The effect of porn on teenage boys and young men

[DeviTheGaelet]

Did anyone else hear the section on R5 about porn addiction the other day? They spoke to a doctor who is looking into the defects of porn on men. A study in Italy found 40% of young men were having erectile issued, of those 60% were psychologically caused ( I think those were the stats).
The doctor suggested that watching porn during adolescence is training men to be aroused by purely visual stimuli and the visual stimuli are not realistic. As a result they are not being wired to find the smells and touch of actual sex arousing. As a result they are having election issues.
He described porn as "stunt sex" and said it was creating a generation of men who's sexual relationships were with their hand and a screen rather than another person.
I found it really interesting. We talk a lot on here about the harm porn causes women and girls but I've not heard so much about the impact on boys.
I think this should be discussed in PSHE in schools. Maybe this will be the personal impact many men need to see how harmful porn can be.

Oh Spartacus. What an awful situation. My DD is 11/Y6. I just cannot bear the thought of people, other pupils treating her like that. She doesn't know what prostitution even is yet.
DH and i have already discussed what we'll have to talk to her about before she goes to secondary in September, but it's horrible to think of doing that.

Round of applause for Spartacus. Thank you for that excellent post.

I'm so sorry your DD and you are having to deal with this shit. My eldest DD describes similar things.

A boy was suspended from school for taking an upskirt photo of a girl and then diffusing it with a porny comment added. The girl was devastated obviously, not only by what he did but the sniggering, bullying crap from loads of other boys who had seen the image. And of course you can imagine how it made all the other girls feel.

And yes the boy might be sanctioned but the harm to the girls is done (and indeed to the boy).

What is the solution though? Should all porn to be restricted or regulated? Or only porn produced by men which degrades women?

I'm broadly anti-porn but I find the feminist agenda on it sometimes a bit inconsistent and incoherent. In fact, feminists themselves are very divided over it and have been for the last 40 years.

In other words it is not clear whether the feminist argument is against all visual media designed to titillate, or against titillating visual media that promotes and perpetuates the patriarchal abuse of women.

I think it might very well be a lot worse than we think.

I did some research a few years ago on tumblr subcultures, and came across some porn where I am pretty sure it was footage taken of trafficked women kept in isolated situations and abused. They did not look or behave in a manner where they came across as consenting adults.

In one particular photo I found, I think the woman might actually have been dead.

Can I just reiterate? This was on tumblr, not some weird deviant site behind a paywall or on the darknet.

Doesn't surprise me at all werk, and it chimes with some research a friend is doing about how, no matter what the pornhounds want women to think, this is mainstream stuff.

"n other words it is not clear whether the feminist argument is against all visual media designed to titillate, or against titillating visual media that promotes and perpetuates the patriarchal abuse of women."

How about men just make up their own minds?

How about men just make up their own minds?

That's your answer?

Yes.

I've said what I think men can and should do. If you don't like that why not come up with another solution.

Werkzallhourz. That's hideous.

I once made the mistake of googling the word "porn" and then looking at some of the stuff from the sites in the top results. It was in reaction to being told on here that feminists pretend that the really hard-core stuff is much more prevalent than it is and that mainstream porn is not hard-core and there is nothing wrong with it. I copied and pasted some of the video titles on the thread (they were foul). I looked at some of the videos to check that they were as bad as the titles. They were. I wish I could unsee them and I wish I hadn't been so stupid as to look. One in particular comes back to haunt me.

Growapear- should people not feel ashamed when they view images of people being abused and exploited?

They should indeed if they think that is what they are looking at. But a lot of porn i.e. that on reddit is made by women who take pictures of themselves doing stuff they think men will find sexy. It seems like there is an inherent imbalance between the sexuality of men and women - I see porn as an expression of that now that technology allows men to consume it without the shame that was associated with it before.

In order for it to change it would need to be accepted that a lot of male sexuality is basically harmful and needs to be repressed. It reminds me somewhat of the "I wish my wife was as dirty as this van" type messages you see. Where does it all come from ? I think that some men feel resentful about the fact they find women attractive at all and they hate the power that they think women have over them because of this. This is the prevalent strand of thought on bullshit like MGOTW etc. A lot of porn seems like a manifestation of this. Men are all dangerous rapists, well fuck it - might as well stop pretending we don't like watching it.

I actually think ISPs blocking it would be pretty effective if the political will could be found.

"technology allows men to consume it without the shame that was associated with it before."

So they weren't ashamed of consuming it- they were only ashamed of being caught buying it?

Yes - i think it's reasonable to assume that anyway. They may feel some associated shame but clearly this is not sufficient to stop them consuming it.

Just popping back quickly to say something DD just pointed out.

She said that even where a Dad uses porn, and even where the Mum is ok with her husband using porn, it's no reason why both Dad and Mum should not discuss the potential harm it could do not only their son, but also future interactions with girls.

That I've warned her about the dangers of smoking even though I smoke myself. That just because a lot of people do it she is confident to say no when she's been offered a vape (another problem with the y7s). Similar with alcohol too. That even though some people smoke and drink responsibly, they still earn their DCs about potential harm. That even though some men feel thatbtheybuse port with no negatives on their lives, it doesn't mean their own son will and it's irresponsible for parents to not warn them, or give them the confidence to say no and that not watching does not make them less of a boy/man.

