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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Bloody hell - women only carriages AGAIN

60 replies

whoputthecatout · 23/08/2017 09:09

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41020179

And what would happen when a woman gets assaulted in a mixed carriage - why didn't you use the "ladies" carriage? The transport equivalent of wearing a short skirt and asking for it.

Let's restrict women rather than demand men act like decent human beings.

F off Labour MP

OP posts:
TheGirlOnTheLanding · 23/08/2017 09:12

Yep, I saw this yesterday and thought the same - surely the reasons why this is a shit idea were well rehearsed the first time?

Thelilywhite · 23/08/2017 09:28

Totally agree - its a terrible idea. It normalises male violence.

chickendrizzlecake · 23/08/2017 09:29

It does nothing, NOTHING to tackle the actual problem. Shame on anyone suggesting it.

FeedMeAndTellMeImPretty · 23/08/2017 09:35

It's a terrible idea, it basically makes all the other carriages men's ones and like a PP said, anyone who gets assaulted and isn't in the women's carriage will be questioned about why they were there.

However, it might at least have highlighted to those who don't believe it, that there is a problem with male violence that needs solving somehow.

I imagine it's probably a religious/cultural decision rather than anything to do with male violence actually. I don't know what the rules are about certain religions and mixing men/women, but I do think that being squished up against a man's armpit is probably frowned upon for women who are supposed to be segregated.

DamnDeDoubtanceIsSpartacus · 23/08/2017 09:38

@stellscreasy is tweeting against this.

QueenLaBeefah · 23/08/2017 09:58

Why can't they have one crappy carriage where all the men sit? Why is it even a suggestion that women remove themselves from society because men (NAMALT) can't behave themselves?

Let's address male violence. The world would be a far better place.

SpaghettiAndMeatballs · 23/08/2017 10:16

Why do I always have to hide from men - honestly, is no-one really thinking about this except us? Why not a fucking men's carriage, all the men who can't be trusted can go in there and leave the other carriages to those of us who can be trusted not to sexually assault girls on trains.

SpaghettiAndMeatballs · 23/08/2017 10:16

Ah, Queen - I see you already said it in a much less ranty way.

TheFaerieQueene · 23/08/2017 10:20

Can you imagine the uproar if you substituted women for black,Asian, Irish etc. Fucking unbelievable. Though in a world where trump is elected as POTUS I'm less and less surprised.

LottieDoubtie · 23/08/2017 10:25

And if you were a bloke who likes targetting vulnerable women wouldn't you be quite likely to look in a women's only carriage late at night when there's hardly anyone around?

Bloody stupid idea.

grasspigeons · 23/08/2017 10:31

I'd be in favour of a men only carriage. Only men accompanied by a female minder could go on the main train.

I've had a man masturbate in front of me blocking my exit
A man shout at my mum for 30 mins about old women on commuter trains and how they she probably hadn't even paid taxes and she should stand - whilst repeatedly stretching his leg so it kicked her.

A group of drunk football men literally sitting on me (8 month pregnant and using crutches and saying 'you could move love' so I ended up sat on the floor
A old man rubbing his erect penis against my summer shorts ( arse) on a very crowded train. I froze in fear so didn't react how I though I might.

In each situation I was no alone in the carriage and only one event was after dark.

In fact thinking on it, the only times I've really been subjected to this sort of thing is on trains.

NoLoveofMine · 23/08/2017 10:37

And if you were a bloke who likes targetting vulnerable women wouldn't you be quite likely to look in a women's only carriage late at night when there's hardly anyone around?

Very much so. I can imagine men such as those who assaulted a girl travelling on a train a couple of weeks ago in separate incidents (one assaulted her, she moved to avoid him and an unconnected man then assaulted her minutes later) would be put off going into a carriage as it's women only - quite the opposite. Also, who'd be stopping groups of men such as this www.getwestlondon.co.uk/news/west-london-news/woman-told-i-hope-you-13041666 going into such a carriage? I can imagine the leering and harassment such a carriage would result in being focussed specifically on that carriage as it is on women and girls travelling now.

Added to that as has been said any woman or girl not in the "women only carriage" were this implemented would be questioned and probably blamed for not avoiding assault. Again, this is an example of the reaction to male violence against women and girls being to suggest change for women not challenge the perpetrators and the attitudes which normalise this, meaning sexual assaults on public transport continue to rise.

