The use of cis gender

[Ollycat]

I've read the trans threads and they've definitely been an eye opener! I would say I'm definitely Spartacus!

Can someone enlighten me on the whole cis thing? When did it start becoming prevalent and who was the driving force behind it? The phrase cis woman is something I find quite disturbing- I am a woman plain and simple- not something which needs a quantifier.

Sorry if this is really basic stuff but am intrigued as to how this sort of terminology has become a "thing" and how it's becoming ok for men to define/ explain to women what it means to be a woman?

Genuinely confused and shocked about the whole thing.

The National Geographic story follows the Green party in that men are men, women are non-men. The regressive, oppressive old-style sexism of all this will surely eventually be noticed by those who now parrot trans propaganda.

Cis is a redundant qualifier. But it is more than redundant. It demands that anyone who uses it concedes certain assumptions about gender, assumptions that feminists do not share. Feminism holds that gender is part of woman's oppression, that stereotyping is damaging to our interests. We don't agree that "feminine" is an intrinsic part of being female. Feminists, therefore, are never "cis", nor do we accept that transgender males are a subset of female.

Flora is that a current copy of NG?

It's a forthcoming one. 27th December iirc.

+1 Prawn

I do not subscribe to those beliefs, therefore that word is inappropriate to use for me.

As the Green Party now think that women are non men to accommodate the sensitivities of transactivists, given that there are also trans men I can't see why men can't be non-women. I'm sure that suggestion would go down like a lead balloon, though. No prizes for guessing why.....

Take a look at the definition at the top of the wiki https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cisgender ...

that makes the erroneous assumption that we all accept being define by some notion of 'gender identity' but also has the unscientific nonsense phrase 'sex that they were assigned at birth'.

Nope. My sex was determined as female the moment an X rather than a Y sperm won the race to the ovum. That is what makes me a woman.

I`m currently writing an academic essay about gender stereotypes in a particular context, if I used the term 'cis women' instead of 'women' I would lose marks because it is a redundant term. I would be told not to use unnecessary and irrelevant phrasing and that the word 'cis' was only relevant in a scientific or geographical work.

Just wanted to add, I am writing about women being treated in a particular ways because they were born female, not because of how they perceived themselves.

Sounds like an interesting essay, and its a relief to hear that not all of academia has been overrun by the TRA narrative.

The point touched on earlier re this being a "woman thing" is interesting. I feel as though the shrill insistence of the MtF activist lobby that woman should step aside, change our name and allow their male "sisters" room in the female only space is male privilege in heels.

Sick of this nonsense. Sex is a biological fact and absolutely IS binary.

At the same time, I'm not completely dismissive of gender but I think we are all on a spectrum, we are all fluid, which kind of shows it up for the nonsense it is, just a way of dressing/acting that can change from morning to afternoon. If I spend the day working in the garden in a pair of wellys then change into a dress and make-up for a night out, I wasn't male in the morning and female in the evening ffs.

I hate the term "cis-gender". I've only ever seen it used derogatorily (is that a word?!) and mainly towards so-called cis-women.

I take issue with TRA that refuse to acknowledge they are different, instead creating a label for women who were born women and identify as women. Equality doesn't mean the same. They seem to forget that. 5+2=7. 4+3=7. They are not the same. But they are equal.
Instead of ramming it down our throats that they "are women" and that "feminism is bullshit" if you're a "cis" gender, they should perhaps focus on ways to make life easier for transgendered people. So not by allowing mtf into women only spaces, but by creating spaces for them specifically.

I've seen things online from TRA spouting that if we, as feminists, do not accept MtF as "real women" then we are only seeing women as walking vaginas - like misogynists. And yet, they are changing the very definition of what a woman is...how can we demand rights as women, if no one is even really clear on what a woman actually is anymore?

fakenamefornow - bravo, very well said! :)

I`m currently writing an academic essay about gender stereotypes in a particular context, if I used the term 'cis women' instead of 'women' I would lose marks because it is a redundant term. I would be told not to use unnecessary and irrelevant phrasing and that the word 'cis' was only relevant in a scientific or geographical work.

You are not the first here to claim it is "redundant". I wonder if the word redundant means different things to different people. The use of machine in "ATM machine" may be redundant as it conveys no extra information or tells you anything new over what ATM alone would have. If someone whose beliefs and ideology on these matters are unknown to their audience declared themself to be a man or a woman, with no further qualification or detail, then this leaves open some possibilities. Cis would close the gap as would trans. Redundant does not as far as I am aware mean that you do not ideologically agree with a term.

JAPAB - a lot of feminists believe that gender is oppressive socialisation, a way of keeping women down. the term cis would say that I am wholeheartedly embracing the socialisation that places me below men.

I'm not.

They can take cis and poke it.

I think women should just mean people who identify as women, the bulk of those are naturally born as women. The only times when the fact that someone is trans is relevant is during medical treatment, probably sports and when starting a romantic relationship (I think this merits disclosure as do some other things at the start of a romantic relationship). I think woman (without trans or cis) is fine otherwise. But I know this is not popular opinion on this thread.

DameDeDoubtance, fair enough, but until everyone is on the same page ideologically, there will need to be distinguishing terms that are not "redundant". Or alternatively until everyone becomes psychic and knows what everyone else thinks and means.

Glamour magazine (UK) use it a lot.

There already are words to describe us, women and female hth.

Average, what about crime stats? Women are far less violent and including males as females will skew this.

I was on a FB thread with some mature students (friends of family member) and got ABSOLUTELY SLATED for disliking the term cis woman. I got verbally attacked including by the family member as being narrow minded, and a lot worse. Also lumped as a Trump supporter (they are in Canada). It was horrible. I was trying to put forward my arguments but it's been 25 years since I was at Uni.

And Average do the men who self identify as women get to do all the women stuff? In the women places?

I really needed an MN thread to link to!

AverageJosephine

I think women should just mean people who identify as women, the bulk of those are naturally born as women.

Right. And what term would you suggest for someone like me? I'm biologically female, but I don't 'identify' as a woman. I don't have a gender identity, I'm just me. The term 'woman' used to work fine for me, but it seems I can't use it any more.