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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

how can I have a feminist/socialist/anti-capitalistish wedding?

96 replies

GreenGoth89 · 08/09/2016 12:51

We're getting married in summer 2018, and at first I wasn't even too sure if I want to get married - but part of it is due to our archaic legal system which doesn't really allow me to have parental responsibility over my full time resident DSS (who rarely sees his BM). It's already caused issue, and considering I'm primary carer for him once my DP goes back to work (DSS has only just started school, and isn't full time yet), I really need it. But also I want to celebrate our relationship (which we've put a lot of work into) with our friends and it seems to make sense considering our legal system doesn't really see cohabitees in the same light as married couples.

But... I've started to go to wedding fairs (still thinking of going to the national one but I think it might just further sent my self esteem) and they seem to represent everything we hate - body shaming people into have liposuction, hair extensions and other cosmetic procedures, dresses (which I hate, but also as a disabled bride, I can't wear) which cost as much as a small used car, being told I need to pay for things that aren't just non essential but things I really don't want. What I really want is a wedding in a field, to do the catering ourselves, have friends that are DJs and musicians for entertainment, and sort out games and stuff ourselves. But it all seems very hard or more expensive to do it ourselves. We're writing our own vows so I can take out some of the misogynist crap in the normal ceremony, but how else can we make our wedding more feminist/socialist/and as anti capitalist as we can?

OP posts:
ShowMeTheElf · 26/09/2016 15:45

You don't say what city you are in OP but, as a licensed bar is way down your list, have you considered a community room in a park?
Have the legal ceremony at the reg office, then have a lovely day in the park, with the inside space booked in case of bad weather, with picnic baskets, camping chairs, and informal ceremony under the trees (does not need to be a paid celebrant at all). Accoustic music and naked dancing in the moonlight (well, not necessarily naked!). Definitely possible in the city. Definitely not too expensive.

almondpudding · 26/09/2016 16:02

Our rings came from here:

credjewellery.com/pages/fairtrade-gold#

And that was basically almost our entire wedding budget.

Other than that I had a £15 bouquet, the registry fee and we all went for a cup of tea in a tea rooms after.

The other ethical option is to buy second hand rings.

Kr1stina · 26/09/2016 17:33

We had a very traditional wedding and had all of the following

No giving away of anyone
Both said same vows
Neither of us changed our names
Both mothers names on marriage certificate
Both witnesses female
No bouquet throwing
No speeches
Nanny to care for children
No unpaid labour expected from any female friends or family
Bridesmaid wore a black suit ( her choice )
Best man was wheelchair user
Non traditional venue
Accessible venue

I never realised this made us radical in any way . I am pleased to know I can rebrand my wedding as feminist and anti capitalism Grin . Every day's a school day on MN

erinaceus · 27/09/2016 07:51

GreenGoth89 It could potentially make your wedding more feminist if you did not brand your DH's mates as useless, or talk about the demands that you might make of either them ("it'll be them doing" xyz), or your ushers, even if you are doing so in a jokey way.

If your DP is the person who wants the celebration, can you not leave the organising of the celebration that he wants, to him? If you want to be legally married, a legal marriage ceremony can be organised entirely separately to a wedding. The costs of the legal bit are much lower, and you can be legally married much sooner than the time it takes to organise a wedding celebration.

daftbesom · 27/09/2016 08:04

We went to a wedding that had

  • humanist ceremony where couple had written the vows themselves;
  • buffet supper (catered as it was vegan);
  • music and decor etc provided by friends;
  • no wedding gifts but donations to a charity of the couple's choosing;
  • it was in a community hall.

It was one of the nicest weddings I have ever attended.

For my own wedding, we wrote our own vows and made the promises etc (but had been to the registry office with 2 friends the previous day to do "the legal bit");
we had it in a local hall that provided dinner - we provided wine at the meal but otherwise it was a paying bar;
talented family did invitations, floral decorations, cake and photography;
my choir sang at the end of the ceremony.

But it's your wedding! Do it your way. I didn't go to a single wedding fair, they are just ways of selling you stuff, which is OK if that's what you want ... but you don't.

We organised ours in 6 weeks - it is not difficult but it is a wee bit stressful and you have to be super-organised, everything on a tick-list with dates and prices.

Kr1stina · 27/09/2016 08:34

I have a bit of a problem with this "thing " that most weddings seem to be based on a vast amount of unpaid labour and often sometimes hard cash from female family and friends.

I hear about weddings where bridesmaids are expected to pay for a weekend away for the bride and also themslves, and dresses and shoes which the bride chooses. Their hair must be done in a prescribed style , their nails painted the correct shade. They have to give up time to make favours , decorations and invitations. And this is all for the " honour " of walking down the aisle behind the bride.

Being an usher or a best man doesn't seem to involve the same commitment of time and money . I wonder why that is .

Another problem for me is the issuing of dress codes for guests, which are almost exclusively aimed at female guests. Most men own a lounge suit and evening wear ( if not owned ) can be hired for £50ish . Whereas women are expected to buy a new outfit for each wedding, often in a particular colour or style. Women cannot hire wedding outfits.

