Who should I contact over my friend's worsening mental health?

[MyMomUsesColorSafeBleach]

I've NCed and this is longer then I anticipated.

I don't really know what to do tbh,

I have a friend of 25y since we were in y6, she had a difficult childhood with a very disabled parent and sibling and an extremely over protective other parent who has now passed (I mean extreme, had a curfew at 20, 10+ phone calls when out for 5h kind of thing) that parent also put a crippling fear of departments of authority into her - social services esp, the last 15y have been very difficult for her with her mental health, crippling anxiety, extreme health anxiety and diagnosed OCD.

I have spent hours and hours on the phone to her all times of the day to talk through various anxieties (as an example of how extreme they can be, she trod on a broken coat hanger in socks in a changing room, it left a tiny indent but not broken skin and she was hysterical about acquiring HIV, it took 4 days to calm down and 6 years later when having blood tests she was terrified again about it) but we just go round and round in circles, I have encouraged her to talk to someone but she quite therapy within 8 weeks each time because its "not helping", she has lost most friendships because it can be incredibly intense trying to help. I cannot imagine how hard it is to deal with for her.

She now is married with 2 v young daughters and it has only gotten significantly worse and now extends to the children. A simple cold can leave her having panic attacks over them suffocating in their sleep, these panic attacks involve her attacking herself, vomiting, screaming, shouting at her husband and sobbing hysterically (I know hysterical sounds like I'm not taking her seriously but that is truly the only way to describe it) for hours, I have taken phone calls where she cannot breath because she's in a panic attack because the toddler was a toddler and bumped her head, whilst she is holding one of them - so they are listening and seeing all this.

Her husband is, frankly, completely and utterly unsupportive and useless at handling mental health, I would go so far as to say he is emotionally abusive with what he says and does, that is not to take away from how difficult it must be to deal with it but screaming in her face that she's pathetic and he's going to take the children away is cruel, there is no talking to him about it, I've tried, the only response he has is that she's lucky he married her.

But their children are seeing everything, the nursery have reported that the younger one hits herself and they're not sure why but it is exactly how my friend does when she's spiralling. They are seeing the screaming and crying, the eldest one is becoming scared, she is becoming extremely overprotective (eg not letting them on any play equipment or out the pram for a full day out incase they fall and trip despite both being very capable).

I work in a job that involves safeguarding and I am extremely concerned about the children and her, after the birth of their second daughter I contacted her local perinatal mental health team due to how bad it got but they told me they could not do anything until she asks for help. She will not seek help, absolutely not, she is adamant that the second she asks for help, Social services will take her children, its not an if but a when as far as she's concerned.
Her husband has told her that if she doesnt get help he will take the children and leave until she does. I absolutely believe she will take her own life if this happens but he doesnt feel he has a choice.

I am almost certain that our friendship will end if I reach out to someone else to help her but I don't know what else to do at this point, she is getting worse and I cannot do enough for her to make meaningful change.

You have no choice but to report this to social services. It's utterly shit but the sad fact is that she is actively harming her children at this stage.

She needs help. Make the call. One day, she'll understand why you had to.

I am concerned for her and her children, I think as you already must realize unfortunately you have a duty to express a concern to social services

“I work in a job that involves safeguarding”

no offence, but doesn’t that mean you should know what to do?

She won't get help unless social services get involved your enabling her really by not actually doing what is correct !
Her children are being harmed by her behaviour so do the right thing it's the best thing as a friend u can do !
It won't be easy but at least u can say to yourself u are protecting those little girls

It's your duty to help those kids OP. You know it. Go to the nursery if you have to and tell them everything and that the kids are at risk.

Far more important than your friendship.

You absolutely have to report this to social services. Those two children must come before your friendship.

You know it’s the right thing to do. I would also suggest speaking to nursery/school and making them aware.

