‘Courtiers’ 2

[RandomPenguinHouse]

The last thread filled up during a particularly chatty morning.

No, they don't. 🙄 But just like most wealthy individuals and companies, they do their negotiations behind closed doors.

@MarshaMelrose
The figure of 350 million ( that the royals cost us ) includes the unpaid tax.

Here are the financial reforms Repyblic suggests .
Perfectly reasonable . In fact when you read what they are asking for it reinforces how corrupt the royals are ( written before the queen's death)
I'd be more than happy if the royals agreed to obey the same laws as the rest of us .

•	Parliament to set an annual fixed budget for the monarchy - including an annual salary for the Queen - to be managed and reported on by a government department, not Buckingham Palace.
•	All security costs to be made transparent and accountable.
•	All costs of royal visits around the country to be incorporated into the monarchy's budget, not met by local authorities.
•	The institution of the monarchy, and all members of the royal household, to be required to abide by the same tax laws and rules as all other public bodies and private individuals.
•	The Duchies of Lancaster and Cornwall to be fully investigated by parliament with a view to transferring them into public ownership, with all revenue going to the Treasury.
•	The Crown Estate to be renamed 'the National Estate' and its status clarified through amendment of the Crown Estate Act.

Just checking in to catch up on thread later - apologies to anyone I didn't respond to (and warmest thanks for the "stay safe" messages) - only just got power and internet back!!

To give Florida Power and Light their due that's not bad considering it was a major, Category 5 hurricane which came ashore very close by - not an experience I'm keen to repeat but all part of life's rich tapestry and all that

The Crown Estate to be renamed 'the National Estate' and its status clarified through amendment of the Crown Estate Act.

And that’s exactly the kind of nationalisation that would lead to a valid claim for compensation…

I’m also never impressed with figures that get artificially inflated to make them sound more persuasive. That’s not “unpaid” tax. It is tax that has never have claimed, and never would be.

@MarshaMelrose

You are wrong in what you say about the Duchys and their tax affairs .

But since you are so convinced you are right could you let lord Berkeley know? He has spent years trying to get clarity re the Duchys tax and legal affairs. He has repeatedly attempted to get Bills through the House of Lords and what a waste of his time if you say all is above board !

lordslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/lln-2018-0100/

Definitely - the countries MN seem to admire and aspire to be like are all constitutional monarchies - Denmark, Norway, Netherlands. The UK has been a stable place under a constitutional monarchy for a long time. Not something to be sneezed at, and not something to dispense with lightly.

Without the monarchy that £350m would still have to be spent but it would be the civil service that spent it rather than the monarch. It goes on so many things related to their state duties, including upkeep of historical properties owned by the country not the monarchy.

This with bells on!

I'm just commented from reading the article you attached. The Duchy's accounts are clearly open to public scrutiny because of all the people who have commented on them. They may not like how the tax affairs are set up, but that's not the Duchy's fault. Every accountant I know tries to give the best tax minimisation they can. Why would the Duchy's accountants be different?

Tony Berkeley lives in Cornwall, doesn't he? Wasn't there an accusation that he was using the private members bills to settle a score? Anyway, he has a right to introduce whatever bills he wants to. Good luck to him. It is ironic, though, that he's a vice chairman of a Lords group on Whistleblowing which has been subject to criticism for its lack of transparency and accountability. 😂 I guess his motto is, if you can't beat them, join them!

Thank goodness you are ok! Been thinking about you!!!

Thanks for asking @jeffgoldblum I’m good, have been offline because I was away for the weekend, just got back to tonight. Saw that the thread has exploded but have only read your post as I got a notification taking me to it and didn’t have to wade back through pages. Oh and the one from MNHQ as I saw they had commented. Sounds like it’s been eventful, and not in a good way. I’m not sorry I missed it.

I find it a stretch to believe that Meghan created so much damage and hurt to so many people in a short 2 year period.

We have evidence that Charles, William and Harry have behaved obnoxiously throughout their lives and not been held to account in the same way.

I'm glad you're safe @Puzzledandpissedoff. Have seen some awful footage of the devastation - the causeway between Sanibel and Fort Myers looks to be decimated :(.

The Surgeon is the boy's Mother..It's obvious!
But maybe in the 1960's, it wasn't..

You're quite right, @Klayda - Sanibel was accessible only by air, though they've now got a ferry going too, and it's a hell of a mess all round

In Australia the monarchy are becoming less and less popular.

the monarchy is the biggest symbol of colonial power. It’s insulting to the First Nations people of Australia to have as its head of state the symbol of the unlawful possession of Australia. Plus many of Australia’s population come from countries previously colonised by the British.

Predictions are Australians will vote for a republic in the next referendum for it. If the current newly elected govt get a second term that’s when it intends to hold that referendum, apparently.

It only occurred to me reading this and other threads on Mumsnet that as the British Monarchy have large landholdings in Australia, will it have to to give those landholdings back?

Certain posters had some of their posts deleted off this thread, you can prob guess which ones

I think one of them was a banned poster?

Ive been told by indigenous Australians that among older indigenous people the Queen was quite popular. Sometimes they were able to get meetings with her when they couldn’t get meeting with local Australians politicians. For younger people, it’s not the same.

The referendum on the republic is a long way off, regardless. If the referendum on the Voice to Parliament fails it’s unlikely we’ll even have one on a republic.

I think Charles is onboard with countries choosing to leave the Commonwealth.

They wouldn't leave the Commonwealth, though. The Commonwealth is actually growing. The only country to ever leave permanently and not reapply is Ireland. Now countries that were never even part of the British Empire are joining. Out of 56 membee countries, only 14 have the King as head of state.

Yes, even if Australia becomes a republic we’d stay in the Commonwealth.

If you’ve read the Uluṟu Statement from the Heart it really is hard to see how a Voice to Parliament won’t be successful at the referendum. In my opinion, basically it will come down to just how racist Australians are and how much of a mucky, fearful frenzy can be whipped up by the hard, far right in Australia. (Australians rejected that frenzy at our most recent federal election). I’m thinking most Australians will see that the only fair road is to vote yes. I think it will be a very sad day if First Nations people are denied the Voice.

I don’t doubt that some Elders would have had a better response from the Queen than the Australian Govt. It took up where the British Govt left off in regard to First Nations people. Aust govt was intent on apartheid, assimilation, segregation, the Stolen Generations, denial of basic human rights etc. But I would not be inclined to think all Elders feel this way about the Queen from what I have read and heard. And no nation of people are a homogenous group.

I do think large numbers of Australians felt a connection to the Queen, but I’m not getting that same feeling about Charles.

Becoming a republic does not mean Australia leaves the commonwealth. But I can see this being misunderstood in Australia by some people, and that misunderstanding being used in a disingenuous way to encourage some Australians to fear becoming a republic.

Yes, I’ve read the statement from the heart and will be voting for the voice. I think it’s far more important than whether we’re a republic.

Back on topic, I’m looking forward to the book coming out. The extracts have been interesting so far. I’m wondering how far back it goes, historically and if it will include the period when Charles and Diana were constantly briefing against each other? That would be an interesting time for their advisors.