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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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Original poster

Would this comment have frustrated you?

99 replies

ChaosTrulyReigns · 10/11/2011 23:07

I've just been to Prize Giving at DD1's school, which a girls' grammar.

They have just achieved 99.7% pass rate for A levels and are very proud of the girls' achievements.

Why then did the Head Of Governors open the proceedings with this comment?

"Welcome... I shall now move along to the most enjoyable part of the evening, seeing the girls' beautiful dresses as they parade across the stage to collect their awards."

It was obviously only a a small part of the night, but it totally flummoxed and disappointed me.

Am I being super-critical?

OP posts:

Valpollicella · 10/11/2011 23:37

Well, yes, it is brilliant that they had a very inspirational speaker.

But if the Head of Governors who is much more prevalent in day to day matters in the school thinks that its all very important for girls to be in pretty dresses foremost...well....

You can have as many inspirational speakers as you like. But sort the Head of Governors atitude out first

lottiegb · 10/11/2011 23:38

Perhaps she feels able to take their academic success for granted.

Sounds like just the sort of thing some older teacher or governor might have said in my school-days - 1980s - which would have sounded a bit creaky and awkward even then.

Original poster

ChaosTrulyReigns · 10/11/2011 23:42

Yes, Jacksm. Crass maybe the word that's been going through my mind tonight.

I did try to pass it off as nervousness, as a sort of justifying tool (? - can't think of the right word) but, ffs, she had one sentence to say. And I doubt she would have left it to make up on the spur of the moment.

OP posts:

Pan · 10/11/2011 23:43

Also, I guess the 'girls' would have taken a lot of time to be looking good, and the HoG wanted to reflect that. I don't imagine she would be wishing to undermine the acheivements with a daft hand-off insensitively. And I doubt v. much if the 'girls' would have felt undermined by it either.

Pan · 10/11/2011 23:44

"gauche" as well as "crass" maybe.

Original poster

ChaosTrulyReigns · 10/11/2011 23:47

Gauche is better, thanks Pan - I wasn't quite happy with carss.

OP posts:

DioneTheDiabolist · 10/11/2011 23:50

This reminds me of the Lovely Girls Contest episode of Father Ted. Patronising, condescending and horribly outdated.

ChippingInNeedsSleep · 10/11/2011 23:51

most enjoyable part of the evening is what she said.

Not the most important.

Not the focus of the evening.

Not the reason we are here.

Simply the bit she enjoys the most... it's more enjoyable for her to see the girls walking across the stage, presumably looking so grown up, to collect their awards then it is for her to stand there talking to the people in the audience. How can you take offence at that - really. The rest of the evening was focussed on their achievments, both the girls getting the awards and the school as a whole.

Grumpla · 10/11/2011 23:52

As long as they didn't realise they were being undermined, Pan, that's okay then...?

ChippingInNeedsSleep · 10/11/2011 23:56

Grumpla - why is it undermining them to note that they look lovely... or are girls not allowed to look lovely anymore?

Pan · 10/11/2011 23:58

no grumpla, not "as long as" - just mentioning that as a damage-limiter - it was gauche, and I wouldn't like it either for dd - I'd roll my eyes at it.

Valpollicella · 10/11/2011 23:59

Sure they are.

Just why should it be noted as the most enjoyable part of the evening?

Why not the fat that so many of them are getting their prizes?

Why not focus on that?

Pan · 11/11/2011 00:00

grumla - I didn't say it was ok. So pick a fight with someome else, fgs.

Grumpla · 11/11/2011 00:13

Pan, I'm not picking a fight. I just think that it was a pretty unacceptable comment. You say you doubt the girls felt undermined by it - I think that a) I would have, in their position and b) just because someone doesn't necessarily feel undermined by something, doesn't mean they aren't being undermined by it. So it's not okay.

You've already said you wouldn't be that chuffed if it was said at your daughter's prize giving so I'm not sure what the problem is really.

I just find it really, really depressing that at what should be a celebration of intellectual achievement, appearance still has to be privileged. What they look / dress like has nothing to do with what they've achieved. Why on earth would an appraisal of their bloody outfits be the most enjoyable / important part of the evening?!?

ChippingInNeedsSleep · 11/11/2011 00:22

Val - the entire evening, bar one comment, was focussed on their achievements. One comment.

Why should the HoG - not find that part of the evening the most enjoyable? Surely she's entitled to make her own mind up about what is or isn't enjoyable? Not the most important, not the focus of the evening - simply the part she enjoys.

Grumpla - you can't put words in her mouth. She did not say the most important part - you (and others) have said that, not her.

garlicBread · 11/11/2011 00:23

No apologies for repetition. I went to a girls' grammar. I did my A-levels in 1973 - and, way back then, I'm pretty sure our speech day always included something along the lines of "Not only are our girls bright and hard-working, they also look wonderful today!" cue applause.

The only issue the "most enjoyable" bit, and it is quite a big issue. It changed the meaning of the remark. It probably was inadvertent and, if someone can be found to diplomatically point the error out, it can be avoided in future.

Pan · 11/11/2011 00:24

oh dear. I don't have a problem beyond that which I have already said. IT was a daft, crass, gauche comment, and not fitting to the occassion. But it wasn't heinous. Just all of the above. And it is acceptable to suggest that the girls would probably be not undermined by it. They will, I assume, know their worth. The OP Chaos gets that drift, which is the important thing.

But knock yourself out with your indignation-by-proxy if you like.
bed time.

Grumpla · 11/11/2011 00:29

Yes it was one comment - the only comment she had to make, I think, from reading the OP?

You're right of course, I have conflated "most enjoyable" with "most important".

I suppose I'm equally disappointed that the HoG of the school finds looking at the party dresses the "most enjoyable" aspect of the evening (as opposed to, say, enjoying the achievements of their school's pupils & recognition of said achievements.)

Valpollicella · 11/11/2011 00:31

Because as the Head of Govenors, she should not make the dresses they are wearing a focus. Whether it's her focus, the focus of the evening or whatever.

What the prizegivees were wearing should not have been a focus.

If it were a class full of boys I doubt comment would have been cast on their attire. And I doubt the Head of Governors would have drawn attention to their attire as their particularly most enjoyable part of the evening.

Grumpla · 11/11/2011 00:32

As garlicbread said, it is the "most enjoyable" bit that changes the meaning.

Incidental mention of loveliness would not have had me gnashing my teeth in the same way.

Sweet dreams all

garlicBread · 11/11/2011 00:36

night :)

startail · 11/11/2011 00:46

Grrrrr that's out of order.
Even my unreturned DH would know better than that.

ChippingInNeedsSleep · 11/11/2011 00:47

Grumpla - I had rather assumed that she had had more to say throughout the evening?! ... and I agree, it is disappointing that it's the part she enjoys the most - but it doesn't make me 'fucking furious' or even annoyed. Night :)

Val - so you are saying that girls are now not allowed to look lovely or for their appearance to be commented upon at all? The girls all chose to dress up for the occasion, I personally think that commenting on how lovely they looked was a nice thing, not a bad thing. Brains & good grooming don't have to be mutually exclusive...

I disagree that the boys would not have been commented upon. I expect the same HoG would have said how 'smart' or 'well attired' the boys were, had there been any.

itsalladirtylie · 11/11/2011 01:27

I think the comment implies that the girls are there to provide visual pleasure, or be decorative.
I expect she meant well but it seems a rather old fashioned thing to say

Tortington · 11/11/2011 01:29

there is a prize giving at a school that has a high academic achievement rate

thats a given

so to appreciate the effort of the participants is a nice thing to do - anything else is just over thinking it

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