Teachers: do you believe the moon landings were a hoax?

[noblegiraffe]

I was just on Teacher Tapp and found the results from this poll pretty horrifying: 15% of teachers polled don’t disagree with the statement “I believe the moon landings from 1969 to 1972 were actually a hoax”.

What now? Nearly 1 in 6 of us??

www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/oct/11/simulated-world-elon-musk-the-matrix

But the conspiracy theory about the moon landings not only assumes that politicians are smart (!), but that everyone involved has kept the secret, and that all the scientists and engineers involved in moon science or space travel down the line haven’t spotted that the moon landing technology was fake, the reflector doesn’t exist and the moon rocks are from a rockery. Plus they faked thousands of photos, videos, and actual rocket launches that people went along to watch.

noblegiraffe

I am well aware. But it isn't the same as it turning out that we are all living inside a lady dragon. It is possible, according to our understanding of the universe, whereas the other isn't.

““Is it logically possible that we are in a simulation? Yes. Are we probably in a simulation? I would say no,” said Max Tegmark, a professor of physics at MIT.”

noblegiraffe

Well, duh.

This thread is so depressing.

How did we manage to abandon rational thought and Enlightenment values so easily? How can any sane person doubt that the moon landings happened?

And, more to the point given the OP’s question, how did we come to such a sorry state that significant numbers of teachers of young minds would give this utter shite intellectual house-room?

(Assuming the survey is even slightly reliable of course.)

@Ruffina

Honestly, no it isn't. It's just a couple of buffoons posturing. Please don't worry and don't give them any head space. All sane people know that the moon landings happened, just as they know that they are a human and they live on the planet earth. They don't need proof dished up for them for every facet of every single thing - that way madness lies.

For clarity: I don’t think we live in the matrix. It’s an example of wildly implausible things that we don’t have to reference every time we talk about stuff.

Was your train on time? Yes, unless it was late and I was abducted by aliens who rewound time when I reached my destination.

Did man land on the moon? Yes, unless it was faked with the help of aliens who planted stuff on the moon for us and gave us moon rocks.

How did we manage to abandon rational thought and Enlightenment values so easily?

We didn't. Well, I didn't. I don't accept things just because I am told they are true by so-called "experts". That is true to the values of Enlightenment, isn't it, if you consider that the Enlightenment was born of the desire to be free of other people telling us what to think because they know better?

noblegiraffe

But you think the probabilities of the Matrix scenario and the faking of the ML are anywhere within the same few million decimal places? Really?

I’d put the moon landings up there with Henry VIII having 6 wives. In fact the moon landings are better documented given that we don’t have any video footage of Henry VIII and Henry VIII isn’t still alive to ask.

The central principle of Enlightenment thinking is the use of reason. Rejecting expert views reflexively is the opposite of reasoning.

I do agree though that the label ‘expert’ is too easily thrown around these days. Largely by the crappier end of the media and by self-appointed, self-defining ‘experts’ on the internet.

But doubting the reality of the moon landings has nothing to do with experts, genuine or not. It’s just foolish.

Rejecting expert views reflexively is the opposite of reasoning.

Perhaps, but since I haven't done that, I won't worry about it.

Yeah, you have. Worry.

noblegiraffe

Now you are avoiding answering me. Let's go out on a limb and imagine that you think there is a 0.00001 chance that the ML (the first one) was faked. That is 1 in 10 million, I think (do check my arithmetic). Assuming that is where you would position it, where would you position the probability of us being simulations? Serious question.

Eh? You’re asking me to estimate the probability we’re living in the matrix in actual numbers? How should I know?

noblegiraffe

Well, you seemed fairly certain of a lot of stuff a few minutes ago. Okay, leave that one then. Just answer my original question? Are those two events of a similar probability, or are they (probably) separated by any, many orders of magnitude, or do you just have no idea?

If the "no idea" option is your preferred, that's fine, but it would be nice if you could stop pretending you do know.

I'm doing probability before Christmas. I am bracing myself...

TheFallenMadonna

I hope you get someone like me 😂

Honestly, I don't deny the ML!

There is always one. Every time.

TheFallenMadonna

Good.

Ruffina

Where did I "reflexively" reject any expert view, let alone all expert views?

Fallen but it is possible an eagle would swoop in, steal the coin mid-air and it wouldn’t land on either heads or tails you know.

Yep.

noblegiraffe

But at the point of tossing the coin, you are assuming a probability of 1 that the coin is going to land on Heads or Tails. If that is a certainty, the rest follows mathematically. The child who questions the assumption that the coin is going to land at all isn't incorrect, they just need to work from the assumption you give them.

@noblegiraffe but it is possible an eagle would swoop in, steal the coin mid-air and it wouldn’t land on either heads or tails you know.

But I thought 'The eagle had landed?'