It's frowned upon for a woman to be seen wearing the same outfit twice . Not a problem for men.

I have a lot more trouble with these issues than trivial matters like the colour of a dress. Honestly, no one actually believe that anyone marrying in white / cream is a virgin, especially since most brides already have children . Wearing a blue dress doesn't make you a feminist if you are ripping off your women friends for your " special day " .

daftbesom · 27/09/2016 13:46

ha, good point Kr1stina - I didn't have bridesmaids myself and we didn't do stag/ hen nights - we both had good male and female friends and didn't see the point of a single-sex gathering. As far as we were concerned, the wedding was the party!

Tbh I didn't really think about guests' attire, they could wear what they wanted.

Forgot to say that we picked a wedding venue that people could get to by public transport if they wanted - definitely not a given in my part of the world. And the two of us walked to it and then walked home again - no wedding cars.

Strangeday · 27/09/2016 15:51

Well here's what we did.

Registry office. No bridesmaids, no best man, no giving away, no stag or hen dos, no flowers, just a simple, no frills ceremony. Our mothers were witnesses and that was that.

He wore a suit and I wore a non wedding dress. We arrived together and walked in together. We had minimal family there. Went for a meal of our choice afterwards.

I haven't changed my name.

As it happens the woman is supposed to sign on the bottom and the man on top but my dh albeit accidentally signed in the wrong place.

So we just about broke every tradition going.

It all cost less than £500

Smile
GreenGoth89 · 27/09/2016 23:24

I agree with most of what you're saying kr1stina - I haven't been on any of my friends hen dos because it's always involved a massive outlay of cost that I haven't had and I won't be expecting that of my friends. I used to have lots of male friends but I don't these days - DP on the other hand has several good female friends who have already been excluded by his male "mates" from any stag do - not happy about that one but he needs to fight that one not me, as they aren't my friends, they're his. I'm probably making bridesmaids dresses which I'm going to give them the choice of the colours they prefer from the colour scheme and let them choose the style - as long as it's something I can make! Shoes - one of my bridesmaids will have to wear orthopaedic/specialist shoes and if it's in a field then flats are best anyway! Maybe I could buy flats and decoupage them to personalise them? Hair they can do whatever they like as long as they're not doing the same as me (which is unlikely seeing as I'm having something fairly "out there"). No guest dress code - unless we're going down the summer festival style route in which its going to be - wear what you would to a festival which I would think everyone would have in their wardrobe. Probably easier than having anything formal!

His friends aren't useless but their talents lie in more physically demanding tasks than creative - could ask ushers to maybe serve food if we do self cater.

I would be very tempted to do the legal bit and be done with it but I know we would have a shit storm from his family to start with, and probably my DM too...not sure it's worth years of agro!

OP posts:
erinaceus · 28/09/2016 05:18

I would be very tempted to do the legal bit and be done with it but I know we would have a shit storm from his family to start with, and probably my DM too...not sure it's worth years of agro!

In a way, this is why it is sometimes said that a wedding is a microcosm of a marriage, or something like that. You will not be able to please or placate the generation above you, in your marriage, so how you do or do not do that with your wedding, can sor-of set the template for the future.

In our case we went for a fair bit of sticking to our guns, and quite a lot of compromises.

You write about not costing other people money but their creative talents have a value in terms of the time that they take up. This is true of everybody. So instead of starting by thinking about what you can get done for free, it would be more polite to ask them what they are prepared to offer, and work with that.

As a specific example, there is no reason why your bridesmaids have to have matching dresses that you make. They could wear whatever they wanted. It depends what you are happy with for your wedding. If I was on a budget, I would save the money that I would spend on fabric and so on for bridesmaids dresses, and spend it all on food instead. Even the most thoughtfully put together wedding is miserable for the guests if the guests are hungry.

idlevice · 29/09/2016 23:07

Re: children's entertainment - at the wedding in a field I went to there was a small tent with various toys in for the kids, a basic craft table & outdoor games, but because it was fine outside the kids just mainly ran around in the field and the hedgerows. I don't remember anyone being specifically stuck looking out for the kids. I was more than happy for mine to be free range whilst I necked Pimms.

I would say that if there a few kids at such an event they band together & mostly entertain themselves, having a whale of a time as they know the adults are not standing over them with hawk eyes. So I think you could easily save money by not bothering with a children's entertainer, unless you have the sort of entitled friends & relatives who think you owe them & their little mini-mes something for the privilege of attending your special day...

Kr1stina · 30/09/2016 06:05

I think that works if the children are school aged and are all NT

Doesn't work so well if they are pre schoolers and some have SN. And it's not sure why it's " entitled " to have entertainment for the kids but normal to have it for the adults. It's almost as if the children are not really guests Hmm

And I deplore the attititude that your guests are " privileged to attend your special date " . On the contrary , you as the hosts are privileged to have your guests celebrate with you.

I think this attitude is behind many of the excesses that are common at modern weddings . People forget that guests ARE guests , not unpaid extras in the Bride and Groom show.

Fantome · 01/10/2016 04:09

Keep your surname!!

