how can I have a feminist/socialist/anti-capitalistish wedding?

[GreenGoth89]

We're getting married in summer 2018, and at first I wasn't even too sure if I want to get married - but part of it is due to our archaic legal system which doesn't really allow me to have parental responsibility over my full time resident DSS (who rarely sees his BM). It's already caused issue, and considering I'm primary carer for him once my DP goes back to work (DSS has only just started school, and isn't full time yet), I really need it. But also I want to celebrate our relationship (which we've put a lot of work into) with our friends and it seems to make sense considering our legal system doesn't really see cohabitees in the same light as married couples.

But... I've started to go to wedding fairs (still thinking of going to the national one but I think it might just further sent my self esteem) and they seem to represent everything we hate - body shaming people into have liposuction, hair extensions and other cosmetic procedures, dresses (which I hate, but also as a disabled bride, I can't wear) which cost as much as a small used car, being told I need to pay for things that aren't just non essential but things I really don't want. What I really want is a wedding in a field, to do the catering ourselves, have friends that are DJs and musicians for entertainment, and sort out games and stuff ourselves. But it all seems very hard or more expensive to do it ourselves. We're writing our own vows so I can take out some of the misogynist crap in the normal ceremony, but how else can we make our wedding more feminist/socialist/and as anti capitalist as we can?

A wedding cake being cut by a knife symbolises the consummation of the marriage/taking the bride's virginity, so I would say 'avoid cake'

I have never heard this, and I've studied wedding customs and their origins in-depth. To my knowledge there is no strong meaning to cutting the cake (apart from "yum, CAKE imminent!"), but I'd like to believe the "doing it together" symbolises their future of being on the same team and sharing the tasks.

So, have cake if you want it GreenGoth.

My dress was knee length from Monsoon, since found loads of lovely dresses on likes of Lindybop.

My friend did my hair, my sister my makeup. Mum and Dad bought a bouquet (which I didn't want but they insisted on flowers so off you go...)

Registry office followed by pub tea. Then big party in a local football club.

I love cake so we had one from M&S. They did them in different coloured icing and all kinds.

Best wedding I went to was a registry office then local social club. Fantastic night.

Worst was a big formal thing in a fancy hotel with shit loads of photos, sit down meal and about 3 hours of speaches and toasts. Bored to tears and trying to wrestle a small person was not fun. Food was shite too. Obv didn't tell my friend that!

There are loads of cool places to get married now, have a look at museums and zoos.

Easily. We did register office with just 8 guests. Followed by lunch. Then 3 days later just met our friends in the pub to celebrate.
My dress was off ebay, as were rings. No flowers, no invitations, my brother took some pics. We travelled to and from wedding by tube. Did my own hair and make up. Went home to our own bed. Bought a cake off the shelf at a local cake shop.
I did buy a new pair of white trainers, but they lasted me three years after that.
We specifically stipulated no gifts and everyone did as they were told.

I don't think it's hard.

My friend got married here: www.phm.org.uk
Their wedding photos are all of them standing under the trade union banners.

Haven't read the whole thread so apologies. DH and I had a fairly non-standard wedding, we are from different religious and cultural backgrounds and both identify as feminists. We kept some traditions and ditched others - do whatever makes you happy.

Some kinda non-standard things we did:

• We got married in a venue that was a essentially a large green house with gardens that were a public park. It was beautiful and not a religious building, but we had a religious ceremony there, which meant we had to go to the registry office another day to do the legal bit. We had my mum and DH's brother as our witnesses in the registry office, and then my dad and DH's granddad as our witnesses at our big day - DH's family is quite complex and fractured. Neither of his parents attended our wedding day.
• We named our tables after scientists, and provided an info card about each one on each table, and the favours we picked were related to the scientist/their work, so different on each table (but all keyrings).
• I walked down the aisle after our bridesmaids and page boys but I walked myself and was not given away.
• The person who officiated our religious ceremony was a woman which is highly unusual in my religious tradition, and did not wear traditional dress.
• Our flowers were done by my local florist.
• My hair and make-up were done by a family-friend who has known me since I was little (and is a qualified beautician and hairdresser).
• We have a marriage contract that includes clauses of our own making that we review on our anniversary each year and make changes to if appropriate.
• We asked if guests wanted to give us a gift that we would prefer money to pay for a honeymoon as otherwise we wouldn't have been able to afford one (we went to Paris in November as it was about all we could afford - but we had a lovely time!).
• We already lived together before we got married.
• We only had a small wedding cage so we didn't cut it at the wedding as there wouldn't have been enough for all the guests, haha. We paid a bridesmaid's younger sister to make the cake for us as she was at college studying catering.
• I wore flat shoes!
• I didn't wear a veil.
• There was a bar, but our drinks package that we provided was entirely non-alcoholic.
• Our invitations were cheap ones from Card Factory.

