Can you be a feminist housewife?

[wigglybeezer]

Can you be a feminist if you don't have a career but your DH does, especially if this situation has been going on for a long time (13 years in my case)?

I don't feel downtrodden by the way, merely a bit bored and lacking in choice ATM. I earn a small amount of money, so don't have to ask DH for everything but I'm wondering if my Granny (who was a hospital consultant) was a better feminist than me. I just found a photo of her and her pals at medical school where she has noted on the back that there were 18 female medical students out of 180!

Ha insomnia, I'm the OP and although mainly a housewife I also work part-time as a gardener therefore I wield power tools and have rather brawny arms!

Very interesting thread. Lots of good, clear, logical thinking and also some Marxist/Leninist thinking.

The problem with human societies as a whole is that they have yet to involve a way of making them function without a designated servant class - the ones who do all the shitwork which is essential but boring and repetitive. The most stable societies are the ones which have managed to convince the majority of the designated servant class that their slavery is not slavery but has a sacred status(Women have all the power, yes they really do, because they are the pure angels in the home and their bodies give life, which is why they don't need grubby sordid things like careers), or they are born to it (women's bodies can't cope with earning money, it makes them ill and their wombs fall off), or that doing it ensures they will be highly rewarded after they are dead (women are sacred and special and will go to heavan and clean god's windows in satin robes...). Unfortunately this doesn't work forever: sooner or later the servant class detects and resents the exploitation and rebels. One of the many unpleasant but useful functions of religion is to ensure the servant class stays passive and obedient.

SGB i think i heart you.

Now that sounded earnest. I meant to just put it inverted commas, so to speak. You articulate opinions i thoroughly agree with.

Yes, most definitely SGB. Our current government is going for the 'elevation to sainthood' tact, which is really quite insidious as I think the idea of martyrdom and self-sacrifice is quite appealing to the human psyche

martyrdom and self-sacrifice is quite appealing to the human psyche

This can be the only reason women like to share nay compete on traumatic birth stories.

After witnessing a "my tear was bigger than your tear" competition at lunch today (whilst I sit there nearly 7 months pregnant) the above statement was never truer.

Going back a bit...

There is not enough biological difference between all men and all women for women naturally to be the servant class.

I think the biological and culturally evolved condition of gender is different enough to keep women subjugated. Testosterone is enough to drive a massive behavioural difference.

When we have spousal abuse statistics like we do in our so-called civilised country expecting the men (in general) to share the "duty" of caring/homemaking is an eon away.

Empowerment through education is the simple answer - in theory - in practice bloody difficult when women subjugate themselves under the name of freedom/choice.

yes the mummy martyrs love a good giving things up competition.

tales of how they gave up work and tips on how to cut back
no haircuts or fripperies
a life on value beans
knitting tampons and straining yoghurt
no job more noble than watching your widdle ones.they would never outsource no siree
all of this said as if this is a good thing
..and this is held up as virtuous and good thing to do. meanwhile working mums are berated as leaving children and being avaricious and slammers. yes biddulph and oj i mean you

and imo,trying to extoll virtues of stay at home as 'ardest job in world simply colludes with the notion of childcare is womens work.better to look how to support work,affordable childcare then encouraging paid housewifery

i dispute servant class.its too fatalistic and doesnt allow for individual to not follow that ascribed role.

Wow, martyrdom and self-sacrifice don't appeal to me. Am I the wrong type of woman?

No, I'm no martyr; I'm selfish to the core and prioritise taking care of my family over working because that is what I prefer to do! I don't mind fitting the odd job (only ones I really enjoy doing, mind you) in here and there just as long as it never interferes with my family life!

No martyr here either.
Bloody hated working, no financial need to, kids all at school, life of Riley.

In a nutshell

you need to read more precious moments and downsizing threads on mn,obviously

have you never really seen the you dont really need to return to work speech as someone discusses nursery for their baby.all the jolly earnest tales of downsizing.and even when it is protested you can downsize all financial commitments,this is rebuked

I only don't work because I have no need to.

If it was a choice of baked beans and no haircuts or work, I'd be grabbing my briefcase before you could say menz servant!

i dont have to work i chose to
lol,menz servant at servitudeR-US inc

Ha! Love it!

Exactly SM - choices!

You can be a feminist and exercise your right to choose, that, surely, is the point!?

indeed,so long as you weigh pros and cons.dont get deluded by happy ever after and look after yourself.be aware you need a life and interests outwith of being mummy and build a safety net.dont become defined by solely motherhood

God, I am so NOT defined by motherhood!
( I am defined by my horses, mind!)

fortunately its minority i know.velcroed to kids,didn't use free nursery places (dont agree with baby prison) and are general goddesses about whole kids thing

most folk i know cant wait to get out and have some yee-haw

well thats the rub we all resolutely hope/believe we are doing right thing.and naturally that comes under scrutiny by self and others.and thats to be expected.and our self belief and attitudes inform our behaviours as in you'd never catch me reading biddulph or OJ and nodding in agreement.

now whether a choice is informed,sensible,informed by societal and gender pressures that is what we all debate vigorously

SGB - societies have evolved a way to outsource a lot of the shitwork though -- the chopping wood, hauling water and carrying human waste, digging, grinding, churning, weaving, carrying etc.. All now done in the West through non human power (much of it fossil fuels with their own problems...) - I think we have about 200 'energy slaves' working for us (I.e. The equivalent number of people who would be needed to do the work to keep us comfortable).

I don't think that someone who is a well off 'housewife' in this world can be defined as a 'slave'.

Himalaya: Up to a point. But as yet we have not developed mechanical means of keeping arses and noses wiped for those who can't do it for themselves. Nor do meals magically materialise unless someone shops for them and puts them on plates, then removes the plates when the meals are eaten. And while it's true that any adult living alone has to find a way of dealing with the production of meals, the laundering of clothes and the maintaining a level of tidiness that is bearable, it's still the case that when that adult has a penis, moving in with an adult who doesn't have a penis is understood to mean a lessening of responsibility for these daily essentials.