I think I'm putting down my difficult horse

[whattodowheretogo]

I've posted about my horse on here before but I'd just like some last minute opinions.

I bought him a year ago from a TB breeder and trainer as she felt that she was too old for a horse like him and she couldn't sit his spooks.

No ground manners, didn't know where to put his feet, didn't respond to pressure.

I wanted a project and he was one in every sense of the word. I fell in love with him as soon as I saw him.

When I tried him out he was good, but at the end, he took off with me across the field and didn't stop until he physically couldn't go any further. I wasn't concerned about that, I just figured he was green and overwhelmed and these things would come with time.

When we got him home he needed a chifney to be taken anywhere or he would just set his neck and try to canter off (my ex was looking after him for a lot of the time - he's a racehorse trainer and rehab yard owner so he knows what he's doing!) and even he would struggle with him.

Through the months his ground manners improved but to this day he can suddenly try to drag you somewhere and canter off.

His biggest issues are ridden. I've had many rides on him when he's simply decided to take off and nothing can stop him until he's done himself in. One lesson I had we were cantering for so long with him screeching round the corners and bucking that I was getting lightheaded. My trainer couldn't do anything but stand and watch.

He will do things like take off, then screech to a halt in front of the fence, then shoot off again.

I've taken everything right back to basics, over the winter I worked solely on the ground with him, teaching him the saddle and bridle is a positive thing, we learnt to stand stock still at the mountain block, yield to pressure etc.

But he is so unpredictable - he'll do a nasty spook at "nothing", just completely drop his shoulder.

I've spent months just walking and trotting in the school to make it a nice calm experience for him. I've honestly tried everything.

He's just messed up his only saving grace - to hack he is brilliant and super calm. But this weekend he took one look at something on the floor, bolted for home and ran into the main road. I came off, got concussion and fractured my foot.

I've been riding for 17 years, I'll ride literally anything. I ride friend's difficult horses for them if they've come off and had accidents and have a great time. But there's just something about this horse that I just think.. what is it going to take?

I'm so thankful that this wasn't a worse injury for either me or him.

I'm pretty certain that I'm going to put him down. It's something I've discussed with my vet before after he remarked what a difficult git he was.

I feel like it would be unfair on him to pass him on, I'd worry about how he'd be treated given all his quirks, whether he'd be passed on again etc but also I'd worry that he may seriously injure himself or someone else.

Thoughts/suggestions?

@Gretol

She hasn’t done the things I suggested . I just said what I would do in that situation, it wouldn’t be enough for me.

I should add that I have disposable income to allow me to pursue other routes that not everyone has, but I factored in costs for this sort of thing when I bought and I assume the OP did too.

At no point has the OP said the horse is dangerous in the stable or on the yard. There’s a lot of vets, farriers and yard owners being kicked or squashed to death in these imaginary situations!

From the OP:
When we got him home he needed a chifney to be taken anywhere or he would just set his neck and try to canter off (my ex was looking after him for a lot of the time - he's a racehorse trainer and rehab yard owner so he knows what he's doing!) and even he would struggle with him

Through the months his ground manners improved but to this day he can suddenly try to drag you somewhere and canter off

And further along
my ex, who deals with difficult young racehorses for a living, was pinned against a wall by him in the stable. There was also another occasion where he got loose from my ex, and galloped around his farm until we managed to shut off all gates and catch him
you will have a situation like the one I had, where my horse was simply in the stable with my ex, where WE WERE NOT ASKING HIM TO DO ANYTHING, and he suddenly panicked and pinned him against the wall

That's not a horse I would be comfortable handling. I've been around horses for nearly 40 years and worked with them full time. I've owned two and am currently helping rehabilitate an ex racehorse. This is not a horse I would be willing to take on because I think however much help I got, he could be dangerous.

Perhaps you should take him on , wiggler??

OP, a couple of things did occur to me, in the interest of exploring all avenues.

He's been scope for ulcers but has the vet considered hind gut ulcers. You can't scope for them but diagnose on clinical signs and response to treatment. I have known horses with erratic behaviour improve greatly when treated for hind gut ulcers.

