Booker Prize

[pippistrelle]

Is anyone reading the Booker nominees this year? What's your favourite, and what do you think will win?

Who will win? Whoever ticks the right boxes, I suppose. I haven't looked at the list so have no idea which books have been nominated. I'm afraid I no longer trust the literary establishment. I no longer believe them when they tell me X or Y is a masterpiece. Too often, what they really mean is this work ticks the largest number of boxes, or this author holds the 'correct' liberal-left views.

I stick to the classics (in spite of the left's attacks on the canon).

For the first year I’ve not kept up with it! Recommendations of anything good please!

I'm reading the Elizabeth Strout but only a few pages in.
I really like her so I am not expecting it to win.

I'm going to take a punt on John of John. It might be Douglas Stuart's turn.

I usually wait until the Shortlist is announced (22nd September this year) and then see what I fancy, but I have read May We Feed the King, which is on the Longlist, and which won the Waterstones Debut Book this year. It's extraordinary. Certainly hope it makes it to the Shortlist.

I will read the Elizabeth Strout because I loved Olive Kittridge and the follow up book (whose name I can’t remember ) and John of John. I have been underwhelmed by winners in the past so I don’t see it necessarily as an indication of a book I will enjoy.
Mary Beard and Jarvis Cocker are part of the judging panel so that’s interesting.

I really enjoyed the Elizabeth Strout. It's simple and straightforward on the surface but quite profound on the human condition. Like a lot of the books we regard as classics now.
I've also read 'The End of Everything' by M John Harrison, the sci fi thing. It had some interesting ideas but I couldn't really make head nor tail of the plot even though it was short. I enjoyed its John Wyndham vibe though.
I really wanted to like 'Black Bag' by Luke Kennard more than I did. I liked the premise and the notion that it might make me laugh, as promised on the cover. But the most it provoked was the occasional wry smile. It made some interesting philosophical points towards the end but there were parts that I found a bit crass.
Not sure about 'John of John'. I caught bits of it when it was Radio 4's Book at Bedtime but it didn't really grab me. Looking forward to 'May We Feed the King' which is next on my TBR shelf, where it sits next to 'Helen of Nowhere'. I'm a sucker for those lovely Fitzcarraldo Editions covers so I bought it quite a while ago but haven't got around to reading it yet.
Of the others, I think I'll read 'The Vivisectors' and probably the one by Gwendoline Riley, as I read and enjoyed a previous book by her, even though I can't remember which one.
I will actively avoid the Marlon James as I read his 'A Brief History of Seven Killings' and really didn't like it.
I see the whole event as a way of highlighting some books that you might have missed and that have something to offer. It doesn't mean they're the only books with something to offer but it's good to be open to new and unusual things. And it's good that book fans have an event to get a little excited about. It can be quite a lonely pursuit after all.

I am aiming to read the shortlist but reading what I fancy off the longlist first. I read The Palm House earlier in the year and loved it. I started with Helen of nowhere which was weird but I thought it was great. Might reread it if it makes the shortlist as I missed something other reviewers were taking about. I'm currently enjoying black bag and just picked up the Strout and Shadow of the object from the library.

I really liked John of John, but I’m a big fan of Douglas Stuart and love a book set somewhere rural. I’m also familiar with that West of Scotland masculine misery, and he writes that very well.

I read The Palm House and quite liked it, it felt very “young” and “London”, I’m probably not the right demographic. It was very readable nonetheless.

I read The Vivisectors and hated it. I’ve no idea what it was meant to be.

I read The Vivisectors and I have droned on elsewhere on these boards about how much I disliked it. It all felt a bit sixth form. I felt the same about Helen of Nowhere. I don't like reading something and getting to the end and thinking 'what the bloody hell was all that about?' But that seems to be my recurring response in relation to most of this long list. And what's with all the anonymous characters and locations? There's a definite theme.

What are your predictions for the shortlist?

So far I've read:

The Renovation - excellent, probably my favourite
May We Feed The King - also really liked this and it's stayed with me, I read it in April I think well before Booker time
Black Bag - Quite fun, liked it on a sentence level but the plot got a bit far-fetched towards the end.. Also not sure about the female professor subplot, but on the whole positive
John of John - good, beautiful writing and landscapes, but I think I preferred Shuggie.
The Things We Never Say - I like Strout and liked this, but not my favourite on the list
The Vivisectors - hated the narrator, massive mean girl vibes, and feel like there was some dubious writing about disability. Nothing was resolved and everything was very opaque. Think people who like Eileen which I also disliked would like this one.
The Palm House - meh. can barely remember it a month later.

I've got Switzy to read for my online book club next month and bought the SF for DH.. Don't fancy Irish gangsters particularly but will pick up any that are in the Kindle deals.

@pippistrelle agree with your comments. Feel like there's a bit of Emperor's New Clothes about some of these, but I guess the anonymous writer, unidentified setting is a bit of a trend. The Vivisectors and Helen of Nowhere seem to be the most divisive ones. They've gone for quite an experimental list this year. Then again, I wasn't much of a fan of last year's list either.

