I think I'm putting down my difficult horse

[whattodowheretogo]

I've posted about my horse on here before but I'd just like some last minute opinions.

I bought him a year ago from a TB breeder and trainer as she felt that she was too old for a horse like him and she couldn't sit his spooks.

No ground manners, didn't know where to put his feet, didn't respond to pressure.

I wanted a project and he was one in every sense of the word. I fell in love with him as soon as I saw him.

When I tried him out he was good, but at the end, he took off with me across the field and didn't stop until he physically couldn't go any further. I wasn't concerned about that, I just figured he was green and overwhelmed and these things would come with time.

When we got him home he needed a chifney to be taken anywhere or he would just set his neck and try to canter off (my ex was looking after him for a lot of the time - he's a racehorse trainer and rehab yard owner so he knows what he's doing!) and even he would struggle with him.

Through the months his ground manners improved but to this day he can suddenly try to drag you somewhere and canter off.

His biggest issues are ridden. I've had many rides on him when he's simply decided to take off and nothing can stop him until he's done himself in. One lesson I had we were cantering for so long with him screeching round the corners and bucking that I was getting lightheaded. My trainer couldn't do anything but stand and watch.

He will do things like take off, then screech to a halt in front of the fence, then shoot off again.

I've taken everything right back to basics, over the winter I worked solely on the ground with him, teaching him the saddle and bridle is a positive thing, we learnt to stand stock still at the mountain block, yield to pressure etc.

But he is so unpredictable - he'll do a nasty spook at "nothing", just completely drop his shoulder.

I've spent months just walking and trotting in the school to make it a nice calm experience for him. I've honestly tried everything.

He's just messed up his only saving grace - to hack he is brilliant and super calm. But this weekend he took one look at something on the floor, bolted for home and ran into the main road. I came off, got concussion and fractured my foot.

I've been riding for 17 years, I'll ride literally anything. I ride friend's difficult horses for them if they've come off and had accidents and have a great time. But there's just something about this horse that I just think.. what is it going to take?

I'm so thankful that this wasn't a worse injury for either me or him.

I'm pretty certain that I'm going to put him down. It's something I've discussed with my vet before after he remarked what a difficult git he was.

I feel like it would be unfair on him to pass him on, I'd worry about how he'd be treated given all his quirks, whether he'd be passed on again etc but also I'd worry that he may seriously injure himself or someone else.

Thoughts/suggestions?

Some posts on this thread reminds me of when I used to frequent the fancy rats forum. The gals on there were NUTS about how much they would spend on their pets, and how much abuse they would take from them.

Pictures of arm with streams of blood running down it? Stitches from the most recent angry rat wounds? Perfectly fine. Why wouldn't you tolerate that. People discussed their pet-inflicted wounds like badges of honour (like folk here seeming to brag about the broken bones their horses gave them).

Mention of spending £2k to get a rat a life-saving operation or even just recurrent lump removal operations: perfectly normal. Only evil people would resist spending any amount of money on their pet.

They were REALLY mean and unpleasant about people who might not agree.

@Wiggler1 I've no idea why you got such a hard time on here for your measured and helpful posts. I think maybe the horsey posters were feeling so defensive from all the non-horsey people accusing them of being horse-murdering bastards that they couldn't hear an alternative viewpoint any more. I thought your posts were thoughtful and thought-provoking (from someone who totally understood why the OP is considering PTS).

My TB accidentally self trimmed and is now confined to his stable until his feet grow enough to get shoes on.

I think the reason Wriggler1 has had a hard time on here is because her posts, quite unintentionally I'm sure, come across as rather bossy and know-it-all. She suggested things that the OP had said had been done. Yes, scoping for ulcers again might be a good idea, but frankly, the OP has done a huge amount and this horse is still dangerous. It is fantastic that a few pps have had unrideable horses that have come right for them, but let's be honest here - these are the exceptions. The OP's horse, for whatever reason, is dangerous. I respect and applaud her decision to PTS. It is never easy.

