Why do some feminists not want sons?

[TeaGreenNC]

Hi, can I just say: some is definitely an important word in my title!

It's just I've seen on a couple of gender disappointments threads where they said reasons they are disappointed is because they're a feminist? I don't think its right to tag them, but that was said.

I'm just wondering what having a son has got to do with being a feminist?

Failing that it would be poetic justice if they are landed with a son who likes fashion, glitter and unicorns or a daughter who becomes a prop forward at rugby.

I would prefer a daughter, so that we can smash patriarchy together. Her being good at rugby would not interfere with that at all.
(needless to say, I would be delighted if I had a son who offended patriarchy by liking fashion, glitter and unicorns. Though his father would have to go clothes shopping with him, in that case)

Sometimes it seems impossible to raise the enlightened people one would wish for, my Ds is fairly unreconstructed at 8, and his 5 year old sister is a vision in pink tulle. I think the only way to get past their inner stereotypes would be Clockwork Orange style

That's what I worry about with regard to having sons. You are never the only influence in your child's life (well, not if you adhere to normal-people ethics, anyway), more likely than not you won't even be able to homeschool.

If your teenage son starts spouting sexist shit he learnt at school, you can argue and argue and argue, to try and make him see reason, but it seems a very tiring thing to do.

the social world of teenage girls have decreased somewhat

I think this is overstated if you mean relationships with other girls. I go to a girls' school and there are wonderful friendship groups; generally all are supportive to one another and any fall outs are nothing which wouldn't happen in any school no matter of sex (there have actually been barely any in my year group anyway). The social world in terms of growing up in a society so permeated with misogyny, dealing with sexism both in person and on social media, though, I'd agree with as it's infuriating.

Congratulations on your soon to be new arrival!

If your teenage son starts spouting sexist shit he learnt at school, you can argue and argue and argue, to try and make him see reason, but it seems a very tiring thing to do.

Very much so. I've long since given up on some boys I've known so it must be extremely frustrating for their mothers, if they are opposed to such views and aware of what they're like, that is. It's also something I worry about in the future with my brothers (I've already challenged a couple of things) though hopefully the influence of my mother will offset that.

NoLove he's 16. There is the problem, like Vestal said, that they hear all kinds of crap at school. Luckily he can see it for what it is, talk about it then we laugh at how ridiculous people are!

My favourite example of this is when he came home from school recently, fuming because his class had watched a video of Katie Hopkins and afterwards the girl next to him had loudly pronounced that KH was such an awful person that she was "probably a feminist" . Because that of course is the insult du jour!

DS was all like "Does she even know what feminism is?!"

It did make me laugh though. If only KH knew that she was being held up as an example of a despicable human being in school classrooms!

He sounds great Lessthanaballpark and it can be difficult for teenage boys to be feminists and supportive of it so it's fantastic he is and will no doubt go on to do so! It also sounds like he's approaching it in a good way, becoming enraged about certain issues and also mocking nonsense like his classmate's comment (although it's dispiriting "feminist" is seen by the girl in question as an insult, as risible as it is she ascribed that label to the individual in question).

It is dispiriting indeed! They all watch the same circle of YouTube videos where "feminist" is a dirty word, a shorthand for all that has gone wrong with society. So I guess she has picked it up there.

Besides there is probably the "cool girl" element. It feels so much nicer to be swimming along with the current than against it.

I think both of those are definitely major factors. I can see why it'd feel more attractive to be seen as easy going, not "up tight", laughing along with misogyny and not challenging boys/the misogyny in society generally than to seem to be the one always objecting to something. Thankfully though plenty of girls - and indeed boys like your son - are doing so!

You lot are utterly deluded. Boys my age totally look down on girls, men do, women do, your sons do. You really have no idea.

@NoLove, you are 17 and talking about teenage boys, who are dickheads and will say anything controversial/misogynistic to get a laugh from their mates.

They grow up and stop believing that crap, usually.

When I was at school, I was exasperated because all the boys pretty much were from a misogynist 50s time machine. Fast forward to uni graduation and behold, a bunch of sensible guys! (mostly)

Also, I think part of the reason people want girls is because they're more familiar (as we are women), and you go through a lot of the same problems and can offer support. Also, you can do "girly" stuff together like spa days and coffee (yes you can do this with guys but I've never seen a bloke out on a spa day with his mum, nor would I go on a spa day with my dad).