Article on Motherhood in Guardian

[Blackduck]

www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2011/mar/26/modern-mother-equality-illusion

Have only skim read, but usual comments!

'Do we all just say en-masse 'no not playing any more'....'

YES!!! Thats what I have been trying to say lol. How is this only obvious to me?

Well I am just some lowly person who has no history of every reading feminist texts, I am a minimum wage worker, I havent had a flash career and am not particularly well educated and I have done it. I think I have the power to change things because all though I have none of those things I am a good person, and have been brought up to think any man would be lucky to have me.

I have managed it because I think I am worth it and want a decent man and dont want to be taken for a mug. I really honestly dont think it is that hard. I have always also been brought up to believe I have the power within me to do anything and not rely on waiting for others. If someone says something I dont like I will tell them. If they treat me like a mug, they will wish they hadnt. To me its that simple. I dont seek to trivialise the matter but I honestly dont know why a woman wouldnt do this (not including people who have been abused, or had some other kind of traumatic childhood that has effected their self esteem/view on relationships etc).

If I couldnt change my husbands behaviour, I would just change my husband! I would definitely do it because you only get one life, dont settle for second best.

Well, this might well ignite the thread, because my husband was the one to stay at home from 4-16 months of my son's first year - that is, he - like the writer - went down to part-time, because his employer was willing and mine wasn't. He also did virtually all the nappy changes when he was at home on the grounds that I of necessity did the feeds. He to this day does all the washing and ironing. He is the one who can find lost things, and he cooks dinner as often as I do. The only things I can do that he can't are twiddly things, like knitting, and he can also do things I can't, like unblock the sink and change light bulbs. Ok, he isn't an especially willing or diligent tidier, but he will even do Christmas... and this is because, basically, he is kind and nice, and I yell at him if I think things are unjust. However, you are unlikely to get all this in a person who also wants to parade alpha male credentials and make shedloads of money, which is what lots of women think they want. (He in fact makes a nice but not dazzling salary, about 45k a year).

'How do you mean by not playing any more noodle?'

If you dont want to do something dont do it. If my husband left me to do stuff that I didnt want to do I would just not do it.

If he was taking the pee when it came to making me do stuff at home I would wait for him to walk through the door. Get my coat and go out drinking. See how he likes that.

I would leave stuff for him to do and if he didnt do it I would wait until he did. I guarntee any man would cave in ages before me cause I am stubborn.

If he moaned say well I dont see why I have to do it all. If he didnt like it and still acted like an idiot I would leave.

I would never get in to the habit of running around after him prekids.

I would tell him he isnt ever going to make me in to a wife that does everything around the house. That way if he doesnt like it he can leave before we marry.

I would do all this BEFORE having kids. Then you could see if he wants you enough he will do it. If not he is a dick, simple as.

Be like me is not what anyone is saying. 'Expand your sense of the possible and forget popular culture' is more like it.

I am not saying be like me. If I said that I had a friend that made me pay, always took, wanted emotional support from me and not helped me in return, I was always there for them and they werent there for me through the hard times. Then what would you tell me to do? If it is like anyone in RL I know and loads of threads that are similiar in AIBU then you would say explain to the person why it hurts you if they dont change then ditch this person they are not worth it.

There are many friends of the same sex who will do that to you, but just forget them move on. There are plenty of men out there that wont do this if you show that you arent a pushover. Some people will just take you for a ride if they think they can get away with it.

No I didnt do any of these things but I am saying I would if I had to. My husband never did it but he knows whose boss

95% of men aren't like your dh noodle. (stat plucked out of the air). 95% of media (stat plucked out of the air) exhorts the wonders of motherhood, and the masculine role to be a stable breadwinner. men work. women care. and do housework. and look pretty.

ra for you for equalising it in your case.

the issue is how to convince every other woman AND MAN that the equality you enjoy (and apparently found so easy to pluck out of the air) is possible. when the entirety of society is set up to prove otherwise.

i'm thrilled to ribbons that you have a job and so does your husband.

but for all the women crying into their coffee at mums and tots, i want equal numbers of men providing a full time caring role. maybe then there would be less crying into the washing up, and a bit more respect for sheer bloody grind and monotony of getting milk in at one end, and cleaning the other. rather than assuming because women have breasts, they should dangle them down the bog whilst cleaning it, and be bloody well grateful that the wage earner pops home every now and now again with a wage packet to inspect the facilities.

it's fine to say 'get a job and pay someone else to do it' but who the frick do you think those other people are that you are paying to do the jobs? other women. poorly paid women. (women, i am sorry to say, like yourself, in your lovely nursery). how many men work in your nursery, noodle?

or do they just drop the kids off at the door, because childcare is a women's job? and then nip off to their manly employ?

you are just as much a victim as the poor cow in her fawcett society t-shirt, but you haven't even realised it. for you it is a choice apparently. nice choice. upholding the staus quo without even realising it.

i see no queues of men lining up to work in a nursery. fgs, how many threads on here are all 'ooo, there is a male working at dd's nursery - is he a paedo?'

i can't get my head round you thinking you have found the answer at all. i just can't.

you are a childcarer. you just happen to be a paid one. (poorly paid, because they all are. childcare is not valued in this society).

gah. gah. flipping gah.

it's fine to say 'get a job and pay someone else to do it' but who the frick do you think those other people are that you are paying to do the jobs? other women. poorly paid women. (women, i am sorry to say, like yourself, in your lovely nursery). how many men work in your nursery, noodle?

The men I know are emptying the bins, litter picking in the park, working cleaning the street, at the counter at the shops, shifting boxes around all day, labouring etc. All jobs that are typically male and you wouldnt catch me doing. My husbands job is waaayyy harder than mine its a crappy job. I wouldnt swap for all the money in the world.

'all jobs that are typically male and you wouldn't catch me doing.'

i rest my case.

you don't want equality, noodle. at all. you want a thin veneer of equality - enough to wave your 'i've got a job' flag.

great. if you are happy with that, crack on.

but don't call it equality.

'Why was it so easy for your husband to share the housework with you and take care of the children equally?'

When he met me I had never ironed or used a washing machine (As I said I was on daily inspections as I was so bad at military), I had never cooked any kind of food not even pasta as my dads a chef etc. I have never seen my mum using a washing machine and only ironed the once.

When I was 16 my ex boyf came round and wanted to borrow my ironing board to do his shirt to go out but we didnt own one. I took it to my mum and we did it on the kitchen table. We were laughing so much as it was crap cause neither of us knew what we were doing and my mum was in her late 40s at the time). It looked rubbish but he still wore it and never said anything lol.

When I met my husband we moved in with each other quickly and I didnt rush to do it as I didnt really know what I was doing. I did some, he did some. I was never going to be that person putting home cooked tea on the table every night and running around after me. He was doing my ironing 2 weeks after I met because I was getting in so much trouble. It became a bit of a joke. I then tried to cheat and got permanent leg creases in to my trousers but used to even get tram lines in them! I still cant do it now.

For that reason he knew what he was getting when he moved in. When he moved in he definitely saw what he was getting!! Still didnt scare him off cause he said he loved me, we married and then had a kid and that was that.

With the kid thing. He was really broody when we met and I always knew he wanted to be hands on dad.

''all jobs that are typically male and you wouldn't catch me doing.'

i rest my case.

you don't want equality, noodle. at all. you want a thin veneer of equality - enough to wave your 'i've got a job' flag.

great. if you are happy with that, crack on.

but don't call it equality.'

Ay? They are traditionally male jobs but I meant I didnt really fancy them as they were shit. Not like they are loving doing them and all men are swanning around having a laugh