So elope then! If you want to 'be married' without having a wedding, run away and do it somewhere else.

Could I just sounds a small note of caution about asking friends who do something for a living to do it free for your wedding ?

I'm not sure this is very fair or very socialist.

Only exception woudl be of they are very close friends or family and they offer. Eg friend who is a photographer might charge hundreds ££ to do that . Would You expect them to spend that much on your wedding gift ? Also you will spoil the day for them , they can't relax because they are at work .

I know someone who did this, almost all the guests were invited because they could do something , and hardly any friends or family . It wasn't a good day , lots of people felt a bit used. The hairdresser pulled out the night befroe as she was asked to do more and more for nothing .

One person composed the music for the event and flew from another country to perform, then found they didn't even have a hotel room .

Sorry, don't mean to rain on your parade .

Another suggestion is hire out a youth hostel for an overnight. This used to cost something on a par with hiring a "venue" venue for the day/evening, is more sturdy than a marquee in the case of inclement weather, and at least you can kick back in your pajamas as the evening wears on.

Again you would need to find an approved building in which to have the legal part of the marriage ceremony, but you can do this separately to the celebration if you want to.

Someone asked why you would want a humanist celebrant at a pagan wedding. OP said she has a celebrant - I think she mentioned an interfaith vicar - but my thinking is that humanism is a set of values that can sit separately from religious faith, and one needs to have a celebrant who is legally able to conduct the wedding ceremony, and I think that a humanist celebrant is? I might be mistaken on this one. It was a suggestion, essentially.

OP: it sounds as if you have a lot of ideas. Planning a wedding is stressful, and expensive, and I am not sure how easy it is to make it anti-capitalist but I think one can make it non-capitalist, sort of neutral, if one is careful. I am not sure our wedding was markedly feminist but I did not feel it was particularly anti-feminist. It is possible to have what you want as long as you know what the legal requirements are for a marriage in the country in which you get married. The rest of it all is entirely optional, dress, wedding favours, flowers, gifts, guests, everything.

I agree with you kr1stina - only one of our friends is a professional photographer but we have about 4 other very good amateurs. I've been offered the use of a friend's PA and have been told on the side by his wife that his band may play for free (I.e. Food and drink which I think is entirely fair), and the 2 DJs we know would probably do mates rates (one of them is DPs muck-about-down-the-park-and-call-it-football mate but we would need to do it off festival season for him, the other was a good friend of his former house mate so a little less likely). We're having a bride's maids meeting in November so I'm kind of thinking what talents they have and how willing they would be to muck in - I have a very crafty bridesmaid who is also top at research (research assistant), one who is top at organisation, logistics and dispute resolution (works in HR), my maid of (dis)honour is great at being cheapskate in the best way possible, and a law student who is great with a camera. As for other people - the only other professional we were going to ask something from was one of DPs best men who is a part time artist, and I think I would rather offer payment - I know there's no way in a million years he'd take it for designing invites but I want to offer it. We have several knitters, and I'm starting to collect crafty bits I like that don't cost much for decorations - but that's dependent on the venue so much too!

As for hiring youth hostels - they start from nearly 2k! Ok, we have then got accommodation sorted, wet weather provision etc but it's not a cheap avenue still - unless we look at an off season day again? I'm thinking October half term could work well - still lots of things in bloom, it could still be warm enough to be outside but it's off season. I would say this sort of time but September is still seen as on season by many venues - maybe not YHA hostels (and where would I find non- YHA hostels?) as the kids are back at school/uni etc.

Sheesh, you are organised with a bridesmaids meeting ! I'd didn't know such things existed ! I just did it myself on the back of an envelope

I think the only way that the youth hostel thing works is to have guests stay overnight and ask for them to contribute towards the overnight accommodation. 50 people at £30 a night makes quite a difference , and I think that's reasonable as long as it's a modest charge and you are only trying to cover costs, not making a profit to subsidise other parts of the wedding that are purely for you eg dress, honeymoon

But you need a modernised hostel with lots of double / family rooms .unless your friends and all very young m you can't expect them to pay to bunk down in a dorm .

That might work, as I assume you are asking people not to bring gifts , given that's your event is ianti capitalist

You actually sound like you want a great big fancy wedding, with all this angsting about cake and dresses and wedding fairs. I married over 20 years ago, admittedly, but I didn't even know wedding fairs existed! I just got married, I don't feel the need to make an opera out of it. There seems to be a cognitive dissonance between what you claimed you wanted in the first post and what you are actually doing.