GreenGoth89 · 02/10/2016 12:07

Both double-barrelling our surname (mine first!!). Some are SN and there maybe 2-4 pre schoolers, someone suggested hiring a nanny/manny for the day, but I'm not sure how I feel about that...

OP posts:
OlennasWimple · 03/10/2016 03:04

Not sure a nanny would work well for SN and the age group you mention. Better to spend the money on things to help keep them entertained (including child friendly food)

ellesbellesxxx · 03/10/2016 03:14

Greenandaway.org based in Malvern, beautiful sacred riverside/woodland area for your own ceremony then lovely surroundings/ money goes back into the charity... Plus it's not that expensive. I know of someone who got married there whose guests were happy to bring food..yummy!!

chunkymum1 · 03/10/2016 10:21

If you're on a tight budget I wouldn't hire a nanny. I've never been to a wedding where there is child care provided (some with children's entertainment, but parents are still responsible for watching over their children) and I don't think people would expect it.

As a pp has said, I'd be inclined to just provide some things that keep the children happy (and therefore make it easier for their parents to also have a good time). The idea of an areas with some children's toys is a good one (you could maybe borrow some or find some quite cheaply in a charity shop), or just some craft stuff (especially if the party is outside so no paintwork to ruin with glue and stickers etc). We've been to some events (not weddings though) where there were a few 'circus skills' type things for guests to play with- parents and children used these together. Some of the basic stuff would probably be cheaper than a nanny/entertainer.

I'm not normally big on specific food for children but one wedding I went to had a cold 'children's buffet' out right from the start of the event. This was brilliant as it meant that children did not have to stand around hungry whilst photos were taken etc.

PikachuBoo · 03/10/2016 10:43

I (and did) chose a really nice dress I liked and suited me, and that I would (and have done) wear again and again. No need for anything remotely like a 'wedding dress' if you don't want to. But if you want a more formal one, go ahead and wear what you want.
No need to be given away by a man/father or to change your name.
I think getting some sort of entertainment for kids is a great idea. You might find a teenager is happy to take the little ones off for a couple of hours so the parents can relax a bit. Lots of kids' entertainers are fantastic with special needs - you just need to explain. Agree to easy food for kids early on or they get hangry. Parents can entertain themselves easily with chat and alcohol, but it can go on a bit for kids.
You're having a party to celebrate your union with your friends - you decide how it goes.
A friend of mine hired a beer tent (cash bar!) in a field, and everyone wore wellies. Had the pagan blessing in the field.

erinaceus · 05/10/2016 07:10

I (and did) chose a really nice dress I liked and suited me, and that I would (and have done) wear again and again. No need for anything remotely like a 'wedding dress' if you don't want to. But if you want a more formal one, go ahead and wear what you want.
No need to be given away by a man/father or to change your name.

I agree. I did not wear a wedding dress. I love the dress that I did wear, and have worn it again since. It was expensive for a dress, but not for a wedding dress. The look I went for, was "going to the BAFTAs". I do not think that I was too far off the mark.

I did not change my name. I was not given away by anyone. My sister walked down the aisle next to me, and my immediate family followed, with my parents bringing up the rear. I did not have any bridesmaids. I did not feel as if I needed any. I used to say to people, I do not need to have bridesmaids. I have sisters. I also have a lot of friends, who did one or two things for me, mostly orgainsational. I asked them specially and they were very kind to help me because they did not get the pseudo-honour of being bridesmaids. I love them for it. I feel so, so lucky to have so many people around me.

In case it helps you, we had only two children who came to our party, and they were entertained by the woodwind trio, who were playing whilst the guests were having drinks and nibbles. I am not sure that this would work so well once the number of children hit critical mass, or if the some of the children have special needs. One of our guests who is an adult is somewhat disabled and needed to leave at one point because of all the noise and the waiting around and so on. He left for a quiet pub round he corner, and came back later. Luckily he was with someone who was able to take care of him. I suppose I am trying to say, if someone feels overwhelmed easily by noise and so on, it doesn't matter what age they are, it could be nice to have a chill out space somehow. We did not have such a space at our party, but if I was to do it again (heaven forbid!) I might try to make a mixture of spaces, some quieter and some more lively. If you are outside, then something like some rugs laid out, and some craft materials, and maybe a teenager on standby who can keep an eye on felt-tip-pen lids that might be at risk of being choked on. We only had lively spaces at our wedding, and it was really quite noisy, and this is not pleasant for everyone.

We did not have any dancing, because DH doesn't like it. I would have loved a ceiligh, but in the end you can't have everything, and I do have a lovely husband. Would still have loved a ceiligh though.

OhTheRoses · 05/10/2016 07:20

Let go of the idea of a "wedding" a d focus on a marriage. The latter has nothing to do with imposed commercialism. 40 years ago most brides had a pronuptia or Laura Ashley wedding dress, their mum or aunt ran up the bridesmaids dresses, a local florist did the bouquets and button holes and there was a reception in the village hall, lo al hotel if they were lucky.

Kr1stina · 05/10/2016 08:30

Let go of the idea of a "wedding" and focus on a marriage

This is the best advice I have ever seen on a wedding thread.

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