I have pre-ordered Andrew Lownie's Book (out I think 14th August) A thread for those interested in "Entitled"

[BasiliskStare]

So for those interested in this book about the Yorks. I will read it and interested to hear from others who have or to give an opinion.

No spitting , no gouging 😂

I still find this chap’s approach and manner really irritating. As I said, I think if he didn’t simper and try to be so ingratiating I’d take him more seriously. His sweet, ‘I’m SO unthreatening and such a nice chap!’ act is at odds with what he’s writing…and it grates.

Agree @CoffeeCantata

The SA was the point where I started viewing him in a different light, that and the ‘giving him a good kicking in Rugby’ and now the repeating of what he knows is speculation and gossip. Not doing it for me in terms of viewing him as a respected historian in this particular case. Just because he speaks nicely and is well educated, he still seems very at ease in offering up all the ‘gossip rag’ stories when he wants to. Just my view.

This article gives you an oversight of what Andrew Lownie has had to face in the past when trying to reveal hidden stories. Suffice to say there are many people with vested interests who are keen to hinder or discredit his work.

https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/03064220231183835

It’s a job I am glad he is doing, because our politicians have totally failed to defend the interests of the ordinary citizen, by asking probing questions; they have become far too deferential and complicit.

I've listened to a lot of the interviews now. I find him pretty level. Like a genuine decent old style head teacher. I'm looking forward to the paperback now.

Yes - he’s playing on hie public school image and establishment connections to an annoying degree to pose as perhaps more ‘respectable’ than his oeuvre suggests. However justified the Entitled revelations might be, there’s too much of the scandal-monger about him for me.

The CSA bits sit uneasily, I think. He needs to name names, times and places if he has them and not be so blood coy. If he doesn’t have this information then he needs to keep schtumm, or it is merely gossip.

Let’s be perfectly honest, if this book was about a different royal couple and such salacious gossip was included, a lot of people wouldn’t be interested in defending his character quite so much.

Quite, Jeff😀!

So, Mr Lownie,

If you have hard evidence that Andrew knowingly had sex with underage girls in Thailand (wouldn’t surprise me), then let’s have chapter and verse and let it throw light on his Epstein activities.

If the CSA at both the prep school and with the ‘escort’ are well-attested, let’s have names and details (dates might be too much of an ask at this distance in time) and STOP BEING SO BLOODY COY!

Never mind waiting to put these yummy little snippets in your next book - report to the police as potential crimes.

Just out of interest CoffeeCantata, have you listened to any interviews with him or read the book?

Because I think it is important to put it all into context by gaining as much knowledge as possible about the author..

I have just listened to a 35 minute interview with him and I have to say, he has touched on all manner of things that you are berating him for, and he comes across well throughout.

it does remind me of when 'Spare' came out. The salacious details were used as clickbait but they only accounted for about 1% of the book and I did at the time urge people to actually read the book. Many didn't. The book was far more balanced than what the DM printed.

No. If there was another Royal who had behaved as Andrew has done, with our without salacious gossip, I would be acting in exactly the same way.

I think AL has been stonewalled by officialdom throughout his research. A lot of information is sealed and as Thailand was at the tax payers expense in his official role it's all sealed

I haven't bought the book.

I have read the extracts in the DM, an interview with Lownie in the Times, and watched about two-thirds of the interview I linked upthread.

I fully intended to buy the book until I saw/heard the reference to the CSA.

No way would there ever be a list of young Thai girls that Andrew used! It has an illegal sex industry, corrupt police, and the country thrives on sex tourists

Besides which, as said above, all records connected to Andrew's trade role are sealed for our lifetime. This is part of the cover up that Lownie spoke about in his interview. I find it appalling. He was a public servant at the time and funded by the taxpayer. It's amazing how the royals can cover it all up when they want to.

As I already mentioned CoffeeCantata
another journalist, a friend of Lownie, has already corroborated the Thai story from two entirely new and separate sources;

https://www.yahoo.com/entertainment/articles/exclusive-details-prince-andrew-thai-135410010.html

Lownie is also calling for a proper investigation by the National Crime Agency and said that he’s willing to give them all of the evidence in his files that didn’t make the Final Cut of the book.