Thank you, I am at a point where I don't have an issue doing it, I love her and I want to help her how she needs but I didn't/don't know if social services was the correct place to go to - I've reached out to both perinatal mental health and her local boroughs mental health service both of whom said they couldn't help until she reached out but if social services is the right place then I will contact them.

That's really helpful thanks, yes I do know exactly who to call despite the fact that my job is not in adult mental health and I thought I'd write this thread for the lols

Tbf these threads always seem to be from people who work in safeguarding but don’t know what to do in safeguarding scenarios

Mind you, I have to say, my ex husband has a serious mental illness and I don’t think you have a hope of getting any help for her. She’ll be expected to help herself and it’s not an emergency

you sound like a lovely friend but she’s very unlikely to get better, she’s been ill a very very long time.

I would ring nursery and ask if they could talk to her about early help? If she refuses then social care but they could make that referral

I agree she won’t receive any help at all but you need to protect the children. Her husband is as bad for allowing it to go on.

I think the fact that you work in safeguarding makes you reticent as it means you know you will report, lose the friendship and nothing will actually happen anyway in terms of safeguarding.

you are best talking to husband and telling him he has to leave with the kids .

He’ll be expected to divorce her and have the kids most of the time. He’s probably really worried about that too

I also have a life long friend with crippling mental health, albeit different presentation. I completely empathise with how intense it can be trying to be supportive. Fortunately my friend never had children (I say fortunately but am so sad that I feel that way, if that makes any sense).
I've called crisis lines and emergency services on several occasions so I understand the frustration of the help just not being there. Unfortunately in some cases even the most experienced and well trained people just don't have the answers I think. It's horrible.

I am sorry to say I really do think you need to make social services aware. If these children were some I worked with, I'd absolutely be making a MASH referral. She might be terrified of losing them, but I'd be more terrified that they are going to end up with severe mental health problems themselves and the cycle will continue. It's a heartbreaking situation, feeling like you are betraying her (that's how I felt when I was desperately trying to find a way to get someone to put my friend under section), but it's a cruel to be kind thing I think. You'd be a worse friend to just sit back while she damages her children further.

Your local Central Advice and Duty Team as a starting point

Adult Safeguarding for your locality also, though I actually did this for someone once and they were shite

I think you have to make social services and the children's school aware before she hurts the children by protecting them too much. The children's mental health has to be your priority.

Speak to social care and the child’s school. You could also speak to the practice manager at her doctors but obviously they won’t give you any information.

She's not protecting them, she's abusing them at this point.

Can you report anonymously to social services or have them keep your identity secret?
Such a tough situation OP, I wish your friend would go to her GP. I feel incredibly sorry for her husband, this must be a living nightmare.

Her husband has made no effort to try and help or understand, if she has a panic attack he calls her pathetic, wishes he'd never had children with her because now his kids will be mental, he'll take her children and she'll never see them, she's a shit mum, their toddler hates her.

I'm not going to pretend it's not incredibly hard but im also not going to feel sorry for him at this point

If you think the kids are in danger, then you report to SS. I would not speak to her husband about it. If he’s abusive, you would risk making the situation even worse.
There is no point in contacting any mh services or GPs etc on her behalf. Even her spouse would have a hard time accessing help on her behalf if she isn’t willing. Based on the behaviour you’ve described, while it’s very upsetting and distressing to witness it is way way below the point where adults would receive intervention against their wishes.

I agree she will need to access mental health support and may or may not engage/get better.

The priority here is safeguarding the children, which is why social services need to be involved.

I’d call the police when she contacts you in one of her severe spirals and say you’re worried for her and her children’s safety. And yes contact SS asap. And yes, her husband should take the kids. But yes, it is a possibility, as you say, that she may do something like take her own life. And that is a terrible situation to be in for you - and people saying you should just get on and call SS have no understanding of how hideous it is to sit there knowing you may pull the trigger on someone doing something like that. However, I can tell you, that if that happens, the reality is you haven’t done it, she has (her trauma has). And you are doing the right things. Those kids need protecting.

thisnwomannis never going to change. She can’t..