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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Women forced to lift up tops before entering football ground.

130 replies

DeleteOrDecay · 21/08/2017 10:07

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/we-were-treated-like-animals-11023143?ICID=FBmirrorr_main

Outrageous. I understand that for safety they need to search people, having been to football matches myself in the past and have had my bag searched etc.

Never have I ever been asked to lift up my top though. Surely if they really needed to do this (and I don't believe they did), it should have been done behind a screen for privacy and dignity. Not many women would be comfortable taking their top off in front of a bunch of strangers.

OP posts:
AlternativeTentacle · 21/08/2017 16:23

I'm still amazed to see that other women find this acceptable in any way.

Perhaps:
Some women like showing their tits off in public or they may not be actual women on here Wink...or they may just be goady fuckers or plain and simple twats.

enoughisenough12 · 21/08/2017 16:29

Of course @ Alternative. I'm taking this discussion way too seriously. Off for a calming chamomile tea - although maybe a Wine would be better.

Manclife · 21/08/2017 16:49

@enoughisenough12 I don't understand why waiting for all the information before criticising people is such a bad thing? I've already said asking women to lift their top is not acceptable. All I have said is I want to hear the other person/s account. I was taught that this was the right thing to do from an early age by my Mother.

Original poster
DeleteOrDecay · 21/08/2017 16:54

But what exactly are you expecting from this other account? Do you believe the people who complained are over reacting or something?Confused

I wonder if it were men being forced to drop their trousers in front of people for a 'search' would you be questioning the original account of what happened?

OP posts:
Manclife · 21/08/2017 16:57

@enoughisenough12 unless I'm mistaken the only people who have argued it may be acceptable are women.

AlternativeTentacle · 21/08/2017 17:06

unless I'm mistaken the only people who have argued it may be acceptable are women.
Ooh, you are clever - must be a man thing...how exactly do you know that every person arguing against it is a woman? Or are you just assuming?

rococopops · 21/08/2017 17:06

**This is a town local to me and they're very like this. I've noticed the difference as soon as you step into Stevenage it's like you're not a human anymore because you're a woman.

Errr, I live in Stevenage, I don't feel it's any worse than any other town or nearby "naice village" sexism ime is much further reaching. I can assure you my three sons who were all born here will be viewing woman as "human"Biscuit

Madeyemoodysmum · 21/08/2017 17:13

Hear hear. Rococopops

enoughisenough12 · 21/08/2017 17:19

Manclife,
Women get used to harassment and sexism from an early age. We are socialised into being passive and accepting and kind and understanding andthatiswhysomanywomenputupwithmuchcrapfrommenforsolong and once you become a feminist - which I did many decades ago - you begin to trust your instincts and to stop always looking to explain and understand and listen to the other side.
This is the feminism board. I happen to believe the details about what happened to women as detailed by the Grimsby Town supporters association. I know that women rarely lie about incidents of assault. I support the Mumsnet campaign 'we believe you' which aims:
"to shine a spotlight on the prevalence of rape and sexual assault in women's lives; then, to pull apart the many myths surrounding rape, which make so many women feel that they will not be believed if they report this crime."

This type of abusive behaviour and treatment of women in expecting them to show their bodies in public is on a continuum which starts with the leers / comments / jokes about women and their bodies, escalates into men feeling that they can photograph, touch and feel women's bodies without permission and ends up with incidents of sexual assault and rape.

I have had the courtesy to explain one of the basic beliefs that feminists have and why we often just know something - because it happens to women every bloody day.

Perhaps it might be helpful if you were to go off and do some reading and listening to women about feminism so that should you post on any feminist (or any special interest board for that matter) you do them the courtesy of listening to what is being said and, on occasions, accepting that women might just know what we are talking about.

Where's that Wine?

Manclife · 21/08/2017 17:21

@AlternativeTentacle whilst none of us can be 100% sure who is behind the keyboard the few who have posted anything that look liks support have previously posted on other threads comments that would suggest they are female.

