to be proved wrong.

Miffer · 15/11/2017 23:56

Ok, going along with the argument that I'm an MRA, why might that be? I mean feminists are such a lovely bunch, right?

That is the problem with MRA all over. It sees itself as opposed to feminism. I mean what the fuck? I thought it was about mens rights?

I know I shouldn't feed it but I really don't want to go to bed.

ShoesHaveSouls · 15/11/2017 23:57

Keep going Ruth - it's fun. Its my bedtime now, but I'll see your MRA arse in the morning.

Are you in the UK? Most we have here are US based bots (Miffler, I use bot as the now accepted term of someone spreading misinformation - as Ruth has gloriously proved). Ruth - Now you've admitted it (not that you needed to). Shall I call you Paul...? Grin

ShoesHaveSouls · 15/11/2017 23:58

*Sorry that was rude of me. Of course you're not Paul. Just a wannabe.

Miffer · 15/11/2017 23:59

I use bot as the now accepted term of someone spreading misinformation

That used to be a troll. Although troll now seems to mean "somebody posting something I don't agree with/being mean".

Makes me feel like an internet fogey.

Miffer · 16/11/2017 00:03

If MRAs actually gave a shit about men they should be out campaigning to bring about tougher health and safety regulation at work. Of course they are not interested in that because they don't give a shit about men.

DixieFlatline · 16/11/2017 02:55

I’ve been coming back to the thread every now and then for a while now, wondering if there was some new policy I didn’t know about that was making everyone pretend to buy that Ruth was a) a woman and b) genuine, despite him giving himself away more or less from the start. Glad it turns out not to be compulsory after all...

cuirderussie · 16/11/2017 05:29

Erin Pizzey's dog. Well that's just knocked my news stories this month of child marriage and lack of abortion provision which affects tens of millions of girls and women into a cocked hat.

Datun · 16/11/2017 07:57

ruth

I’m sure I recognise your style of writing. And this is very reminiscent of a derailed thread a while back.

Have you name changed?

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 16/11/2017 08:23

dixie

Im rubbish

I ignore or give the benefit of the doubt for ages, sometimes thinking 'i dont like you but i could be mistaken. then i post something quite innocuous but possibly sharper than i would usually be on here

Then i feel guilty and say something conciliatory in case ive made a mistake

And in real life i wouldn't hesitate to say something sharp and I rarely back down...on here im a wuss

PricklyBall · 16/11/2017 08:35

Datun, Ruth's already admitted to being a name-changer (when I called him/her out early in the thread over the fact that I'd done an AS on them, and they were only posting MRA shit on two threads in feminism). Ruth claimed to have done it for reasons of anonymity.

I've asked MNHQ to check whether they do in fact have a posting history under another name.

But yes, Erin Pizzey's dog. Obvious troll is... obvious.

BertrandRussell · 16/11/2017 08:38

"If MRAs actually gave a shit about men they should be out campaigning to bring about tougher health and safety regulation at work. Of course they are not interested in that because they don't give a shit about men."

And campaigning for more shelters for male victims of domestic violence, and better screening for male cancers, and a better work life balance so that more fathers are in a position to do 50:50 care and more awareness of men's mental health issues. But they can't do that because feminism.

FarFrom · 16/11/2017 08:46

One of the reasons it’s hard to put a different viewpoint on these threads (have debate/discussion) is that it seems to soften result in motives being assumed- be it mra, derailing, trolling, twisting, being a bot, being a man. It means that on the whole the threads are one note/ one opinion and anything that differs is treated with not only hostility but also paranoia.
I’m a feminist but find the tone on these threads/ assumptions about others including those with gid difficulties really unpleasant.

BertrandRussell · 16/11/2017 08:49

Sadly, I don't assume MRAs are men......

What would you like to say, FarFrom, that you feel you can't?

FarFrom · 16/11/2017 08:55

I’ve said plenty and been told to fuck off, I should be a chugger(!) and that I’m twisting. I’ve seen the assumptions about ruth’s motives and seen this happen frequently on different feminist threads.
I often see it said why should feminists help people with trans issues or men. For me this entirely misses the point of feminism. It is about equality for the sexes- caring about women’s rights and men’s rights. Not one over the other.

PricklyBall · 16/11/2017 09:10

Movements that are great at addressing men's issues: the men's shed movement (tackling loneliness and depression); mankind (male victims of DV); various charities like the Army Benevolent Fund, Help for Heroes (service veterans are both sexes, of course, but just as sexual violence is a gendered phenomenon with women more affected than men, so too is PTSD from combat as more men than women are put into combat situations).

Funnily enough none of these organisations describe themselves as "men's rights" movements. And funnily enough, I as a feminist have helped out fund raising for several of them.

PricklyBall · 16/11/2017 09:11

Should say, I don't do this as a feminist (though I am one), I do it as a human being. Feminism is about women, and I am a feminist, but that doesn't mean that feminism is the only thing I care about.

BertrandRussell · 16/11/2017 09:28

"I often see it said why should feminists help people with trans issues or men. For me this entirely misses the point of feminism. It is about equality for the sexes- caring about women’s rights and men’s rights. Not one over the other."

Ah. This is a fundamental misunderstanding of what feminism is. Feminists can, and do, "help people with trans issues or men". But not because they are feminists. Feminism is about the needs and rights of women- hence the name. Presumably you don't say to anti racism campaigners "But what are you doing for white people?" Or if someone is collecting for research into MS "But what about cystic fibrosis?"

Datun · 16/11/2017 09:33

For me this entirely misses the point of feminism. It is about equality for the sexes- caring about women’s rights and men’s rights.

No it isn’t. It’s about addressing the power imbalance between men and women.

Equality is the byproduct.

ThisisKellie · 16/11/2017 09:46

OP Thanks for highlighting this. He was a class A misogynist. I shouldn't have been surprised as he'd engaged his faux "soft compassionate" voice for the "beautiful trans kid" on his road just before I got put through.

I guess the misogyny bubbles just under the surface for these men....

Rufustherenegadereindeer1 · 16/11/2017 10:47

far

I did not say you should be a chugger

I said that your phrasing of your retort to cruids was the same as the techniques used by chuggers and i asked if you were one

I also said that you twisted her remark which you absolutely did

Timefortea99 · 16/11/2017 10:56

James O Brian is possibly the most snide presenter in the history of radio. I would rather watch a week's worth of Jeremy Viles than listen to 5 minutes of JOB. Whatever the subject matter he shuts down aggressively any opinion that does not chime with his. And now he is on Newsnight. Which gets turned off pronto.

BertrandRussell · 16/11/2017 11:19

Love this new meaning of "shutting down". When did it start meaning "not syncophanticaliy agreeing with"?

ThisisKellie · 16/11/2017 11:42

Actually what James does is mute people when he wants to speak.... pretty much "shutting down".

WhatWouldGenghisDo · 16/11/2017 11:45

Nobody ever seems to come on these threads and offer a genuine counter argument to anyone's feminist analysis. It's all complaints about the style and quality of the debate.

(e.g. Feminists here are spiteful, vitriolic, man bashing, lacking in empathy, shut down alternative viewpoints, don't adequately acknowledge exceptions, use terminology for themselves that is allegedly associated with whoever shot Erin pizzey's dog, etc etc ... and all this is given as a reason for not engaging with the content of what's being said)

And yet, discussions here seem to me to be conducted with much more courtesy all round than most internet-based discussion. Could it really be that posters don't like the content of what's being said but can't argue against it on its own merits because the points being made are reasonable and accurate?