You could contact some hunting yards and see if they would be interested in him. I knew one very nappy horse who was dangerous to handle on the ground who was sold on to a hunting yard. They made no attempts to bond with him. They just worked him. A lot. He actually really settled there and enjoyed the job. He was not a leisure horse - not enough work for him and he just had no need to bond with a human handler. I mention this only as a possibility. It is problematic but if you investigated it and they said they wouldn't touch him either, it would reassure you that you are doing everything you can.

Sorry, missed the second post about pinning, but my point still stands, if he’s got issues with handling, don’t do it! As I said, it’s entirely possible with a bit of training to do everything you need to with him in a field surrounded by his mates. There seem to be a lot of handling issues involving the ex, I’ve known a lot of horses that aren’t keen on men, could be another avenue to explore.

Sadly I don’t have the setup, small acreage and already got one foster, this horse needs somewhere big to let off steam with a stable herd. I think people responding to my posts are missing the point I’m making, maybe I’m not being clear enough. I have no issue putting a problem horse to sleep, I’d just want to cross a few more things off my list before I did.

Wiggler so let's say the OP finds a huge field with other horses and chucks him in there, what happens in six weeks when he needs the farrier?

Even with the hypothetical big field in the middle of no-where a Thoroughbred horse is still going to need daily checks. If living out in winter it will need a rug and supplementary feeding, and year round will need worming, vaccinations and foot-trimming. At some point it will become ill or injure itself (field injuries common in delicate TBs) and will require veterinary attention. You can't keep a Thoroughbred without having to handle it regularly.

Fgs. I've got a self harming TB who can't be left alone for a moment without damaging himself. And he is the nicest natured horse I've ever known. If he was an arse then I couldn't cope.

Err, train him, as I said. A qualified behaviourist would be able to show you how to get him to stand happily to have anything that needs doing done. If you’re seeing the same behaviour in a field with friends and no pressure or stress I’d suggest it’s more likely to be a physical/psychological issue and wouldn’t hesitate to PTS.

These fields aren’t hypothetical! Google retirement livery.

This is reminding me why I try not to spend too much time with traditional horse owners, no ability to think outside the box.

OP, if you’re still reading this treatise and you’re in the South East I can pass on the number of a couple of great behaviourists if you like, I could also recommend a couple of retirement/natural livery yards that are used to handling (or not!) horses with behavioural difficulties.

if he’s got issues with handling, don’t do it! As I said, it’s entirely possible with a bit of training to do everything you need to with him in a field surrounded by his mates

Isn't that still handling them though? I know of people who will barefoot trim with the horse at liberty but you're still handling the horse.

If I won the lottery I'd have 1000s of acres all safely walled in, with natural water supplies and varied terrain and plenty of shelter. But even with all that, you could fill up with unwanted horses very quickly. The problem isn't really with the OP - it's a more systemic problem of us breeding too many horses and sometimes damaging some of them beyond repair.

Me too Gabilan.

When I win big on the Premuim Bonds .....

There is a lot worse that can happen to a horse than to be well looked after and then quietly put to sleep at home. I personally would have no criticism of an owner that did this. It's sad, but it's not cruel. Retiring a TB to living out in a British climate is not as easy and straightforward as it sounds.

The issues appear (from the limited info the OP has given) to be around leading and handling in enclosed spaces, it would be interesting to see how he reacts with space to get away and a patient trimmer.

Completely agree, frankly the horse world needs a massive shake up, but it’s not going to happen if we do things the way they’ve always been done.

Wiggler1

I'm in agreement with your posts. I also own multiple unrideable horses. Including one, mentioned above, a real problem horse - he broke someone's back. He's happy in the herd. People keep mentioning a farrier, you don't need to do that if he's kept outside 24/7 with shelter. It takes care of itself (unless he has some sort of problem, but quite rare really), or do you think wild horses see a farrier. I did a farrier's training simply because I couldn't find a good farrier since quite a few of them are brutes - isn't hard btw would recommend to all. I did both the traditional module (with irons) and the natural horsemanship variety (only do the second now, since I am very pleased with the results; without).

I don't qualify as a traditional horse owner, since most of it doesn't make sense imo. I try to keep my horses as natural as possible. On bokt.nl you have a good mix.