That maybe the "here come and watch this watch woman take two up the arse" is the new "here have a puff on this" and if it's possible to warn against smoking without smokers getting offended then surely we can teach boys about the possible dangers of porn on their lives without men using porn getting defensive?

Men can stop it. But in order to stop it they need to recognize that female humanity, dignity, safety and personhood are worth more than men's orgasms and that making money from filming and disseminating films of sexualized abuse and violence is criminal
This is why I started the thread really. I think porn is very damaging to women and girls and I would like to see access to porn and the typed of porn available much better controlled. But say that and you get told "women watch it too!" "Some porn is ethical so it's fine" and blah blah blah about why it can't be stopped.
Men need to stop it. They need to see the harm it does. I wondered whether tying it back to the detrimental impact on mens sexuality would mean that it would get taken more seriously. Whether dad's would be bothered that watching porn would stop their sons being able to enjoy actual sex and would stop the "normal, everyone does it" narrative.
It's really annoying that it take harm to men before things are taken seriously. But pragmatically, if that helps change current views of porn IMO that's a good thing.
Seems like many men are so invested in their need to watch porn that even this kind of evidence doesn't put them off though.

But a lot of porn i.e. that on reddit is made by women who take pictures of themselves doing stuff they think men will find sexy. It seems like there is an inherent imbalance between the sexuality of men and women - I see porn as an expression of that now that technology allows men to consume it without the shame that was associated with it before. In order for it to change it would need to be accepted that a lot of male sexuality is basically harmful and needs to be repressed.

grow if porn is damaging young mens brain development and stopping them forming healthy sexual relationships with others then it really doesn't matter what the intent of the people creating it was and whether they were harmed in its creation.
It is harmful to the consumer. We legislate against smoking, drinking, drugs, motorbikes, driving, having sex, tattoos etc because of risks to consumers including children. When we know there are risks in watching porn, why should that be different?

I guess I just hope he doesnt look at it.

He does or he will. He may or may not want to but some 'mate' will show him some.

DeviTheGaelet, yes I guess we are going to have to be pragmatic but we have the right to be annoyed.

Consuming (often compulsively) violent and sexist graphic material is not benign. What a shocker.

Question is what are men actually going to do about this monster they have created? Perhaps the men on this thread have ideas? There certainly is going to be plenty for them to do and IMO it will need to be all hands on deck. There's a lot of money in porn and a lot of resistance by consumers to the idea that pornography is harmful.

I don't think you can ban it. Ask any of the famous mainstream female porn starts (the only one who's name I know is Gina Hartley ?) and I'm sure they'll tell you it's all grand.

All you can try to do is make it socially unacceptable in the way it used to be regarded as something for dirty old men in grubby coats. That seems unlikely to happen. You already get gratuitously violent films that don't have sex in them, they are marketed for adults only etc. Men regard it as an outlet, there are women apparently happy to make it, and men enjoy watching them get naked - your best bet is to make them feel ashamed that they like watching naked women - but good luck with that one. The only thing that I could see working is if you could persuade men that ALL porn involved trafficked women who are being raped on camera. But go on reddit for example and you'll see something that i think looks nothing like that.

I just don't see how you can expect to persuade a 14 year old boy that he should be feeling guilty about looking at the pictures those girls are posting of their tits on reddit etc. He just wont tell his mum or dad - he'll still look at it.

This study sounds like the modern version of the old hairy palm and short sighted type warnings.

I can't imagine men could ban vibrators because they give a false expectation of the length and girth of penises and many women apparently can't orgasm without them. So it all has to be about the abuse and objectification i.e. the effect on the women rather than the effect on men.

I can't imagine men could ban vibrators because they give a false expectation of the length and girth of penises and many women apparently can't orgasm without them. So it all has to be about the abuse and objectification i.e. the effect on the women rather than the effect on men.

Are we on the same thread? What the fuck are you on about.
Jesus. I started a thread about men (for once) and you still make it about "angry feminists hate men".
Ok the answer is let's throw the sex lives if a generation of boys under the bus because grown men can't give up porn. Great idea.

What's wrong with you ?

I'm giving you my opinion which is that making out porn is harmful and will make men unable to have orgasms with a female sexual partner isn't going to work. I cite as evidence no one rushing to ban female masturbatory aids that a lot of women can't orgasm without. That is all.

I think I prefer my solution as having pornography recognized as hate speech and working under the well established wide reaching and well recognised definitions of what hate speech is and why and how it must be countered. Precedents have been set for dealing with this type of phenomenon - let's learn from them and utilize them.

Vibrators don't prevent women having sex with men. There is no research implicating a growth in use of vibrators with sexual difficulties in women. There are no studies suggesting young women who use vibrators can't have adequate sex with men. You just made that up. When it's a thread about men FFS.
I have no idea why you are hanging round here constructing ridiculous arguments but I won't be responding to you again on any thread.

Nope i see what grow is doing

Adding two and two and getting five

It's an utterly bizarre point. What does it have to do with anything?

Nothing.

Since Shere Hite, Masters and Johnson et al, clitoral stimulation rather than purely vaginal has been shown to be an important part of the female orgasm for many women.

What the heck has this got to do with vibrators?