What would you do if a university student wanted to bring her newborn to class?

[camaleon]

That is really. I have to make a decision regarding this. I need advice. I want to accommodate this student as much as possible but I am very aware of disrupting other students' learning experience.
What would you do?

"If you aren't able to dedicate your time to a university degree, why are you there?"

I'm boggling at this and similar comments.

I also went to a very good university a very long time ago, and a degree was something people fitted in between drinking, caving, rugby, drama, politics, etc. There mightn't have been many (small) children on site, but I just don't recognise this monk-like, contemplative existence some posters seem to refer to.

Eleanor. Nobody is suggesting that the university should provide childcare when you can't arrange babysitting (although perhaps we should). The uni is not paying for childcare or loking after baby in any way. The student has no right to stay. She is only allowed to stay if it does not disturb others. There are no duties to ensure she can continue her studies.

Buffy -- certainly no offence to your field intended

I suppose I just really don't relate to this apparently feminist ideal of being able to take your children absolutely everywhere (health and safety excepted).

I'm more of a 'room of one's own' kind of gal. Men have been able to pursue their intellectual space and identity unencumbered for centuries, and I don't see why I shouldn't be able to as well.

My feminist agenda does not include the collective raising of children, but the equal raising of children between men and women. So I disagree that being a good feminist means I need to tolerate people's children everywhere.

I'm really sorry, I've only just seen this and I've been working from 7 this morning until about an hour ago - but I would be perfectly happy.

I teach undergraduate classes.

I would want you to talk both to me (teacher) and the course convenor. However, I would fight your corner.

You would need to leave if your baby was disturbing the lesson. But I wouldn't at all mind you coming.

(I mean, I've only just seen this so not catching up on the thread yet.)

Alternating activities is refreshing. It's not the same thing as trying to do 2 things at once.
Being on skype doesn't stop your baby distracting you but it does keep it away from everyone else.

Fascinated by the number if people on this thread who would apparently be fine working and doing childcare at once. What do you all do? Can you really think straight? As straight as without them?

I would a million times prefer a 4 hour clear run at a job,alone, knowing my kids were safe and happy with someone else, and then time to give them my full attention, than a whole day or even 2 trying to get through something that seems endless because I keep wiping bums and noses and answering questions. Of course the latter is cheaper.

Btw, sorry if this is stupid ... but can the class be recorded? Then she could at least listen and catch up. We record lectures here and I believe it helps.

dusk, I have taught a student who had to cope with intense pain as well as studying. It was awful, and I have no idea how she managed - but she did. No need to assume people can't multitask.

Of course it is a pity anyone is in a situation where they need to, but we do live in an imperfect world, and until these issues are sorted out, it seems unfair to penalize women for them.

It was some years ago and in the States, but a law school classmate of mine gave birth shortly before the end of our last year; she brought the baby to class (no one had a problem with this as far as I know), and carried her daughter in her arms when going up to receive her diploma at graduation, to a standing ovation. It was lovely.

That does sound lovely.

A mate of mine is shortly to finish her PhD with her little one in tow, and my friend is teaching a woman who had a very unexpected baby in the second year of undergrad - she's on course for a good first.

Lrd this student will be presenting. I would be interested in your views if you have time to rtft

I've read the thread now. I did read if before I replied to you, sorry.

I don't see what difference it makes. My student who was in pain presented. She was perfectly decent at it.

What shocks me is that it would seem it's perfectly ok to make allowances for all sorts of other issues - but not for what is essentially sexism.

I think a lot of this thread suggests people have a very low opinion of what students can manage - apparently, no noise is allowed, no disruption, even that of someone leaving the room. I wonder how people who require these working conditons ever get jobs?! Imagine how absurd you would look if you told an employer 'oh, I can work for you, but I warn you, I will be terribly distracted if anyone ever has to interrupt a presentation for an important conference call, and I can't cope with noise so no-one must ever use the phone'.

I think it is patronizing to my students to pretend this is what current undergraduates would really think.

Newborns aren't a problem normally, (see what procrastration said at 17.15) it is other people's reactions to them that cause distractions - cooing, wanting a hold etc.

But perhaps those people should learn?

As has been said upthread, when women were allowed into higher education, they were 'distracting' because it was claimed men couldn't 'help' wanting to stare at them or grope them. When non-white men were allowed into the military in the US and UK, likewise, it was claimed to be a distraction.

LRD, if a baby is no more distracting than a phone call, I assume you let your students accept phone calls during class? They can just step out of the room, after all.

Should everyone be allowed to bring their babies to work, given that they're so non-distracting?

Surely the best way to resolve this debate would be for the OP to trial it and let us know?

I took my DS aged two and up to occasional uni seminars and lectures. He now attends occasional meeting, ditto my 8 month old DD. Both behave brilliantly. We always leave before tiredness erupts. And the lecturer/meeting conveyor is always told in advance that they will be attending due to childcare lapses. Not asked if ok, but informed they would be there. I want to continue my studies and work, I also have a family. Sometimes the two worlds collide!!! And it is always fine. Let her come.

I didn't say a baby was more distracting than a phone call, because I think there is a distinction to be made.

To a student who is taking a phone call, it's distracting. To a student who is in pain, that is distracting. To a student who is depressed, that is distracting.

Many things distract individual students, and the thing that enables those students to succeed is a bit of understanding and help.

To a student who is in the room when a phone goes off - no, IMO, it's not wildly distracting. Why would it be? Most of my students are familiar with the sound of phones. Today, I taught a class where the fire alarm went off by accident. They paused for all of 15 seconds, stood up (as did I), but when it went off and we realized it was an error, the student who was speaking carried on mid-sentance. Why wouldn't he?

I would have absolutely no issue with a student who informed me first stepping out of class to take an important phonecall. I don't see why this is bad?

I have not had time to read the thread, sorry. But i presented and interviewed for my current job with an 8 week old breastfed baby. This was some ten years ago, and maybe things are going backward, but I personally would have no issues with a student bringing a new baby to class if it was feeding and sleeping. It would be a bit hypocritical. Besides, I would rather an obvious baby than surreptitious texting, or whatever else. I don't think it is ideal for longer term, but you are really talking one semester/term.

That said, it depends on the baby. I was in post by the time I had dc2, who would scream the place down if we dared leave the house. He would not have been settled at all. I have done far less with him than dc1. You can review the situation if needs be.

I don't know, not being a parent, but it seems to be they are the same in essential ways.

If someone has to take a phone call for some reason - eg., their family member is dying, or they cannot reschedule a call about debt, or similar - then they must take that. It disadvantages them of course. But we are talking about adults here, who chose to take this course.

Other students need not be affected.

The comparison with going out to dinner is one of social mores, which are different. Actually, sorrry, I would be annoyed if someone fed a baby for 20 mins and never talked to me! If they told me so beforehand, fine. But not if they just decided to do it and never addressed a word to me.

I'm sorry but I've never been in a classroom where a student would be allowed to answer the phone during class, take the call and step out. Of course it's distracting! Not just for that student either.

Perhaps students change?

After all, it used to be said that 'of course' women students were distracting, didn't it?

I prefer to expect my students will rise above trivialities. And actually, they really do. You would be surprised. They are very, very focussed - it is their education, after all.

I was in the classroom three years ago LRD. I'm not that old!

Women probably were distracting at first, but that's not enough reason to deny them access, because the alternative is women not being educated at all.

Babies are distracting, but they don't actually need to be there. That's the difference.