We had a big wedding, we started off saying we wanted a small one but ended up having over 180 guests (oops)

We got married in the miners institute, my mam walked me down the aisle, I had an equal number of male and female bridesmaids, we both double barrelled our names, we did readings that resonated with our beliefs, I refused to allow all the shitty wedding duties fall to me by default, and my mam did a speech.

I think it's hard because by its nature it's not easy to do an equal wedding I was furious I had to give my dads name and job and my mam wasn't even mentioned, why should the records only reflect the men?
Also I wish I'd done a speech but that's just because I love public speaking and having a captive audience of family and friends would be my dream come true (everyone else's nightmare I'm sure).

Also re photographers, your photos are so important. I didn't really understand that until after, they are your record of your day and though I don't spend all day everyday looking at them I do love looking through them. Other than my dress it was the most important purchase of the day.

For the dress as well I got mine made by a local dressmaker who was amazing, it was important to me that I didn't buy anything that had been made by exploited garment workers and I like to support local businesses when I can, I was originally going to buy second hand but i couldn't find anything that I loved. The dress maker who made my dress was phenomenal and it worked out way cheaper than buying from the rack.
Its dead lovely planning your wedding, I had so much fun and it's only stressful if you allow it to be.

We're having a bride's maids meeting in November so I'm kind of thinking what talents they have and how willing they would be to muck in.

It would be polite to your bridesmaids to let them know that this is what you are thinking, in advance of the meeting, so that they can think from their point of view about how much of their time and effort they would like to contribute to your wedding.

To be honest, I do not think it particularly feminist nor anti-capitalist to ask other people to give up their research, photography, or diplomacy skills for free for your wedding. There is a limit to what other people will do as goodwill for someone else' wedding. Beyond that, you run the risk of alienating the very people that you care about.

I am not sure that Youth Hostels start at £2K? I looked here. It looks as if the price depends on where in the country you are, the number of guests, and so on, and if you do not want a Youth Hostel as a venue, that is up to you.

I agree with whattheseithakasmean that it does sound as if you want a big , fancy wedding, with a dress, and decorations, and so on. That is not of itself a problem. However, pulling in favours from friends to achieve your vision does not make the wedding somehow socialist...

Frankly, there's only one answer: don't get married.
Absolutely every suggestion on this thread arises from the fact you want to marry. If you don't marry, they become superfluous. As a PP said, marriage will NOT have the legal consequences you seem to think it will AND the legal ends you seek to achieve CAN be sorted out without marriage (and at a fraction of the cost).
Marriage can be made into a very lovely thing but of itself it could hardly be further from anything you say you want.
So why do it?
(And if you do do it, please take some legal advice on the children as they are a completely separate issue that will need to be sorted out however much you do or don't blow on the wedding.)

Reading your posts it doesn't sound like you want a feminist/anti-capitalist celebration, it sound like you want a pretty traditional celebration but can't afford your vision.

There have been some good suggestions on this thread. Good luck creating something that works for you and your fiancé, I hope it turns out the way you want it to.

To be honest, I do not think it particularly feminist nor anti-capitalist to ask other people to give up their research, photography, or diplomacy skills for free for your wedding.

This times a million.

So I should pay my bridesmaids?

I'm regretting even making this post, I just feel like it's another jab in the back! I set out with good intentions and instead I get told that everything I think is wrong? What is traditional about having a a small celebration in a tent? There's no multi-tiered cake, chair decorations or white dress in sight.

So I should pay my bridesmaids?

I do not think that you should pay your bridesmaids. The wedding that you describe sounds quite traditional to me, in that you have a number of components that traditionally constitute a wedding celebration: bridesmaids, a cake, a photographer, decorations. Many wedding celebrations use a marquee or other temporary structure to accommodate their guests. What comes across is that you have a number of requirements and that you do not have a budget that will allow you everything that you want to have, and that you plan to compensate for this gap by pulling in favours from talented friends whom you expect to donate their skills to your wedding with little or nothing in return. I don't think that this is a particularly feminist way to facilitate or make possible the celebration that you have in mind. An alternative solution may be necessary - you might need to think laterally. For example, creative individuals who are building their portfolio can sometimes use weddings as an opportunity to practise things like photography, forestry, hair and make-up skills, and so on. If you delight in making decorations yourself then by all means go ahead and do that. It is not reasonable to expect your bridesmaids to do the same. It is an honour to be asked to be someone's bridesmaid, but it is not an obligation, and some bridesmaids find it difficult to say no to assumptions or requests on behalf of the bride, and this might lead to a latent sense of being taken advantage of.

I'm sorry you feel like it's a jab in the back, it's not meant to be. I think posters are just suggesting you could have a little more awareness. Getting your bridesmaids to use their skills to sort your wedding to your requirements on your timescales with no reward is neither feminist or anti-capitalist, I'm afraid!

