So, not everyone's a feminist

[Vivacia]

Plasterer arrived today for the first of four days. I am working from home but everyone else is out.

So far we've had,

"You're not one of these modern women are you?" - don't know, not sure what that means.

"Are you a feminist?" - "Of course I am, aren't you?".

[Glovender]

I posted in the current Ched Evans and Foetus' rights threads and have read some of your contributions buffy across those and other threads. What's creepy about that? You do realise 'creepy' is a word women use to shut down men?

I am not twisting anything, but I don't see a need to go back to those to quote directly. However, if you'd like to talk about twisting, then we could reflect on the fact that, of all the people on this thread, only the OP really knows what happened; not the faintest shred of actual context is present beyond the bare mechanics of the setting. A collection of FWR posters can find no explanation for those quotes other than bare-faced misogyny, so that must be what it was and so there is universal agreement: his employer should be notified; his online reputation trashed; his potential for sexual violence can be slyly referred to ("I'd feel very uncomfortable being alone in a house with a man that felt entitled to make those sort of comments...").

I'm not an MRA - any movement that seeks to equate male circumcision with FGM deserves all the derision in the world.

[TeWiSavesTheDay]

What is your possible explanation that makes talking about porn in front of a stranger perfectly reasonable then?

Forget about class, we've already established that doesn't make sense and is extremely rude to working class people.

[FreudiansSlipper]

Maybe it because we have experienced the behaviour of men like the op in describing far too often thankfully though not always making a complaint is now acceptable and not something we just have to put up with

or maybe in your world women like to invite men round to their homes on the pretence of wanting work done and what they really want is to discuss watching porn online

[Glovender]

Did he talk about porn TeWi? Without referring back, I seem to remember that a tiny part of a conversation was quoted by someone that had already decided were the conversation was going that was, to the effect, "computers are only good for watching porn on". That sounds suspiciously like a really poor and crass attempt at humour to me. But, perhaps you are like Freud and you have already decided from all your previous experiences how all new experiences are and don't need to know any more. Misogyny is the only possible explanation. Hang him.

And therein lies my point; if you are convinced that the world is full of men wanting to remind women of their place then all you will see is men trying to put women in their place... and you'll see it before it even happens.

[Glovender]

BTW - I'm out.

[TeWiSavesTheDay]

If you can't see sexism right in front of your face then we can't help you.

[FreudiansSlipper]

Glover do you not think many of us have experienced this and know how so often it plays out and do not want to put up with it or for other woman to have to deal with such behaviour

Why should have to put up with men taking about watching porn when they feel it is appropriate

[PetulaGordino]

we have already been designated irrational, hysterical, and irrelevant

[FreudiansSlipper]

and we do not have a sense of humour

[Glovender]

I really am trying to move on from my contribution to this thread...! I wonder, though, if any of you could explain to me what the OP said to the plasterer to make him enquire as to whether she was a feminist. I'd be grateful if you could also let me know what the OP said just prior to him saying he thought computers were only any use for watching porn on.

[Glovender]

But then, given that I've supposedly said you are all irrational, hysterical and irrelavant coupled with being possessed of no sense of humour whatsoever, perhaps it isn't important what was actually said. Perhaps we can just twist things however we like so as to suit our pov.

There is genuine sexism and oppression and inequality in the world. There are also people who have made a bit of a hobby out these miseries and, let's be honest, Mumsnet FWR isn't an important forum for the advancement of women's rights is it. It's procrastination for people that did or are doing a Women's Studies PhD.

[Glovender]

Lol at justthe There's a lot of imagining going on there.

[FreudiansSlipper]

I am not sure the op can answer

I have had these or similar remarks made to me when the discussion has not gone that way at all I am sure I am not the only one

And as for the porn point far too often conversations have been steered that way how it's come about is simply the man or men I have been talking to have wanted to mention porn

Why because women were just expected to put up and shut up when being told their opinions are stupid or feelings are not valid and sadly too many men and some women still feel
women create too much fuss about how they expect to be treated

[FreudiansSlipper]

If this forum educates one woman or helps them stand up to everyday sexism then it is working

Which it has done

[TheBogQueen]

It's just a man being a twat.

I'd tell him to make his own fucking tea, shut the door and get on with my life.

I don't think I'd start pontificating about 'the working class' male and all their deprivation and consequent vulgarity.

[Pepperwitheverything]

I have an uncle who speaks like this. It is repulsive and one day I finally had enough. He started asking me about my love life with my husband...at first I was polite as he is my dad's brother and is in his eighties, so I brushed it off and muttered something about DH being in front of the computer that day as usual (he is a network engineer so that's his job).

Anyway, uncle laughed and said he must be watching porn as what else is it for. That was it...enough!! I told him loudly and firmly he was not to disrespect me like that again or my husband and also himself. I didn't wait around to hear his reply....I was embarrassed for him and for myself and how he had made me feel. Also angry that so many men think they can talk like that. It's disgusting.

[Glovender]

Now now Buffy, what I actually said was that a regular FWR poster, who had already posted about expecting sexism, had reported to her FWR friends the guilty bastard ('march in the') making a reference to porn. With no further ado, said FWR friends - needing no further evidence (because of their vast experience in this matter) - pronounced the guilty bastard guilty and encouraged the OP to report the matter and be on her guard against possible escalation because it is a well-known fact amongst FWR posters that whenever one person mentions porn to another person it is an attempt to reinforce the strict patriarchal controls on women and that:

• there is no possibility that this was a crass and clumsy attempt at humour.
  

- there is no possibility that the OP is anything other than an honest broker.

• there is no possibility that was a highly privileged person lecturing someone of less privilege on the importance of equality such that the latter took a cheap shot at the former being somewhat irked at the former's haughty didactic utterances.
  

My own guess is my original one. This was a rough and ready sort attempting a bit of clumsy 'I'm not into all that PC nonsense' banter with someone who, regrettably is rather into all that PC nonsense. The problem here is that, if you inherently believe that normal society is sexist, then people that act normally within society are also going to be seen by you as exhibiting sexist behaviour.

[PetulaGordino]

is me seeing you exhibiting sexist behaviour right here glovender just part of my own inherent expectation that i will experience sexism?