I was given a horse as a gift. I had a really bad accident from him three weeks after getting him. He was ridden out by the livery owner, a very experienced person, when I couldn't be there, which was most of the time. I came off because he almost fell - not his fauly. It turned out he had a twinge in his back. We rested him, and later he was sold to someone experienced who was told about his back and was more than happy with the way he was coming along from being rested. We knew this person. Had he not started to improve and had this person not come along when they did, I would have had him PTS. He was far too intelligent to live his life in a field and at 5/8th TB, would have had to have access to a stable. It broke my heart to sell him; it would have broken my heart to have him PTS. Making this kind of decision is, IMO, the responsible thing to do when you own any kind of animal.

Gabilan

The problem with recreating that in the UK with a domestic horse is finding enough space with varied enough terrain.

It's generally okay if you offer them a small hardened piece of terrain (a bit of concrete or such) and they can walk around plenty (mine are all on clay soil-moist a lot of the time). My guideline is 0.5 hectare/horse. I use the 0.5 hectare/horse number since it's actually cheap to keep horses this way. During the winter they get unlimited hay; during grass season I just rotate them between pastures. They are always outside, since they were little. I also quite like some designs of paddock paradises for smaller areas, that also works well, is more expensive but also stimulating and good for when you're lacking space.

Pretty certain that if you follow the NH farrier training, you could easily pull it off. A lot of work in the beginning, maintenance is like 5 minutes a horse/ 2 weeks (only for the working horses for me; the other ones self trim). Oh don't forget to build it up the exposure to certain types of soil. Time to adapt for the hooves.

Natural Horsemanship is popular where I live. Fan of Parelli, basically most of those that qualify as NHmen, bride-less riding, also quite fond of clickertraining.

Diplomaticdecorum

No I did it in evening classes. Couple times/week for one year. I think now it's two - I was lucky. Regardless I have the certificate so I'm allowed to use the term. If I wanted to practice the trade -legally- though I would have to do some sort of internship.

The natural certificate was only 2 lessons (after you pass an online test). The reason why it's so few lessons is because you basically only use the tools that can't really harm the horse (also it's really simple to follow the sole). Only a rasp and a hoof knife. They teach you safe techniques; you sit around and practice on the feet of a slaughtered horse (frozen), they inspect your work, you get the foot and off you go. You go home and then the real work starts.

Voci is that a qualification in the UK?

I use a blend of traditional and NH methods. Not a fan of Parelli, but that's a topic for another thread!

Dear God I hope not!! I would hate to think that there's 'barefoot trimmers' out there that have had two lessons!

I would not let anyone near my horse's feet who'd had 2 lessons...
Had a friend who recommended me a barefoot trimmer for my old lami pony, after I saw the state of the friends lami pony I definitely did not go down that route, their method was to let the hooves grow out until they looked like an abuse case! Stretching all the laminae completely. I used my farrier and the vet to be un shod.

OP I think you are doing the right thing, especially after exploring many avenues. I had to make the decision last year (with said old lami pony, he just wasn't improving) and it was the hardest decision. It is not something horsey people do lightly, and actually reading a lot of the posts on here about how "cruel" it is made me sad all over again about him. He wasn't suffering at the time but he had many many issues which would flare up and cause pain and his management practices that kept him pain free for years were starting to not help. He wasn't allowed out in grass so couldn't be a horse! He had a day out in the field then I said goodbye. I'd had him for 10 years and he spent the last 3 retired so it wasnt a decision based on his ride ability.
There are much worse fates than PTS. Talking about posting on Facebook is just so wrong, he could get into the wrong hands completely.

some bare foot trimmers are just dangerous.

I was very interested in going barefoot, and looked at lots of info, then a liverly at my yard had got one in for advice on her crippled horse.

one of things the liverly was raving about was the trimmer had given her an app to fine out the sugar content of grass at our stables.

I was quite excited by this, as I'd been looking at brix meters myself, also at companies that you can send hay/haylage/ grass too to get a detailed report.

I asked how it worked, she enthusiastically told me, "look you just put the postcode in and voila!"

Two lessons!

My 10 year old had more than that to pass her Pony Club D+ test!

Strasser trimming caused damage and pain to plenty of horses using a simple hoof knife and rasp,so it is untrue that they can't cause damage. I do think that the likes of Rockley that have rehabbed horses successfully can be useful, but I'd be very wary of using any Tom Dick or Harry that calls themself a barefoot farrier.