Also less of a man thing more a 'check before you post' thing. Feel free to try it some time.

AlternativeTentacle · 21/08/2017 17:24

the few who have posted anything that look liks support have previously posted on other threads comments that would suggest they are female.

So you checked everyone against their previous posts? Do you have a spreadsheet to record all this or is it all committed to memory?

Original poster
DeleteOrDecay · 21/08/2017 17:30

unless I'm mistaken the only people who have argued it may be acceptable are women.

Comments on social media say otherwise.

OP posts:
Manclife · 21/08/2017 17:30

@enoughisenough12 the fact your saying becoming a feminist means you just 'know' things and no longer 'stop to understand' suggests to me you're not an actual feminist.

I've a Mother, Sister, Wife and Daughter and fight hand tooth and nail for equality of the sexes having heard their first hand experience of how women can be treated.

I also champion the principal of believing victims of sexual crimes and have done since even before I became a rape crisis responder but I always reserve judgment of others until I know the full facts. Innocent until proven guilty being the backbone of the legal system.

Manclife · 21/08/2017 17:32

@deleteordecay not sure if your saying some are male posters and I've missed it, in which case I'll take back my comment. Or if you're saying a male is pretending to be a female, in which case feel free to out them.

histinyhandsarefrozen · 21/08/2017 17:33

Have this club found a revolutionary new way at terrorism detection and prevention?

Doubtful.

Surely it also created massive bottlenecks of crowd outside the barriers - potentially risky too.

histinyhandsarefrozen · 21/08/2017 17:36

Copper beech is saying it's acceptable and I think he's a man. So your theory disproved in this thread, no?

enoughisenough12 · 21/08/2017 17:42
Grin Ok Manclife - I bow to your infinite and superior knowledge about the posters on this thread, the inappropriate treatment of Grimsby town women supporters, feminism and my history as a feminist.

I think that this thread may be of interest to you:
\www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/2165755-Behold-a-Man-Has-Arrived-to-Share-His-Manly-View

enoughisenough12 · 21/08/2017 17:43

Gah: not feminist enough to make a clicky link:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/2165755-Behold-a-Man-Has-Arrived-to-Share-His-Manly-View

viques · 21/08/2017 17:47

Are they checking behind men's bits as well? you never know what could be lurking.......

Original poster
DeleteOrDecay · 21/08/2017 17:57

not sure if your saying some are male posters and I've missed it, in which case I'll take back my comment. Or if you're saying a male is pretending to be a female, in which case feel free to out them.

I'm saying that there are comments under this article on social media (Facebook, Twitter etc) in which there are many men commenting in favour of this practice so no it's not just women who agree with it.

OP posts:
Manclife · 21/08/2017 18:07

@deleteordecay I'll have to take you word for it (no sarcasm) but I don't use social media such as Twitter and FB as it contributes little to my life. If that's what they're saying then they're idiots an I bet if they're daughter/mother was asked to lift her top they wouldn't be so quick to support it.

Actually they probably would say it's fine just to make a point.

Manclife · 21/08/2017 18:14

@enoughisenough12 if you (and the site mods) are saying men should not be posting on the 'Feminist' side of MN then I'll gladly FO. But it would be depressing because a) the websites description says it's for parents not just mum's or women and b) I'm an avid supporter of women's rights and as a father of daughter I'd be dumb not to be.

Manclife · 21/08/2017 18:19

*as a son, father, brother and husband I'd be dumb not to.

LassWiTheDelicateAir · 21/08/2017 18:51

It is completely unnecessary. Other venues manage without this.

Mysteriouscurle · 21/08/2017 22:04

If you read the mariners trust letter it sounds like a lot more things were wrong including a female steward in the mens toilets while male stewards were outside. Just why.

Stevenage's initial statement has me worried as they say "Searches conducted are recorded on CCTV and on this occasion, were in the presence of deployed police officers." If this is true, then police went along with this! WTAF

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