People will want to help out, but that should be on their terms with no expectation from you.

And I agree with erin - you do seem to want a traditional wedding with a few tweaks. That doesn't mean it all comes free! I was at a marquee wedding last week which didn't have chair decorations, the cake was cheese, no speeches, no giving away of the bride etc etc but it was still a very traditional event and by no means cheap to put on.

There a couple of other things that confuse me as well - if it's a feminist wedding, why are the women doing all the work ? Where is your partner and his / her bridesmaids / supporters / attendants in all this ? Are they doing all these things for free ?

And also I see that you are the primary carer for the child who lives with you, even though he is not your child but your partners . You suggest that you are part time - how are you making sure that your work pension is protected? Are you claiming the child benefit to protect your state pension?

It's risky to give up work / go part time to care for your own child , even more risky when it's someone else's . Especially when you are not yet married / civil partnered .

Do you have any children together ?

I'm sorry to raise all these boring financial matters on a fluffy wedding thead . But you did post in feminism so these issues seem relevant .

I was a bridesmaid at a wedding last year where the bride expected her bridemaids to do the flower arranging, photography, we paid for our own dresses (which is fine but she dictated to us which ones to buy and it's was over £100!) she expected us to have bridesmaids meetings, the wedding was three days long, we had a 'cake competition' for the dessert, and a 'tidying party' after, we arrived at the wedding venue a day before the guests to prepare the venue and she didn't provide any food! Her mother did her catering and forgot veggie options, and she couldn't enjoy the day because she was cooking. It put a massive strain on our friendship and to be honest I barely see her now. Her budget was 10k so she could have easily had a lovely wedding but instead wanted the biggest wedding she could have but imo if you can't afford a big wedding you should have a smaller one instead of expecting the guests to take the slack. That wedding cost me over £500 to attend all in all.
X

Feminist wedding - issues I'd think about:

Whether I need one at all (many of the legal issues can be sorted by other means - e.g. drawing up wills, mortgage as tenants in common etc. Some can't - for instance if you live in the SE and own a house, chances are the surviving partner would end up paying death duty on the house in the event of the other dying, unless you were married).

Personally, giving away the bride would be a no-no for me.

Wouldn't change my name (again, that's a personal one).

Would subvert the "no mothers' names" nonsense by getting them as witnesses.

No bloody bouquet throwing.

Speeches (if you really must have them) allocated fairly, not all blokes talking!

Children's entertainer, because we all know that however different we might want the world to be, childcare falls disproportionately on women, so if you want your female friends and relatives to be able to relax, think about how to make the do fun for their children.

Elope and have a couple of passers-by as witnesses.

Anti-capitalist

Elope and have a couple of passers-by as witnesses.

If you do want a big party, hold it in a community hall and ask friends who live locally if they'd be prepared to do a pot-luck lunch in place of giving you a gift - or (if, even better, you had a no gift rule) ask them if they'd bring a dish in exchange for you making a donation to the charity of their choice.

No gifts and/or donations to charity.

Hold the party somewhere sensible, i.e. somewhere that guests can get to by public transport, not out in the country in the middle of nowhere where anyone without cars will have to spring 50 quid each way for a taxi (can you tell I've been stung this way in the past?)

What is neither of the above (as people up thread have pointed out) is expecting to put on a big traditional do on the cheap by exploiting other people's unpaid labour. That is almost by definition the epitome of capitalism and anti-feminism.

I'm not working due to my health atm, hoping to go back part time but when I'm good and ready. We only have DSS and we rent so no issues there. A major reason is making it easier for me to get PR - a child arrangements order/residency order could cause major explosive behaviour from DSS's mother. His mates are fairly useless asides from lifting/shifting/set up etc - one of his friends is an artist, but otherwise I think it'll be them doing all the set up and clean up. Totally agree with children's entertainer for the day, that was on the list but I'm not sure about costs of that - I might just demand that the ushers have to be clowns for the day just as a wind up!

Eloping sounds like a good idea but I know DP wants the celebration. Village hall is a great idea but living in a city even social clubs are few and far between.

I hear you, OP. I worked in a wedding dress shop as a student and it made me loathe the whole wedding industry. I attended quite a few wedding fayres as part of the job, and like you say... Terrible. Body shaming, capitalist bullshit.

I also got married in a cool black and red dress which I wore again. We just did own vows in registry office, meal and drinks with our close family and friends. Spent less than a grand. Was a lovely day. And I did a speech! Very feminist

Church halls can be rented out cheaply in cities, even if you don't have a church wedding.

I agree about making the wedding really child friendly and not asking for gifts.

One major element would be to buy your rings from Green Gold or similarl, as mining for precious stones and metals is extremely exploitative.