Prince Philip, from an foreigner's perspective

[Kishkashta]

I am not English, but have been living here for quite a while. And I just don't get what all the fuss is about with prince Philip.

Every single article I read (there are a lot of them lately...) mentions his unconventional personality and sense of humor. But the thing is, from my experience, this is just cookie cutter behavior of the (especially older male) members of the British upper class. These politically incorrect jokes that kind of just stir the water a bit and slightly off kilter behavior. I just find it weird how in these articles it is presented as something unique about him whereas in reality all these stories are just something that describes essentially his class rather than his personality.

Also I don't know how anybody can take seriously the attempts to paint his life as full of hardships (had to give up his "Navy career" to support the Queen - the only reason he had his kind of career is obviously his background and marriage, etc).

To me, from these descriptions, he just seems to be an extremely ordinary person who literally did nothing special other than existing until age 99...

Is there something I don't get about this?

I am not a monarchist, and dont really want them abolished, but I would like them to lose some of the reverence they seem to inspire.

That's never going to happen. I imagine most people don't have any strong feelings about the monarchy either way but that I suppose suits them. Can't imagine the jig being up and finding myself in a position where I need to find an actual job having previously just glided through life being a 'Royal'.

Is Philip the 'forgeigner' you are referring to? In which I case I am pretty sure he would be a British citizen by marriage?

No, he naturalised before marriage. After serving in the British Royal Navy throughout the war. (You’re not actually answering me but the disregard for fact in this thread is grating.)

Honestly, who knows or cares. The point is, a non Brit has just as right to their opinion as a Brit, even (especiallygrin) if it makes royal groupies froth.

Again missing the point. Lots of us republicans liked Phil. Lots of naturalised Brits (like my gran) liked Phil. Lots of blokes liked Phil. What about him makes you think he only appealed to the Union Jack waving, face painting brigade?

Tutti I pretty much agree, the one thing that guaranteed position by birth does is take out the need to rise through talent / being exceptional etc

Op, I totally agree with you! The pompousness of royalists here is hilarious, we have to canonise Prince Philip like he was a saint on earth or something. Off with our heads if we dare to show any subversion to the simpering. I hate royalists more than the royals, they're the height of stupidity.

PP wasn't that great, he didn't do great things with his life and time. He was a rude and offensive over-privileged man. Everyone mentions the DoE award - so what, he had to be SEEN to be doing something, that's all. They all have to pretend to care, it's part of the job.

@adrianmolesmole

Op, I totally agree with you! The pompousness of royalists here is hilarious, we have to canonise Prince Philip like he was a saint on earth or something. Off with our heads if we dare to show any subversion to the simpering. I hate royalists more than the royals, they're the height of stupidity.

PP wasn't that great, he didn't do great things with his life and time. He was a rude and offensive over-privileged man. Everyone mentions the DoE award - so what, he had to be SEEN to be doing something, that's all. They all have to pretend to care, it's part of the job.

@adrianmolesmole as a Sue Townsend fan I'm guessing you would be voting for Jack Barker?

Kish - the faux interest of how things work and why a life of service commands respect in some people in your disingenuous first post.
I'd give it 0/10 was really rather trite.

Kish - the mask slipped a good while back and it's revealed the unpleasant sneer - but you could try to carry on pretending you're uninformed and trying to understand anything at all.

Totally agree OP.

He was nothing special.

All his achievements are due to his privilege.

@RickiTarr

I personally would have never used the phrase "allowed to come against any migrant, skilled or refugee, in this context. I think they have the same right to express their opinion as anyone else. Do you agree?*

All immigration laws are based around who is allowed to visit, work, live, settle somewhere.

You’re being incredibly over sensitive.

I’ve already said that everybody is allowed an opinion. The pushback you’re getting for yours isn’t because of nationality but because you’re not very well informed, to put it mildly.

I am just as well informed as you about the facts of PP's life, in the sense that nothing said on this thread was new to me (the incessant coverage of the last few days made sure of it). The only reason you assume I am not is because I said I am a foreigner (I presume).

I just see these fact in a different light from you and some other posters.

@tonystarksrighthand

He married the Queen of England.

Maybe educate yourself around the British Monarchy.

She is the queen of the uk

Maybe you could educate yourself @tonystarksrighthand

@Kishkashta. You are spot on.

I feel sad, but not specifically about the death of someone age 99. He had a long life, and more opportunities after his marriage to support various causes, etc than many other people. I feel sad, just because it feels like the end of an era.

Yes, I agree. He and Captain Tom were two of the last, and most high profile, of the war generation and it does feel like a changing of the guard.

