Should it be illegal for men to pay for prostitution?

[EatsBrainsAndLeaves]

Should we criminalise all men who pay for prostitution, alongside help for women to leave prostituion?

Reality - your presence on this thread is creepy enough. Coming over from punternet or wherever to try to 'educate' us? On a parenting forum - on a topic called 'feminism/womens rights chat'? Did you actually expect to be taken seriously?!

Reality you are being disingenuous. You know what the difference is, you just choose to ignore it.

Is there really a punternet?

Oh yes- apparently so.

Hi reality

If you had to choose between going back to work in B & Q and being anally penetrated, which would you choose?

Running eeew

Thedoctrineofennis Excellent question!

Saskia- I've read on MN that they rate the girls.

I'm not a prostitute, I wouldn't consider it at any price

Hmm. That sentence of Reality's says more than all the rest of his prolific posts combined.

That's exactly what I thought grimbletart.

To expect other people to do what he would never consider doing, but to make up in his head that it's because they want to shows an extraordinary level of cognitive dissonance.

Seriously, Reality, if they wanted to have sex with you, they'd do it for free. The fact that you don't care if they want to or not is horrid. If you want to have guilt-free sex in between GFs why don't you just ask a woman for casual sex for free?

BTW, what do your GFs think about your inter-GF activity?

leithlurker by 'normal' I meant relationships where both parties are equal, whether its through liking or loving someone. They are there through choice. I guess I did mean real rather than normal, I think you know what I mean without nitpicking.

I have never had a normal/real relationship , friendship or date where I have had to pay someone for their time company or sex.

As for grunternet, those of you who haven't seen it, don't look. You will wish you hadn't.

Interestingly, some grunternetters think that its scary that women like us are bringing up children.

Not nearly as scary as those men bringing up children whilst shagging prostitutes behind their mums backs and writing graphic reviews about them. You gotta laugh.

A few word's from someone in the know.
If prostitution was to be made illegal, myself and many other women would face the prospect of immediate poverty.
Before I had my children I worked in Advertising and Recruitment, I went to a private school, I have GCSE's and A levels (lol). So to suggest I can't get another job doing the same things again is unlikely.
To be honest I have no interest in returning to the sales industry, it's great when times are good, but when they aren't it's a great deal of pressure and you constantly worry about hitting targets and if you don't if you will still have a job.
How we choose to live our lives is what makes us individuals, I doubt anyone is a carbon copy of someone else, and why would they want to be?
My life fell apart due to the actions of my long term partner and I suddenly found myself alone with a 4 year old and a 10 month old baby.
So to cut a long story short I choose to sell my body. I aim to work in the short term to put my life back on track, perhaps a few years while I also undertake some training which may or may not lead to me landing a better job in the future.
Most clients I meet are nice and yes we do chat about personal lives, no point in being coy when you've both just been butt naked!
After a while you begin to weed out the mysoginists, haters, timewasters, etc.

indeed avaboosmummy,
what happens in private between consenting adults is no business of any moral supremacist
not the church,not the state, women must decide their fate

I totally agree with you both. The only thing I'm curious about punterpride is the question I asked realitychecker and didn't really get a proper answer- how you can enjoy sex with a woman who is only there because you are paying her? Do you detach yourself and think'wow I can't believe I'm shagging this lovely woman'
I guess you must. I just can't believe that men have no sense of shame or embarrassment that she is pretending.

Avaboo, I feel sad that you have been 'forced' into prostitution through poverty. If I really really had to I imagine I could switch off and have sex for money, but it would have to be a hell of a lot. I could not have sex with a 60 year old man for a hundred pounds that's for sure.(For example).

Really though, apart for sniggering at delusional males who buy into some girlfriend experience. Oh yeah, a 20 year old woman must really enjoy being a middle aged mans gf for an hour. And the women who make out its quite ok being a prostitute and the men are decent, I don't actually have any qualms. I don't claim to be a feminist. The only thing I hate to hear is married men cheating on their wives with prostitutes and thinking its no big deal. That's just yuck.

Hello thread,
Carmen- I think you've touched a nerve there ;-)
I'm a former sexworker not a punter so I'll try and answer.

I think a proportion kid themselves that we love having sex with them and others accept that it's a service given voluntarily. I don't expect my plumber to love fixing my leaks or my hairdresser to skip with joy at the prospect of a cut and blow dry. It is what it is.

Of course we market ourselves as being lusty nymphos anything other wouldn't draw any business.

Avaboo, the original post mentions help for women to leave prostitution alongside the proposed criminalisation of men. No-one supporting the OP would wish former prostitutes to be poverty stricken.