Other than challenging these attitudes, more resources to track down perpetrators and men needing to challenge other men on this, I think the carriages on new Tubes in London are preferable - where you can walk all through the train rather than being confined to one small carriage. Crossrail trains will also be like this.

VestalVirgin · 23/08/2017 10:41

The men only carriage should work.

Somewhere - might be Saudi Arabia - they actually introduced this in shopping centres. Lone men are forbidden, only men who are accompanied by a woman are allowed. Of course, this is due to capitalism; single men used the centres to just stand around and not buy anything.

Of course, men can still be assholes if accompanied by women, but it would be worth a try.

DJBaggySmalls · 23/08/2017 10:44

Jess Phillips, Labour MP for Birmingham Yardley, said the policy was an "absolutely terrible idea".
She tweeted: "It is essentially giving up on trying to prosecute assaults. Also, men should be incredibly annoyed by [the] suggestion they can't control themselves.
"Sexual violence isn't about urges, it's about power. If you take your feminist cues from Saudi Arabia, you've gone wrong."

shivermytimbers · 23/08/2017 10:59

Would probably be a good idea to have trains with more space (No reason for 'accidentally' rubbing up against people) and more guards available to tackle situations and report problems to.
Can't see either of those things happening though as it's cheaper just to shove women into a crappy carriage so that criminally minded men can roam freely in the rest of the train Angry

DamsonGin · 23/08/2017 11:02

Stella Creasey's responded to him on twitter, with many of the same points, including why not consult on men only carriages too. Not that the assaulting arseholes would sit there. And why not just make trains safe spaces in their entirety, wouldn't that be a better goal?

Gileswithachainsaw · 23/08/2017 11:05

What a great idea. A buffet carriage for perverts Hmm

Dad's I hope you don't intend on taking your Dds anywhere....

I'll sit where I like thank you. Do something about the men who can't he trusted.

DamnDeDoubtanceIsSpartacus · 23/08/2017 11:07

I take it women only carriages would include anyone who identifies as a woman so they wouldn't be woman only carriages anyway.

grasspigeons · 23/08/2017 11:11

Indeed safe trains would be better all round. I am sure the majority of men are appalled by the stuff that goes on, and I am sure some men are victims of violence on trains too. I was being a bit facetious.

I'd have thought that cctv, guards would help and a bit of bravery to speak up by other passengers and consistent prosecutions.

NoLoveofMine · 23/08/2017 11:13

That's another point DamnDeDoubtance aside from all the other reasons why this is a ridiculous idea and no solution whatsoever to this - anyone would just have to "identify as a woman" to be legitimately allowed on such a carriage anyway and anyone challenging them would of course be a transphobic bigot.

dinahmorris · 23/08/2017 11:37

I agree with much of what is being said here. Obviously women-only carriages are a crappy solution and surely more cctv + prosecution would be better?

I also suggest that anyone who thinks that having guards on trains to help in these situations should make sure they support the strikes on trains? The recent ones in the south west are about keeping guards on trains, and the ones in Liverpool are along a similar vein. My own family were anti-strike (because of affected their commute) til I pointed out that if trains go driver-only it will make them more risky for women travelling alone.

TheGirlOnTheLanding · 23/08/2017 12:31

Excellent point @dinahmorris - there should be enough staff on the trains that people can ask for help if necessary.

VestalVirgin · 23/08/2017 12:36

More guards is a good idea. But we'd have to have teams of one female guard and one male guard, just to be on the safe side. A man doesn't automatically become a decent dude once you hand him an uniform.

I'm not a big fan of just having cameras there - male violence needs to be prevented, or stopped, not just prosecuted - we all know how ineffectual the latter tends to be, and I am not hugely optimistic about that changing in the near future.

If more guards lead to higher ticket prices, I am for an ad campaign that puts the blame for this firmly on men who molest women. A "this creepy dude is why we have to pay for guards" poster campaign.

Lottapianos · 23/08/2017 12:49

FFS what a load of shit. Totally agree that the men-only carriage would make more sense. Can you imagine the outcry if it were even suggested??!

Good stuff from Jess Phillips and Stella Creasy. They must absolutely bloody despair of Corbyn and his fellow merry men

KickAssAngel · 23/08/2017 13:24

and there seems no intention of 50% of carriages being women only - even though women are over 50% of the population.

IT's like 'oh, we'll have one carriage for the problematic others, that will make them all go away'