I think that is irrelevant in this instance though, if the op has genuinely tried everything then pts is the best option to ensure the horse isn't abused down the line. I'd probably have a full vet work up, try a course of gastroguard and possibly bute and see where that led, and also try increasing workload and reasses his diet, stripping it back to low sugar and high fibre and some types need lots of work to stay sane, but to be honest it sounds as if it is a temperament issue and I wouldn't judge the op for euthanising, I'd rather do that than risk injuring somebody or pass the horse on to an uncertain future.

There are plenty of good horses that need homes out there, better to home one of them than to continue with a dangerous horse.

@voci sweet suffering christ, of course you can do damage with a rasp and hoof knife. One of the breeding stallions I worked with cane to the stud lame became an idiot farrier had taken his feet back to practically the bone with those tools. Poor bugger had to live in pour in pads and heart bar shoes until his sole grew back enough to support him.

I'm not a fan of natural horsemanship. Too much of it is dominance dressed up as kindness.

I have 3 barefoot including a TB. But i also have a fantastic farrier with 20 years experience not some twat with a trimming certificate.

Too much of it is dominance dressed up as kindness

Yep, that. I was trying to work out whether or not to use a barefoot trimmer a friend recommended then I found out he uses Parelli techniques. I've spent months getting the TB I handle to the stage where if she's stressed I can calm her by putting a hand on her shoulder and breathing in sync with her for a few breaths. No way am I letting anyone who wants to dominate her anywhere near her.

NH as a concept is useful and some of its practitioners are great. Much of it I'd dump in the sea as pseudoscientific harmful nonsense.

NH as a concept is useful and some of its practitioners are great. Much of it I'd dump in the sea as pseudoscientific harmful nonsense

I agree so much to this.

have you heard about fear free training? I've only skimmed articles, but seems much more in line with my own way of doing things, then traditional and NH.

Oh Jesus.... Parelli. Now that's a whole new crock...

I think PTS is absolutely the right option in this scenario OP. It’s sad of course but the responsive decision.

Parelli et al are an American concept that should never have crossed the Atlantic.

Traditionally we treat horses VERY differently here compared with there - they need to be kinder to their animals IMO - including needing to stop removing claws from pet cats and cutting out the bark from dogs.

Monty Parelli Horsemanship is basically trying to do that - it's just here everyone hangs off every word and rushes out to buy the 'special' knotted rope headcollars - which are essentially just the easiest was to make a headcollar from a single length of rope. It came from necessity of being out on the ranch without a fully laden tack shop with unlimited budget.

To be honest, I don't understand the whole 'barefoot' concept either - surely your horse is in enough work to require shoes or it isn't, and it doesn't (obviously some have bad feet and/or need remedial shoeing), but why not just use your regular farrier for that?

Diplomatic what the hell???!!! Cutting out the bark from dogs? Seriously??? I knew they declawed cats, but debarking a dog???!!!

don't forget about the ear trimming, of dogs like Great Danes, and Dobermans and probably other breeds

Is parelli the one where you are meant to get off and shake the reins to tell a horse to rein back?

Utterly stupid.

The only people I have ever known who are into it were really terrible riders.

Gretol I think it is yes, also if you can't catch your horse chase it round and round until it gives up and it comes to you.

The few parelli owners I know, think themselves amazing. yet have their horse on full liverly

one even told me she was great at mucking out as the other year she had to do it herself for a week.

The only people I have ever known who are into it were really terrible riders.

Also in my experience the people into it are also the most scared of riding their horse

I might try the chasing my mare till she wants to be caught. I need to lose some weight.

Jesus fuck.

Just when I thought this thread couldn't get any worse the parelli/carrot stretchers/join up nut/rope shakers pile in.

Just what the horse needs. Confused/unpredictable/erratic blood horse? Shake a white rope at it until it either starts licking its lips or caves your head in.

Parelli is a load of bollocks. NH is just inexperienced people trying to replicate old school horsemanship. We had a parelli fucker on our yard. She told me my ponies needee to 'join up' with me. Took the lunge line off my mare, sent her round on both reins in a 20 x 40 school on a 15m circle in walk/trot/canter then she followed me like a dog back to the yard.

I don't need some fancy name to call a working relationship with my animals.

OP I hope you stopped reading this thread about 400 posts ago and I hope you find peace with your decision eventually .