scottish feminists -

[weeonion]

Dear Sister

As you may know Rhoda Grant MSP is taking forward work to reduce and prevent sexual exploitation, through introducing legislation to criminalise buying sex in prostitution.

Trish Godman MSP held a consultation on this issue in 2010 which resulted in around two thirds of the respondents supporting the proposed legislation. Rhoda is submitting her proposal to the Justice Committee tomorrow (Tuesday 19th June)and is asking that the previous consultation be regarded as sufficient. This would mean that she could then submit her Bill without further consultation. There is also a danger that the expense of a further consultation might deter the Committee from taking forward the proposed legislation at all. This suggestion is being strongly opposed by pro-sex work campaigners as they want a lengthy consultative process that they can prolong in the hope of derailing any new legislation..

I am therefore asking you to send an email to the Justice Committee, today or tomorrow morning, stating that you support proposals to criminalise buying sex, and that in your view the previous consultation was competent and sufficient. The latter is the key at this stage.

This is really urgent. Please email now if can and ask others to do so also.

You email to [email protected]

The clerk is Peter McGrath or you can address it to Christine Graham who is Convenor. If you have time you could also email individual members. All details can be found on the committee page www.scottish.parliament.uk/parliamentarybusiness/CurrentCommittees/29845.aspx

Many thanks,

I have absolutely no idea, I don't know any pimps. How many traffickers were convicted following Operations Pentameter 1 & 2? How many enslaved women freed?

OLDWOMAN. It was scot pep I was talking about, a shadow of it's former self unfortunatly. I knew one or two of the workers.

Dittany, a sex worker without a condom has the choice to have sex or not but the chances of contracting an STI is greater. If she needs money for medical care for her children, or food for her family (which is the stark reality of many non priviledged women), she would be more likely to go ahead than decline.
If a sex worker has condoms and the client doesn't want her to use one she can refuse. Having others around her for protection, say another women allowed to work with her she has additional back-up should he try to force her. If there was a law which made it mandatory for all those exchanging sex for money to use a condom she would have the law on her side and could have him charged.

Notnanny, given your rationale in arriving at your conclusion I presume you must believe all non pimped prostitues must have the same experiences as Bell du Jour ?

I've no idea what century you live in OldLady, but in this one, the vast majority of sex work is hidden and controlled by fear and drugs. It's about business, not pleasure. Why go above board to the lovely lady on the streets of Edinburgh when you can have a completely confidential service from a 16 year old Albanian?

Notnanny, can you answer my query re Operations Pentameter 1 & 2? You know, the ones where every police service in GB used "intelligence" to raid brothels the length and breadth of the country? How many enslaved women were freed, and how many convicted of trafficking?

Your talking against yourself notnanny. The buisnness model is exactly the same as marks and Spencer verses aldi. One is better quality the other is cheaper and comes with less frill. The apart we agree on is that it is all about money, that does not mean however all the money is at one end of the market.

No.

Business model? Frill?

Then why are you making bald statements about the whole trade being underground and subject to a huge amount of trafficking, when the evidence simply isn't there, even though British taxpayers have spent millions of pounds (which might have been better spent on family support/ drugs treatments) looking for it?

Yes, there is money in prostitution. Some of it goes to pimps. Some of it goes to drug dealers. Some of it goes to hotels, and short-stay apartment owners, and the sellers of lingerie, and nursery owners...

Those are the consequences of your own thoughts notnanny, you were the one that said it is all about money which it is. Do you imagine the traffickers or drug lords do not use a buissness model, what century are you in?

There's loads of evidence of trafficking, just not the kind that stands up in court because the traffickers are so wealthy they can cover their tracks and hire shit hot lawyers.

I appreciate your concern for the downtrodden women of Edinburgh, but really...

Oldwoman, your point about hotels and childminders brings me back to how no one quck fix is possible, it sounds soo terribly right on to call the sisterhood together and demand sex for money be outlawed. Fine in it's self, but that leaves many more women who have nothing whatsoever to do with the selling of sex in a difficult position. For example the woman in the off licence a street away from me, her job might go if the 3 - 4 bottles she sells to the women each night stop. What I am saying is a well thought out plan of reduction and how to replace the income for all those concearned apart from traffickers and drug lords they should be hung, is needed and exactly what the statement that I posted earlier says.

Lord preserve us. Now you want women to remain in bondage so that the off-licence doesn't have to close down!

I am not sure what point you are making notnanny. I agree the more money that ends up in the pocket the better lawyer you can buy. So those middle level and upwords are rarely sent to jail. I do not get your last sentance though, but I would take umbridge with you about these women being downtrodden. Abused, and trapped maybe, but some of the strongest women on earth in my book.

Yea see notnanny you fell exactly in to the trap I thought you would. Pick out what you you do not like and leave the rest eh? I suppose the words after that bot about the offie just slid off your screen?

Evidence that doesn't stand up in court is hardly evidence at all! There's much more evidence of trafficking in the catering industry; remember the dead Chinese cockle-pickers in Morecombe Bay? Restaurant owners are regulary prosecuted for employing trafficked staff, and they are generally working behind the scenes. If they can be found, why not these mysterious brothel-owners earning hundreds of thousands from their stables of slaves, each shagging a dozen guys a day?

Trap? OK. Whatever.

Notnanny, there's much evidence of trafficking for harvesting organs, agricultural labour, domestic work, etc, but no one is presuming everyone operating in those areas is trafficked, or exploitation occurs so ban it.

Nobody's banning anything. You can still have sex with someone, you just can't pay them for it.

Arrest those buying sex. Prosecute them. Name and shame. Make them declare it every time they apply for a job. Leave the women alone.

Yes lets criminalise even more people it has worked so well in the past!

Utter bollocks AnnTeak.

Look at Aids widows in certain African countries who end up selling sex to feed their children. They are HIV positive. The men using them know that a huge % of women who end up involved in prostitution are HIV positive. They offer more money to have sex without condoms, and if the women say no, they find a woman who will say yes.

BTW Narked leave the women alone to do what exactly?

Criminalise the users. Criminalise the men who buy sex.

Leithlurker are you a man?