Resisting femininity experiment - who's in?

[sethstarkaddersmackerel]

I was thought-provoked by the 'I'm a feminist but....' thread, particularly Dittany's posts, in which she talked about women who choose not to 'perform femininity'.

I posted on the other thread that I hugely object to all that bikini-line business but do still shave my legs. Am not sure why I do this, so I think I'm going to stop and see how it feels. It felt like a major issue when I was 20 or so but I actually suspect not shaving them now would make me feel more, rather than less, confident.

So I wondered if anyone else was thinking about giving up any beauty practices or other elements of compulsory femininity and would like to do it together and see how it feels.

this is not a competition - if you decide after a day you hate it and can't live without it, fine, but it would be really interesting to hear about, and I think it could advance our understanding of how this all works.

anyone else in?

btw, I am in a vile mood today so if anyone wants to come along to the thread and tell us we are just falling into the trap of thinking all feminists have to have hairy legs, or that actually they wax everything and are a still better feminist than meeeee, I will tell them to fuck off because if you don't 'get' this I can't be bothered explaining, either you get it or you don't

No, I haven't, proles, but it's moving so bloody fast! The cicero thing was cool - have been reading a lot and going "oh, yeah!".

Which cultural norm, claig? Washing or hair?

I do deodorant, but only because if I don't I smell and I don't like it!!! (but not one of those girly ones - unscented here!)

I meant the cultural norm of shaving legs.
The thing about stinking really is the effect on other people. It is only polite to make an effort and wash and brush your teeth etc. People have been doing it since the dawn of time. Cleoptra, although an empress, also conformed to these societal conventions.

Good question - anyone have a potted history of the removal of body hair?

Actually. After today, I would be really interested to read a history of (removal/styling of) body hair.

I never got into makeup, save mascara. I'm quite relieved, generally.

Gulf Arab men remove body hair generally.
They're hardly up there as champions of equality.
Also v partial to incense and perfume.

Since my skin cleared up about 7 years ago, I stopped wearing foundation and other make up every day. Now when I do wear it (Interviews only nowadays!) it is SO weird! Like wtf am I doing painting my face? I don't look like me anymore, I look older as my natural glow/shine is matted up, it's really odd to me now.

I know Hecate said this aaages ago but I wanted to respond to it:
"I want to look like a woman. Is there really anything wrong with that?"
It's worth thinking about what 'looking like a woman' entails - a lot of hair removal, make up wearing and revealing clothes wearing. None of these things are actually anything to do with being a woman though and it could be considered weird that we require females to jump through these hoops to be considered a fully fledged member of the female gender.

Also that old saying - why do women wear make up and perfume? Because they are ugly and smell. Is a decent illustration of how these things are in their own way, a criticism of women in their natural form.

Anyway, I know this is supposed to be a light hearted thread so i'll shurrup now though don't feel like joining in.

But those are different cultural norms, moondog - can't really compare. Though it is interesting - what are the most hairy cultures, I wonder?

What, are you differentiating between cultural norms and constraints?

Just occurred to me, these bodybuilder men shave their body hair off in order to admire their muscles. That is a quite recent change and is often seen as not manly, since it is too much of a preoccupation with appearance.

No, I mean different cultures, I think. I suppose a norm may be a constraint, but not necessarily vice versa.

I don't understand what you mean by this comment though

'But those are different cultural norms, moondog - can't really compare'

In the Pacific country where I spent a large part of my life, male primping with feather and make up was a huge thing.
Bugger all for women.

I think the reason behind these norms is quite simple. Sex makes the world go around. On the whole, women fancy men and men fancy women. These customs are about accentuating the difference between women and men in order to attract the opposite sex. Most men don't fancy other men, the fancy women, and hairy bodies are mainly a male characteristic and are therefore unattractive to men. Women accentuate their difference in order to be atractive to men, and men accentuate their difference (through things like strength, speed, muscles etc.) in order to attract women.

Haven't read the whole thread but I'm happy to give up leg/pubic/underarm/eyebrow hair 'maintenance' but I draw the line with my upper lip and that pesky one that keeps emerging from my chin. Am I a wuss?

Best explanation I've ever come across Claig.

Um - I just meant that the norms for different cultures have different effects, I think - really sorry but am off to watch masterchef and MOCK.

Why don't you get that this thread isn't really about hair removal or lack thereof, moondog? Are you purposely being obtuse?

I was raised in a North Africa country.

Completely different perspectives there, let me tell you. It isn't always about the "hijab" the culture itself was constraining-not necessarily the make up/hair issue.

Darlene - hell no, you're not a wuss. Do what you feel comfortable with. This is not meant to be torture.

moondog is just after a scrap

*African even.