Andrew Lownie has put the necessary facts in his book and no more precisely because he doesn’t want to be gratuitously salacious.

He can’t win though!

If he puts too much information in, then he is accused of being deliberately prurient!

And if to add balance, he includes a discreet paragraph told in very factual terms about the CSA , then he is criticised for not giving enough detail!

https://www.thenewsagents.co.uk/article/prince-andrew-met-with-40-escorts-on-taxpayer-funded-thailand-trip-biographer-cl-5HjdBKh_2/

It was a tax-payer funded trip.

It's really unbelievable isn't it. And to take Epstein along on some of these sex trips is shocking

One thought that occurred to me... obviously Andrew is damaged in some way, whether that be from SA, from his mother over indulging him, from Gordounstoun, any or all of those.

I wonder if he had had access to really good therapy or counselling when he was perhaps in his early 20s, whether he would not have turned out like he has. I know that would be totally private, I just wonder if QE2 or the wider family actually put any store by working through things with a therapist.

Thanks, Ploachedplorridge

It really is becoming harder and harder to justify sealing the TE records (among others).

I hope AL's book becomes instrumental in driving calls for long overdue full royal transparency.

Yes, I've seen a couple of interviews and he comes over (or tries to come over) as a really nice, Oxbridgey, establishment sort of chap. I'm sure he's highly intelligent and well-educated - I wouldn't argue on that.

I haven't read the book but I've read the excerpts on here (not the same, I understand, according to some who say the tone is less tabloid in the book). I was with him until the mention of CSA, which I thought he dealt with flippantly - just like another piece of gossip, or on a par with the financial issues. I think it's of an entirely different order and may in fact relate to criminal activity. I want him to acknowledge this, which I haven't seen him so. I would like him to say whether he's actually alleging historic child abuse or not. If so, phone the cops. If not, stop teasing us.

I think he wants to run with the fox and hunt with the hounds...something just doesn't sit right. I can't quite put my finger on it, but I don't warm to him - I wouldn't trust him. I ought to read the book, but I didn't read Spare and (although I have very few principles) I tend to steer clear of blockbuster exposes. The author doesn't need my few bob!

I don't expect a list of the girls...I just want the sources to come out and say whether the girls were in fact underage. Someone must know. Perhaps they do that in the book? If so, that would put his Epstein activities in a clearer light - although I accept the girls in that case weren't technically underage.

Lownie is also calling for a proper investigation by the National Crime Agency and said that he’s willing to give them all of the evidence in his files that didn’t make the Final Cut of the book.

@Ploachedplorridge you have clearly looked at this in greater detail than I. Is Lownie also asking for a proper investigation into the alleged child sex abuse of Andrew? He details ongoing abuse by a prep school teacher, as well as the incident where he is taken to the escort at age 11.

Why ‘escort’? She was a prostitute!

In the interview I watched Lownie clearly mentions the name of the parent who arranged the prostitute visit, but it’s beeped or otherwise removed (I can’t remember exactly what they do, but he certainly mentioned the name to the interviewer. I’ll have to go back and find it…

But this still raises questions, as a pp mentioned. How did this fit in with Andrew’s security? I have no idea what’s involved in inviting the son of the monarch to a friends’s home…perhaps, unless you’re the heir, it’s very relaxed? Or would this be a parent who was a trusted friend of the family?

I’d like to know.

It's in the public/tax payers interest for a proper investigation into his actions while representing the country at our expense. And for the future to ensure the gravy boat stops.
While I am not unaware of historic child sex abuse in public schools after reading Earle Spencer's book and hearing horrific details from Nicky Campbell and his peers. It is up to PA and others affected to go to the police or for the police force in question to start their own enquiries.

I asked that upthread, so I agree. How on earth could it happen, given the security that is tight around royals. I presume it must've been a trusted friend or something, I don't know

But it must have been at a similar time to Princess Anne's kidnap attempt so how good was security then . Nothing like today

It's in the public/tax payers interest for a proper investigation into his actions while representing the country at our expense

Of course, @Luddite26, but with all the details sealed I don't imagine the RF will unseal them for the pleasure of sharing with those who'd like to know

And remembering that Parliament has shackled itself into not even discussing these things, who's going to force them anyway?