do i need to say lighthearted here?

[PassiveAgressiveQueen]

ok so i have just realised i identify as a rad fem...
what do i do next?

And your point? Do I have to proclaim "I am a feminist" before being allowed to have an opinion on prostitution or Marxism? Both bad ideas.

Presumably squdzin wants more women to be interested in feminism? if so aligning it with Marxism seems, to me, an odd way to drum up support.

Lass, I am quite sure most of us want more women to be interested in, you know, the actual liberation of women.

Not just a thing that is called feminism.

"Drumming up support" by watering down feminism until it is not recognizable as feminism any more is what liberal feminists are doing, and doing quite well.
As we talk about radical feminism here, I see no point in trying to do the same thing.

It's perfectly possible to be a liberal feminist and be opposed to prostitution. However I think many liberal feminists regard sex work in a pragmatic, capitalist way rather than an idealistic "political" way. iYSWIM.

There are people wh call themselves sex positive feminists who are very much in favour of prostitution. They are the sort of feminists men tend to like best.........

"I'm happy living in a secular, liberal, capitalist economy and would not want either as a woman or a person to change that."

But capitalism is bad for women. Capitalism benefits from patriarchy for all sorts of reasons. I'm not a Marxist, but I am a socialist and I can see a lot of overlap between the two movements.

I wasn't offering myself as a liberal feminist. It was an example of some one who is not a feminist , radical or otherwise , but who can still see what is wrong with prostitution.

Given that being opposed to legalising prostitution is, according to those who support it, now the preserve of radical feminists and the religious right I would have thought it might be helpful to be aware of support from someone who is neither. Apparently not.

Lass- do you think that you should be a self determining individual with equal rights in all areas; social, economic and political?

As we talk about radical feminism here, I see no point in trying to do the same thing

On this thread in paricular? Or this forum in general?

Forum says nothing about it only being for radfems , nor for that matter, does the thread.

Lass, to me it seems like you are trying to tell us how to do feminism.

I am fully aware that there are non-feminists who are opposed to prostitution. Actually, I am rather sure that most women who never have encountered sex-pozzies or the "if men don't get to rape prostitutes, they will rape YOU!" propaganda, are opposed to prostitution because they know they would not want to do it, so why would other women? Simple intuition.

There are many liberal feminists, especially second wave liberal feminists, who are opposed to prostitution and pornography.

Liberal feminism is unfortunately these days heavily identified with "anything goes" choice feminism. That is not really what it is. It is feminism focused on equality and the reform of existing political and societal structures to achieve equality. Hillary Clinton is a liberal feminist, for example.

The initial post of this thread says "I identify as rad fem" ... so ... yes, it does somewhat steer the discussion in that direction.

Seneca, absolutely.

And in Germany, the sex-pozzie wave has not yet reached all the remote islands; being against prostitution is rather standard in liberal feminism.

When I write "libfems" I mean that specific brand of liberal feminism that is also trans-inclusive and pro-prostitution, if you know what I mean.

Lass, to me it seems like you are trying to tell us how to do feminism No I am not - unless you are suggesting only radical feminism is the approved form on here.I'm not telling you how to do anything.

There was a thread a while back about about whether it was possible to be a feminist and not left wing. Several posters on that thread identified as feminist and not left-wing. Squdzin and others are of the view feminists should ally with Marxism or Socialism.

Yy to that Seneca.

An interesting read is The Long March about the early days of Mao. Some terrible things were done in the name of progress but there were some interesting themes. Women joining the long march to escape forced marriage, poverty and servitude. Soldiers in the Chinese forces being amazed that the Maoists didn't rape prisoners and townspeople. All female Maoist squads, who would disguise their voices so the opposing forces didn't know they were female.

It was interesting that Mao was so adamant that no rape would happen in his army, women would be foot soldiers and women would be 'equal', when China at the time was still so incredibly entrenched in hideous treatment of women (foot-binding for example).

Christ, is Hilary Clinton a "Feminist" now? In the same way as Beyonce I presume.

She's going to win isn't she.

YY MrsTerryP

Sorry PAQ that your lovely light hearted thread got ruined. I sort of knew it would do.Seems non feminists won't allow feminists to have a sense of humour about it all.

The cup cakes sold really well, and, along with a few other things raised over £300 for the local hospice. Hope you all enjoyed your virtual ones!

I'm sorry.

Not you squids! Don't be daft!

No squdzin Not you playswell meant me althougb you at least seemed to find Mrs Terry's contribution about Maoism quite interesting which followed on from what I said.

I'm surprised you don't think Hilary Clinton is a feminist. I'm sure she thinks she is.

Well, I made a non-humorous post, too, Lass, so perhaps I am at fault.

It is ok, it appears my superficial reading was too superficial, i don't want to be a marxist