Cisgender Lesbians & Trans Women

[kellyandthecat]

www.slate.com/blogs/outward/2015/02/16/cisgender_lesbians_and_trans_women_how_to_mend_the_rift.html

I am a straight 'cisgender' woman but a friend of mine in America posted this article and I thought it was really interesting to think about 'other' kinds of women. I cant say I know very much about it or feminism with a capital F since I left university but this article definitely makes what it calls TERFS - 'trans-exclusionary radical feminists' look quite bad so I was wondering if anyone on MN had read it and had any thoughts. No one in my house ever wants to have a chat about this stuff

What if I told you I find 'cis' an othering term in itself?

what do you mean by that LineRunner?

This is a fraught topic with very strong feelings on both sides. I hope you are sincere-the thought of someone stirring that particular hornet's nest for the LOLs is pretty unpalatable.

Anyway, on the Feminism Chat board you will find a lot of threads that cover the various arguments about the term 'cis', trans people generally and so-called 'TERFs' very fully.

Simple enough question.

And MonstrousRatbag's advice is very good.

I'm sorry MonstrousRatbag I haven't posted on this board before I should have read below. I'd never heard of this before today to be honest.

Did not mean to cause offense!

OP, if you search the site there is a lot of discussion.

If either of you have a link to such a thread I'd appreciate it!

Absolutely hate the term CIS

There's a good article you could read here to learn a bit more about the TERF term and the bullying behaviour of many of the people who use it.

Thread 1

Thread 2

I lurked on both and found them hugely informative and helpful in figuring out my own stance on these issues.

Thank you BunnyLebowski

And OddBoots!

I've got about half way through the other post and can definitely see why I should have done more research. is there some way to delete posts? i can see why people thought i was being too flippant

the tone of the article i posted made it seem like a more friendly disagreement but now i can see how fraught it is

If you do do that analysis, would you share it please, Buffy?

One of the authors of the article is deeply problematic for me, so, although I've read it, I had difficulty seeing past the screams of TERF that they are known for.

Nope, not tired of it.

I still might not have the first clue what epistemwhateveritis means, but you do explain things well

See! I now get it. I can't spell it, but I know what it is now.

Definitely a lot more to read and study but I really liked this post from the other post.

"So I can see, from the outside, how this impasse might develop between some feminists and transactivists: one group feels oppressed by never being allowed much of a voice or entitlement to space, often enforced by violence. Another group feels more entitled to voice and space, but feels oppressed both by patriarchy and by the movement that resists a gender binary: feminism. When these two groups attempt dialogue, feminists perceive some of that male entitlement that they identify as the source of their oppression, while transwomen feel excluded by the very people fighting for the gender with which they identify. It is a problem that only mutual respect and understanding can begin to solve, and name calling by either side (TERF or 'man') or trying to set boundaries around what people can say or how aren't helpful"

I found this article very offensive. I don't see any TAs telling men to accept penis or be labelled bigots or transphobes.

Buffy I think the language issue is very important on this issue. IMO a lot of the problems come from using the word "gender" instead of "sex". I can't link ATM but the WHO definitions for sex and gender should be required reading for any discussion.