C5 Documentary: Harry and Meghan, Rise and Fall

[IsoldeWagner]

Anyone watching this? It's on My5. I thought the first episode was interesting. I was reminded of how popular they were and how much support they got.

Just small points....
H&M's children don't need 'to meet their cousins' or get to know them, they need to meet their 2 grandfathers. Meeting their cousins would only be useful if they were going to be part of the RF in the UK, but I dont see that ever being on the cards.

Catherine being a Scorpio and 'holding grudges' .... she is incredibly protective of her own family and the RF in general. Any slight or criticism (or lies or dodgy interviews) that have damaged the RF brand or hurt individual members will not be forgotten by her. That is a strength and not a weakness and to be applauded.

I distinctly recall the Daily Mail’s James Whitaker wrote a full page column about why William should not be marrying a commoner after W&K got engaged. It was awful. And as pointed out above, the press were vicious about Kate and her family before that. Mostly I think because they were a solid unit they couldn’t break and were trying to provoke a response they never got.

If Meghan really were a feminist, her response to the bridesmaids dress story would have been ‘yes there were words, I was stressed in the run up to my huge wedding, my SIL had just given birth, everyone knows how things can happen in the heat of the moment. Also, I know how the UK media works by seeking to pit royal women against each other and I will not play that game’. THAT would have been taking a proper stand against the media.

Oh how funny! Another poster that “doesn’t even like Harry and Meghan” but has somehow managed to stumble into the Royal Family forum and insist that H and M’s popularity was sabotaged by royal jealousy and that Kate is as dull as cardboard. What an utter coincidence!

Such a good point!

Lifestooshort71

Catherine being a Scorpio and 'holding grudges' ....

Luddite26 said a few posts back:

Kate's a Capricorn and once spurned she will not forgive that is for sure.

I think her birthday's in January, so Capricorn sounds right.
But doesn't it just go to show that you can fit anybody into any sign of the zodiac by mentioning one character trait and it's all pretty meaningless?

Galoop

Kate seems lovely, but she's about as interesting as cardboard

What would make her "interesting" in your eyes?
Meghan and Diana only became "interesting" when things started to go wrong in their lives and people wanted to hear about the fall-out. What was so fascinating about them before that?

They, like Kate, were good-looking women who'd married into the RF and were a novelty.

Kate with her happy marriage, fitting well into the RF and obviously without any possibilities of giving "tell all" interviews may not seem "interesting" to some. It really depends on what interests you.

Kate's a Capricorn and once spurned she will not forgive that is for sure.

I think her birthday's in January, so Capricorn sounds right
That was my mistake, yes, Capricorn and not Scorpio

@LaMarschallin oh that's a shame you find star signs meaningless. It's definitely not the trait of a Scorpio which of course is King Charles' star sign!

It wasn’t aimed at Camilla. If you look back to my original post, you will see that Serenster explained it 🙂

Yes, I can’t say I’m hugely interested in Catherine, because I don’t know much about her. In real life, with those close to her, I imagine she’s very interesting, because let’s face it, she’s had an interesting life and knows a lot of interesting people! She has many hobbies - lots of sport, piano, cooking and baking and probably lots of other things we don’t know about - and a sense of humour. unlike Meghan (who has 0 sense of humour) I imagine she probably talks about topics other than herself and her own wonderfulness, too. She doesn’t have megawatt charisma like Diana, but so few people do that it is barely worth mentioning at all.

Have you ever considered that, far from being something ‘simple’ people miss, a lot of people understand these tactics perfectly well? Let’s take the notorious avocados. At some point, Catherine has eaten an avocado and the papers have written about it (why the DoC loves avocados and you should too - that kind of DM fill space crap). Later, the paper needs to fill some more columns. Avocados are going out of fashion due environmental concerns. Meghan either hasn’t got the memo (she is a bit stuck in the 90s after all) or more likely, said something about liking avocados a few years ago. Bingo! A more interesting take on Meghan and avocados than just repeating the old story but replacing Catherine with Meghan. Added bonus of a story pitting two women against each other. Space filled, papers sold, clicks.

100% correct.

On 20 January 2019 Meghan’s sometime makeup artist Daniel Martin posted a shot of avocado toast on Instagram and thanking Meghan for hosting him that weekend and still being “the avocado whisperer”.

On 22 January 2019 the Mail ran an article headlined “How Meghan’s favourite avocado snack - beloved of all millennials - is fuelling human rights abuses, drought and murder”. They specifically referred to Daniel Martin’s instagram image as the hook for their story.

it was complete click bait - all they were doing was taking an existing story about avocados and blatantly linking it to a figure who they knew would mean a hell of a lot more people would read it.

Also, the whole “smear campaign” from the place ignores the obvious truth that the stories the papers were writing about - there were tensions behind the scenes, the Sussexes took a lot of private jet flights, Meghan’s clothes were expensive and she was often on holidays - were factual. It’s not a smear campaign if what the the papers are reporting is actually happening.

