rebranding TERF

[PosieReturningParker]

I want to rebrand TERF and have some ideas about alternatives.

3Fs. Feminism for females
FCF female centred feminism

And I'm going to use #DEW Don't Erase Women

Or DEF females

[teawamutu]

@Gooders1105

Why are we jumping to the argument about prisons? I’m honestly stunned at the glee with which people are revelling in being called a TERF. I don’t think feminists should give much attention to this; I think challenging the patriarchy is more important. I bet all those who benefit from patriarchal systems (mainly men) are loving this. Whilst feminists argue about this, other issues are neglected

What is a more fundamental demonstration of patriarchy than locking vulnerable women up with intact male sex offenders because we don't want to make the intact male sex offenders sad?

[CheeseMmmm]

Given that loads of posters on this old thread have left, I don't think they will be accusing you of shutting them down! They won't even see this.

If it hadn't been resurrected (why?) then there wouldn't be anything to shut down anyway :/

And people are responding so that's good right?

What things SHOULD women be focusing on rather than this?

And why not raise prisons?

[CheeseMmmm]

Don't be silly tea.

I'm sure a list will be given any moment to show what things women should care about and what they should ignore.

[Waitwhat23]

The vitriol here? Seriously, check out //www.terfisaslur.com for an idea of what vitriol is.

And it is men who are benefitting from this. Self ID is a safeguarding nightmare in terms of allowing predatory men, whoever they identify, to access vulnerable women.

And I consider women being forced to self exclude from rape crisis services to be a feminist issue. I'm surprised that anyone doesn't, frankly.

[CheeseMmmm]

I agree that everyone female should be very accepting of any male who is in places they aren't expected to be.

In fact I've seen it stated that acceptance should be demonstrated by being overtly welcoming.

I think that's a lovely idea and all women and girls should do this. I see no issues at all.

Remember. If anything does happen-
They weren't really trans
It can be reported to... Someone.. after it's happened.

Totally reasonable.

[Gooders1105]

CheeseMmmm

Gooders-

It's about sex not gender. Some trans people are female. Shocker! Male. Female. Not tricky.

I don’t get what you mean here. What’s not tricky?

[Whitefire]

I was simply pointing out what can result in being called a TERF.

It's not glee, it is just so meaningless as to be worthy of little more than a hand swat.

[Gooders1105]

When had locking up trans women (who are still intact as you put it) with female prisoners ever happened?

[Gooders1105]

I’m putting forward another opinion. I’m not telling you what to think.

[HelplesslyHoping]

FCF is perfect, it's inclusive and represents all women. Transphobes can use their own terms

[Whitefire]

Karen White

[Gooders1105]

@CheeseMmmm

I agree that everyone female should be very accepting of any male who is in places they aren't expected to be.

In fact I've seen it stated that acceptance should be demonstrated by being overtly welcoming.

I think that's a lovely idea and all women and girls should do this. I see no issues at all.

Remember. If anything does happen-
They weren't really trans
It can be reported to... Someone.. after it's happened.

Totally reasonable.

But all these scenarios don’t seem to have any evidence in reality. Does anyone on this thread know anyone who is trans?

[Whitefire]

I'll even save you the Google.

www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-45825838.amp

[Waitwhat23]

At least a 163 but almost impossible to tell as its not necessary to have a GRC. If the person has a GRC, they are counted as a woman in the stats.

//www.keep-prisons-single-sex.org.uk

There was also a recent judicial review brought by a woman raped in prison by a transwoman in which the MOJ admitted they have no idea of the numbers.

[CheeseMmmm]

What do you mean it hasn't happened?

It demonstrably has here and more than once. And other inmates have been attacked. And even if not attacked. Saying communal showers are awful. The male inmate staring etc.

In California a well known civil rights org is taking a group/ woman to court to stop any data about males in women's estate being supplied.

[Whitefire]

Get those bingo cards out.

"Never happens"

"Do you know anyone who is trans?"

Just to start us off.

Do we need a reverse one though as well?

Prisons

Karen White

[Gooders1105]

@Waitwhat23

The vitriol here? Seriously, check out //www.terfisaslur.com for an idea of what vitriol is.

And it is men who are benefitting from this. Self ID is a safeguarding nightmare in terms of allowing predatory men, whoever they identify, to access vulnerable women.

And I consider women being forced to self exclude from rape crisis services to be a feminist issue. I'm surprised that anyone doesn't, frankly.

That website was grim. Horrible. But that’s like saying everyone who is British is a racist because of a small section of British people who post racist tweets.

[Gooders1105]

@Whitefire

Get those bingo cards out.

"Never happens"

"Do you know anyone who is trans?"

Just to start us off.

Do we need a reverse one though as well?

Prisons

Karen White

A link to Karen White? I don’t know who presumably she is

[bordermidgebite]

I won't post a link to Karen white because it's a tad lazy on your part not to notice the first hit on google when you search that name!

[CheeseMmmm]

Well yes gooders. I mean trans is very broad now.

In my DD friendship group at school- about 7 girls- about 5 have a trans ID. 4 have changed their names, 2 formally with school and the others informally.

With DD I have tried hard to remember the new names and to say they generally. As you know. I'm not an arsehole. None are interested in more than changed names and pronouns so you know whatever.

I've also been in situations where males with/without any external gender expression have queued for the ladies. Everyone turned a blind eye. DH was like wtf that's a bloke. What can we do? Challenge is hate. Just look the other way.

[Waitwhat23]

I'm going to assume that you are here in good faith and genuinely don't know about the chilling effect, women being forced from employment, academics being silenced, MP's being sent credible rape and death threats, women being doxxed etc etc.

All for the 'crime' of stating that women should be able to retain single sex spaces, rights and services.

The backlash against women is endemic in society. Not a few extremists.

[CheeseMmmm]

Gooders I don't understand as a person with strong views on this how you can't have heard of KW TBH.

[FallonCarringtonWannabe]

TWERF. Because I include transmen. As they face biological female issues.

[FallonCarringtonWannabe]

But all these scenarios don’t seem to have any evidence in reality.

Really? Because they do. Theres lots of evidence. How much research have you done exactly?