I do find it hard to reconcile your mention of immediate poverty with your confidence that you could find another job in your former line if work. I am sorry if fear of poverty and your life falling apart because of your partner have led you into something you would prefer not to do. Do you feel it was a free choice?

Yes, obviously there would have to be help for women leaving prostitution. Feminists are the last people to wish other women poor.

But, putting all that aside for a moment, does anyone think that the existence of the prostitution industry, the advertisement of services, and the mere knowledge that it happens has an effect on the general female populace?

I hear you when you say that you wouldn't have "sex with a 60 year old man for 100 pounds". I would, (for 150) but we come from different mindsets. I don't go into a booking expecting to derive any sexual pleasure from it, (and I never have) but then that is not why I was a hooker.

Money is why I had sex for money....and the flexible working patterns and the fact that often it's good fun.

I look on a booking the same way as I look upon cleaning behind the fridge. Sometimes disgusting, but the underneath of the fridge still has to be cleaned so you get on with it.

I walk away from an hours work with somwhere between 120-300 in my hand and in reality probably only 20mins of that has been exertion then I get on with my day. Weird and gross for you, meh for me.

Men are different animals.

It will do for the sex industry what it did for the drugs industry; push it underground into the hands of criminal gangs. There are already far too many criminal gangs running prostitution rings in this country due to the lack of regulation and the social stigma which stops punters and prostitutes talking publicly about their experiences.

The Swedish model looks great on paper, as does the war on drugs. All those druggies in prisons must mean that drugs are hard to find now and the war is a success, right? Sadly not, but the people who sit behind expensive desks in our judicial system only see what is written for them on paper, as do some in this thread it seems.

If you make prostitution illegal, it will indeed disappear, but only from the statistics on paper. The trade will continue in the dark, but maybe that is all that some people care about; sweep it under the rug and rejoice.

It's both strange and amusing to read about yourself being discussed as a 'problem'.

It's nice to see some new posters,

Ohbella plenty of things that people do can be legal but problematic. Discussing the issue is not meant to be a discussion of any one individual.

I know that Thedoctrine (BTW I'm not a new poster niceham/p-p-p-penguins/knivesforksspoons), but still, these discussions are directly relevant to me and yet completely alien. I'm actually starting to worry about these poor prostitutes.

Ohbella,

Well I can see what you are saying. Many of us do jobs that are not always nice. However, most of us do not have to take our clothes off and be intimate and perform sex acts or have sex acts performed on us in our line of work.

And yes I don't earn150 pounds an hour but its all relative isn't it. I may say, earn that in a whole day which is shit pay compared to yours butreally 150 quid isn't a lot to sell your soul and have a man you have never met maul you for an hour. A man you don't fancy( mainly). Now that 150 could be my food bill and I can not equate selling my body for a wks groceries. I would be sitting there thinking what have I just done for a relatively normal amount of money.

I suppose after a bit you just see it as money and don't think how you aquired it.

Now if some old grandad offered me 20k for sex that might just be different(hypothetically speaking) as thatkind of money I couldn't just earn in a short space of time.150, 300 I can

I don't need people to feel sorry for me, i'm intelligent and educated, shit happens you just have to get on with it.
As to forced into poverty, well poverty is different things to different people.
Life experience shapes opinions and during the course of working in 'normal' jobs I have worked for some dreadful employers, had to endure various office politics and regularly felt like life wasn't worth living. Friends of mine have had similar experiences, such as not being paid correctly, bullied to the point of depression and expected to work ridiculous hours without any extra regard.
Companies exploit their staff on an hourly basis, but we can justify people earning below a living wage by saying that's what they are worth.
I just don't really see what the issue is here, if you don't like the sex industry you don't have to get involved in it.
Having 2 young children my options were somewhat limited, working full time just doesn't seem right, as it is my children that lose out. But that is my choice.
My life fell apart due to the actions of my ex partner, escorting made me feel one whole lot better. There is also the fact that for some, me included it's a turn on to be getting paid for it, just as for some of the guys it can be a turn on paying.
I worked part time between children in a call centre and found it totally degrading that at the end of the month a manager would work out proportionately how long had been spent in the toilet, and if too much people would be pulled up on it!!
There will always be too camps on the prostitution issue, just like those that usually complain about media racism tend to be middle class and white, I feel the ones complaining about prostitution are of the same ilk.
Shock horror, some of us do enjoy sex, enjoy getting paid for it and will continue to do so. It appears that some of the posters underlying views about sex are why men turn to pro's in the first place.
Personally perhaps more attention should be paid to the 'sugar daddy' dating trend where it appears perfectly acceptable to put out because someone has bought you dinner and promised a monthly allowance. Far more dangerous imo as young girls getting sucked into this are also sold the message that escorting is cheap!