Plus, the biggest story of all that the Palace sat on was that Meghan was bullying her staff behind the scenes to the extent that an official complaint about her had been filed. Clearly, the Press team were protecting her (they also went on the record to deny more stories about Meghan in the brief time she was in the Royal family than anyone else. Their team even formally denied they were intending to move the Canada the day before the Sussexes announced it on their own website).

I think Harry did not make wise choices. He could have had a very quiet lovely life in the English countryside without much publicity, fairly low income but home provided, doing royal engagements or even a very quiet non royal life abroad

He could indeed, @Xenia, but whether or not that would have worked for him personally he married a woman it certainly wouldn't have suited

So Meghan wanted LA, Meghan got LA and here we are

I imagine (Kate) probably talks about topics other than herself and her own wonderfulness, too

I've met her, @Sussurations, and while that's obviously not the same as "knowing" her it's certainly true that she has a range of interests - especially around local Norfolk issues, where the depth of her knowledge pleasantly surprised me

And I'm a nobody who she couldn't have lknown she was going to meet so couldn't have been briefed ...

i agree with this and suspect discussions had been going on for far longer than it was first thought when you read their January 2020 statement in light of what has happened since. I still cannot understand how Harry thought that ‘collaborating’ with the queen was ever going to be possible. I can only think that he was trying to put her in a position where she felt it was difficult to say ‘no’ to them.

Maybe he rues the day he ever said ‘What Meghan wants, Meghan gets’. What he didn’t know was she wanted his balls in her handbag, and that’s what she got.

Ironically, I suspect she probably would have actually preferred a much stronger (richer, more powerful) man than the weakling she has. She should have gone after someone like Jeff Bezos.

It was all clever PR. And she played to the cameras. No substance.

Also, the whole “smear campaign” from the place ignores the obvious truth that the stories the papers were writing about - there were tensions behind the scenes

Right at height of Harry and Meghan popularity they were due to do a local visit coincidentally one of my kids was on school visits to same place - and the teachers were so excited - couple were very late so they missed them these thing happen but local rumours started form people there said they were late and very rude - you sort of shrug and get on with life - but when you start to see similar in newspaper at different events who start to be more included to not dismiss it even if you initially put it down to hiccups in arrangements.

Where as Queen - in population of 67 million she won't have met everyone - but my primary school in 80s worked out she had to pass out village between public engagements had us all turn out with flowers and despite huge security concerns at time - they stopped the car took the flowers and wrote to say thank you afterwards. All I saw was the black cars but parents and wider family feel but better disposed towards them afterwards. I heard similar positive stories from family friends who met Diana in crowds.

I know the press get blamed but there are local informal social networks that pass impressions on. I think celebs being dicks is more accepted even if frowned on because they are selling their talent - whereas RF is much more nebulous more wrapped up in culture, history and good works so feel good factor is more important.

Plus post split there are some many instances on camera where Meghan been rude - turning her back on school kids in Nigeria is one example.

I increasingly think Harry happy chappie persona was a cleaver PR stunt from palace PR people and he not like that at all and that's because of interviews he's given and a book he wrote.

@Galoop if anything MM is as boring as cardboard, she constantly bleats on about herself, turns every conversation back her herself, puts herself front and centre of everything she possible can ... Catherine is demure and adds to the RF, to charities and peoples lives; Megan is self centred, self serving and crass, she only takes takes takes from everything she jumps on the back of - look at IG for a prime example, on the take financially and self publicity

That's interesting, @SmileyHappyPeopleInTheSun because they were over an hour late for one engagement on this Colombian "royal tour".

Harry was extremely popular before meeting Meghan, I seem to remember that he consistently came second behind QEII in polls. He was well thought of for his charities and for the fact he had been deployed in Afghanistan and in fairness, he exuded charm and relatability on public engagements. Mistakes like dressing up as a Nazi were put down to youth and eg the naked pool escapade to high spirits. I'm not sure how he could actually have been better regarded. If there was "jealousy" as alleged from Charles/William/Kate, one would think there would have been manouvering/briefing against him against him during that period, but noone suggests there was.

I honestly do not see William and Kate (or Charles and Camilla) being put out by the "shiny new couple" taking some of the heat (and work) off them and give them all credit for enough maturity to realise that the media will always laud the new and shiny, until they don't.

It's all a bit "conspiracy theory" as well. As if "the media" is a homogeneous, all powerful entity to be manipulated eg by the RF. Or the illuminati 🙄
I think these people never read the UK papers or watched the tv news when H&M were official royals. It was often positive.

Oh I don’t know, the propaganda in Colombia this last week could be spotted a mile away by the ‘simplest’ (your word, not mine) of people.

I think late can happen to anyone - though it seem to happen to this couple a lot but it's how it handled - apologising and being as charming as possible not sweep in and be rude which local rumour mill accused them off.

I've twice been late to job interviews but still got the job (I'm usually early to appointments ) - due to public transport issues - been mortified and let them know before hand so they could re-arrange or cancel then when they went ahead apologised for wasting their time - which seemed to be enough to get them back onside.

Excellent post @wordler , can't agree more!