The only thing I can say for sure is that it will contain some that I don't like - and more the point, don't rate - at all. But it shows how subjective reading is. I see people elsewhere talking about how good such and such a novel is while I'm thinking 'how can anyone even read that dross?' (I try not to say it out loud though!)

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I think Douglas Stuart and Marlon James seem to be the favourites.

Well, I think I've read as many as I'm going to, as the ones I haven't read just don't appeal to me at all, for various reasons. The final one I read was 'The Palm House' - it was okay. Solidly written, but pointless, it seemed to me.

I've been distinctly underwhelmed this year.

I went to the event where the shortlist was announced last night. I may not have loved any of the books this year but I still like listening to people talk about books. Mary Beard said one of the questions she asked herself was whether a book was 'up itself'. Our meters for that must be very differently calibrated if she could ask herself that about 'The Vivisectors' and 'Helen of Nowhere', and conclude that they were not.

It was a pleasure to listen to Patricia Lockwood who was incredibly articulate. Sentences seemed to spring from her mouth fully formed as a persuasive essay. It's an impressive skill. She was also very funny.

Raymond Antrobus got on my nerves. I'm being unfair really, because sitting on a stage and having to voice complicated thoughts off the cuff isn't easy, but he was all over the place meaning it was quite hard to understand what he was trying to say. He was one of those speakers who is not precise in what he says, meaning that you think you understand what he means but that wasn't quite what he said, and it's hard to be sure. Hard to pin down. Like Donald Trump. (I don't think Ray Antrobus would enjoy that comparison...) Maybe that's useful for a poet? (It looked like it was incredibly difficut for the person who was live transcribing the event.) But, as he's a poet, I almost feel like he has no business judging novels anyway.

They were quite clear that they had wanted to bring attention to more experimental forms and to 'reward risk' , as Rebecca Liu put it.

Jarvis Cocker pretty quiet for the most part.

Sounds like a good evening @pippistrelle .

I think it's a decent shortlist. I've liked all 4 that I've read on it and The Disappearers (which I haven't read) is getting near universal praise. The only outlier is the End of Everything which most people seem to dislike. Will try and read both of these before the winner is announced.

It was quite fun @Stowickthevast , trying to work out which judge liked which book best.

I haven't read The Disappearers, and I'm not planning to. It just doesn't appeal, but it seemed to be popular with the crowd.

I read 'The End of Everything'. The judges were quite explicit that they didn't really understand it either, and I got the impression it was partly a lifetime service award. Patricia Lockwood noted that the author had been ploughing this furrow for fifty years. I googled him; he's 81. But I don't think he'll win. I think the weirdness of it probably gives him least chance.

I don't think there's a strong outright winner amongst these judges. I had the impression that Antrobus was a big Disappearers fan. Mary Beard and Jarvis Cocker went for the Elizabeth Strout, with 'Black Bag' also strongly championed by Mary Beard. That leaves 'John of John' and 'May We Feed the King' as possible compromise winners, with the Rebecca Perry as the the last sort of experimental (sci-fi aside) work. They also mentioned that they really enjoyed being able to boost new and less well known authors and, as Rebecca Perry is new, then I'd say she's in with a shout too.

Can I ask how you came to go to this event? Is it an industry thing or can members of the public go? I’d like to attend a few more literary events. I’m off to Wimbledon for their literary festival but I haven’t really
explored their programme deeply. I might try and volunteer there next year

Just a standard buy a ticket from the Southbank website thing @Divebar2021 . They've done it for the past few years. They also have another longer standing public event the night before the prize is awarded where the authors are interviewed and there are readings. I like the one with the judges as I'm hoping for gossip!

Thanks for that. I’ve only read one of the finalists so far and I’m not sure I’m committed enough to read all of them but I have a few on order with the library

I'm still debating whether to go to the readings event. I'm slightly put off by the fact that it's on a Sunday night with all that that means in terms of the possibility of iffy transport. Talk about first world problems...

Sounds like a really interesting event @pippistrelleSomewhat surprised that Jarvis Cocker was so quiet. I did wonder if the M John Harrison was a long-service nod all right. I’m listening to The Disappearers now. (Last I have to listen to or read on the shortlist) It’s very graphic in terms of both sex and violence so it can be very confronting. It also means I am avoiding listening to it on my commute in case my earphones disconnect themselves!
My favourite is John of John but it would be nice to see a relative unknown win. I was hoping for The Renovation but alas not to be.

I read the elizabeth Strout earlier this year and loved it. I might read the Marlon James and the Dougkas Stuart.

But first, I want to read London Falling - non-fiction and apparently brilliant.

I was surprised too that Jarvis Cocker was quiet but I had the impression that, while he counts as an intellectual in the world of rock and pop, he was considerably out-intellected in this field.

Yes, it's the anticipated graphic nature of the violence that puts me off The Disappearers.