TBs are bred to run fast rather than to be physically and psychologically sound, which is why so many end up with problems. Whilst this is ethically questionable, the OP has to deal with the horse she's got.

So the suggestion is to liberty trim a horse that has a history of blindly bolting and squashing people? Why didn't the OP think of this bloody genius idea?! She's clearly an irresponsible owner. May I be a fly on the wall while you knowledgeable folk try out this experiment with this horse?

A qualified behaviourist would be able to show you how to get him to stand happily to have anything that needs doing done

I don't believe this for a minute.

Please tell me at liberty what exactly the horse would squash you against. Do you not think that without pressure/stress the horse might not be inclined to blindly bolt? If the horse mows you down at liberty, out of the blue, I’d be putting to sleep as I said.

Are people deliberately misreading my posts or am I really being that unclear? Either it’s behavioural, in which case some time out relaxing might help, if it’s physical/psychological and not resolved with bute/omeprazole, I’d PTS. This Is Just What I Would Do. Why are people taking this as a criticism of the OP, I’m not making any judgments at all, just suggestions based on my own experience.

Gretol don't you know that a qualified behaviourist is the stock answer to every dangerous animal problem on Mumsnet?!
If there was a rabid Tyrannosaurus Rex rampaging down the road, savaging everything in his path, all you would need would be a qualified behaviourist to sort him out.

It would be great, wouldn't it Ursula. Maybe not in this lifetime though.

People keep mentioning a farrier, you don't need to do that if he's kept outside 24/7 with shelter. It takes care of itself (unless he has some sort of problem, but quite rare really), or do you think wild horses see a farrier.

I know wild horses self trim. The problem with recreating that in the UK with a domestic horse is finding enough space with varied enough terrain. My horse is shod in front and barefoot behind. He largely self trims, with road work. I'm also investigating going entirely barefoot with the ex racehorse I'm rehabbing. I'm not averse to trying these things as I do think more natural methods are better.

However, I also think that they're not always possible, at least not within our current way of keeping horses. I've encountered plenty of resistance to my horse having no hind shoes even though he has very good feet and no problem with it. I'm also aware that a TB is not an entirely natural creation but has been artificially selected by us. Therefore, as much as we might want to leave things up to nature, it might not be the best for the horse.

You know what, don’t bother, just shoot it.

Sorry OP, hope some of this has been helpful but I’m out now.

wtf is the matter with you wiggler? The OP has said that she has taken over a year and tried everything. She managed to get him to stand nicely, she's been hacking him. He is unpredictable. So even if this magical qualified behaviourist manages to get him to stand nicely there's nothing to say he won't revert to type a week afterwards.

I agree I would probably try a bute trial, just so I ticked that box. Then go from there but I would never judge anyone for having a horse like this pts.

I have a BWB mare who is temperamental verging on dangerous. I’ve had her 12 years and she is now a very expensive lawn mower. Full livery costs me £450 a month as she can’t/won’t live out and I get very little pleasure in return. To ride she was sharp but talented and destroyed all my confidence. She hasn’t been been ridden in 3 years but she still causes havoc on occasion. Last year she shattered my hand which required surgery and pins kicking out at me when I was picking her feet out. I had no end of professionals out and she marginally improved with lots of work. In September she was booked in to be PTS but I couldn’t go through with it.

Why? I love her she has been a big part of my life, she is now in her twenties and each day I almost hope she gets ill so I have an ‘excuse’ to pts. So I don’t feel guilty.

It is a huge financial burden. I have a young family and the money would be better used elsewhere. I would have never sold her as she would have ended up being passed around.

I wish I was as brave as you. Don’t let anyone tell you you’re doing the wrong thing. The only wrong thing to do would be to pass on a horse like this to someone else. Either let him live out his days as a field ornament you own or pts.

Voci I am impressed at your commitment to train as a farrier when you couldn't find a good one - is it still a four year apprenticeship?

Luckily mine is good and kind and has been shoeing horses for over 40 years now. He was fantastic with a little loan pony I have. He can't be ridden as goes crazy with a jockey on board, can be a little hard to handle at times, but is only 11hh and is scared/remembering bad times rather than nasty/dangerous.