Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Original poster

a question for the men here

999 replies

Mitchy1nge · 29/01/2013 01:01

what makes you think you have anything of real value to bring to discussions about women's experiences and expectations?

obviously some men can make interesting contributions (although those sorts of men don't often announce themselves here) to some discussions but generally, on the whole, everything everywhere else is already pretty saturated in Male Voice so was just wondering where you got the idea from

OP posts:
Beachcomber · 31/01/2013 20:14

It must be so hard.

Really wanting to fight misogyny but being thwarted by the pointlessness of it all.

(Didn't The Smiths write a navel gazing album song about something similar? Sorry any Smiths fans but really )

MoreBeta · 31/01/2013 20:16

AF/Sabrina - I have read back through DadDancers posts three times now and from what I can gather there is some sort of history on a series of threads of things he has said about lapdancing clubs. I havent read those threads so I cant comment.

FWIW I have never been in any sort of 'gentlemans club' and feel really uncomfortable with the idea of them and I have said it a few times on various threads. There is only a certain number of times I can post the same thing though.

You and others have made your point of view known to him and I dobt he will change his mind.

Hullygully · 31/01/2013 20:16

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

SabrinaMulhollandJjones · 31/01/2013 20:17

Yes - where did all the other blokes go??

I'm totally gobsmacked by pan's response to this.

Not one man stood up on a recent thread in FWR when a male troll poster started posting a load of tripe about the rape conviction rates 'not being nearly as bad women make out' either.

Why not - why don't you men speak out about this?

Hullygully · 31/01/2013 20:18

and here's another one!

good job the slaves didn't decide it was a bit pointless to keep on demanding freedom

ffs

Beachcomber · 31/01/2013 20:18

I havent read those threads so I cant comment.

I'm sure that was one of the lyrics.

RM76 · 31/01/2013 20:18

Part of the problem is peer pressure. But some of it is simply not seeing it.
My Husband is wonderful, loathes sexism etc, but it sometimes, even with him, isn't in his field of vision.

I mean, I read the story about women being paid less, he did too, but then he didn't look beyond the fact that it is something to tut at.
I looked further, that the Lib dems promised to make audits on pay mandatory, and shock, horror, they now say companies can't afford to pay women equally.

I filled my husband in on this last night, partly because he is about to employ a lady at work and he needed to be aware of what other men he works with might do, as it's been proven that women of equal ability don't get the same starting wage, for various reasons.
Again though, although he hadn't perhaps thought to look deeply at this issue, when I told him about it he LISTENED, took it on board and will now do all he can to make sure the lady he employs really does get equal treatment.

Hullygully · 31/01/2013 20:19

oh the true colours are really fucking shining through tonigjt

LRDtheFeministDragon · 31/01/2013 20:21

beta - I know how you feel about feeling there's a limit to how often you (personally) can repeat something.

But IMO it's not about saying to individual posters 'why did you not do this long list of things' - it's the fact that none of the posters who identify as male on here seem to speak up. It's obviously quite a general thing.

There are plenty of options for speaking out but not doing so in such a way as to require a huge amount of justifying or sounding as if you're speaking 'for' women instead of in support of them - I suggested a couple of ways and FF suggested an excellent one of saying 'you don't speak for me'.

Are we invisible?

Hullygully · 31/01/2013 20:21

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

Pan · 31/01/2013 20:22

Well this has taken a weird path. I'd indicated as to why I don't personally engage and take issue, on threads, with some some male posting rubbish - for reasons of tactic and ultimate pointlessness in many cases. Being a coward? Au contraire. Anyone can be brave on the internet, if that's what they want to do.

AnyFucker · 31/01/2013 20:23

MB you betcha there's a history Smile

Hullygully · 31/01/2013 20:23

everyone is being very nice but fuck that

if you dont speak up, you're condoning it

simple

RM76 · 31/01/2013 20:23

Wouldn't have posted that last one if I'd seen the posts coming in as I typed it, this is all getting a bit nasty, don't think I'll bother again.

LRDtheFeministDragon · 31/01/2013 20:27

pan, I'm sorry, but I don't follow what you're trying to say. We all saw you indicate why you personally don't engage. Now we're saying why we find that a bit poor. I don't understand* why you feel it should be the end of the discussion because you've given your views. We have a right to reply, too.

*this may not be the literal truth.

AnyFucker · 31/01/2013 20:27

and this is what posters like DD do

get people ripping chunks out of each other while they laugh up their sleeve

if blokes joined in with the "eww, go away yucky person" as soon as it appeared it wouldn't go this far

really, it wouldn't

and he'll be back...and the same old "strident" ones will get really fucking riled at the derailment and off we go again

Beachcomber · 31/01/2013 20:28

I haven't been on MN for ages - I have never encountered DadDancer before (thankfully) and I can see the misogyny in his posts and posting style as though they are a flashing beacon picked out in bright lights over Broadway.

And nary a word from all our earnest male posters.

(Hi Mitchy. Hope you are well.)

Hullygully · 31/01/2013 20:28

I'd rather talk to bob banana than this bloody shower of silent apologists

TotallyBS · 31/01/2013 20:30

In other words OP you want a bitching corner where like minded people can come to together a bitch about things.

Pan · 31/01/2013 20:31

Whoaa! Read the stuff? I don't 'fear' that label?! I do know tho' that the defensive response of the wanker will be to discount my view as coming from that angle. Much in the same way as any woman challenging those views will be equally discounted for other insulting reason. No more or less than that.

The overall struggle for equality of treatment isn't pointless ( crumbs I know that) - but trying to engage with some people who's views are 'set' certainly IS pointless and a waste ( when on the internet) of key strokes.

feministefatale · 31/01/2013 20:32

Um, actually be yes. Men have one it called the rest of the world

Hullygully · 31/01/2013 20:32

bollocks

LRDtheFeministDragon · 31/01/2013 20:32

No, it's not a waste.

But it is really nice of you to dismiss other people like that. Hmm

AnyFucker · 31/01/2013 20:33

You have a point, Pan, with the "what is the point" excuse. But hey, don't underestimate the power of a bit of solidarity. It's what gets us all through, sometimes.

feministefatale · 31/01/2013 20:33

You say that pan... But here you are arguing with us...and I don't think any of the women on this thread are apt to change our minds do you?