The Queen is in her 90s, and stistically, will not have many years left.

It’s inevitable and it will be a huge change. As I said, it’s not a democratic way to run a country but you have to give her credit for acquitting herself very well in a role I very much doubt she would have chosen for herself.

OTOH, the item that was revealed a few weeks ago about HMQ intervening in legislation in the 1970s, in order to keep the details of (the size of?) her investments secret. THAT will explode in all their faces in the next few months or years. In fact the whole financial side of the royal family’s affairs is due for examination.

I am not a monarchist, and dont really want them abolished, but I would like them to lose some of the reverence they seem to inspire.

I would love to see the monarchy abolished but have resigned my self to being stuck with this system. So citizens need to make sure we follow who these people are, what they’re up to, the good and the bad, so as to hold them accountable.

You didn’t seem very knowledgeable of his naval career @Kishkashta just made assumptions. Nothing to do with you being a foreigner

@tuttifuckinfruity yes stick 'em all in a council house!

I’d be quite embarrassed to tell people I don’t understand Prince Philip’s significance and get what the fuss is about. You don’t need to agree with what he did or stood for but it’s sheer ignorance to not get it. Unless, of course, you are choosing to be goady about a man who has just died and if you are that sort of person, it’s best to pretend you are stupid instead.

I am just as well informed as you about the facts of PP's life, in the sense that nothing said on this thread was new to me (the incessant coverage of the last few days made sure of it). The only reason you assume I am not is because I said I am a foreigner (I presume).

So you looked at his military qualifications and achievements excerpted upthread from Wikipedia and thought that was "extremely ordinary". Blimey, you must be a serious overachiever. I'd love to know more about what you've accomplished.

I'm very firmly a republican, but the dismissiveness that some posters have shown to his war record is quite shocking to me.

@ColourfulElmerElephant

I’d be quite embarrassed to tell people I don’t understand Prince Philip’s significance and get what the fuss is about. You don’t need to agree with what he did or stood for but it’s sheer ignorance to not get it. Unless, of course, you are choosing to be goady about a man who has just died and if you are that sort of person, it’s best to pretend you are stupid instead.

I'd be embarrassed to be so pompous.

@RickiTarr
*RickiTarr
And the slightly rude older gent is not limited to a UC British aristocrat, trust me. My grandpa was wildly inappropriate until his death at 95 🤣🤣

Yeah they’re universal and I like them. *

Me too!

I am just as well informed as you about the facts of PP's life, in the sense that nothing said on this thread was new to me (the incessant coverage of the last few days made sure of it). The only reason you assume I am not is because I said I am a foreigner (I presume).

OP just the fact that you said the following shows you don’t know much about his life at all:-

”Also I don't know how anybody can take seriously the attempts to paint his life as full of hardships (had to give up his "Navy career" to support the Queen - the only reason he had his kind of career is obviously his background and marriage, etc).”

He had a real naval career, when he was just an unknown, impecunious toff like many others. He was commended for bravery and intelligence and was mentioned in dispatches. He was privileged in some ways but desperately disadvantaged in others. He then married into the pinnacle of British society, against a lot of palace opposition. He said some awful, bigoted things. He did some very worthwhile, valuable things (not the godawful DofE scheme). He was rude. He was kind.

That’s all you’re getting. It’s not our job to painstakingly type out biographies of PP on your thread. Go and read something. Even just his Wikipedia page.

You clearly haven’t even done that yet, so it’s bizarre to hubristically asset that you know as much as I do, or anyone else does.

@ssd better pompous and knowledgeable that stupid.

I'm very firmly a republican, but the dismissiveness that some posters have shown to his war record is quite shocking to me.

Ditto.

I’m British and I think the OP is right.

I thought this thread was going to be about the Vanuatu tribe. I think it would be nice if money was raised to give to them in Prince Philip's name. I'd definitely donate. I was touched by their story. They live in a lot of poverty.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-56713953

I lived abroad for several years. That country had many different customs that may seem odd to us. I observed them quietly and didn’t sneer. Some expats did but I felt I was a guest and it would have been rude.
My dh was born abroad but is a naturalised British citizen. He has ‘thrown his lot in with the U.K.’. He likes a great deal about this country but isn’t shy to criticise it. I think that’s ok as he doesn’t see himself as a foreigner unlike the Op.

@RickiTarr lots of great posts on this thread.

OP, I largely agree with your comments about 'typical behaviour of a certain age / class of British male' - I know a few like this!

However, he was mentioned in Dispatches so was genuinely a war hero.
He'd managed that despite his mother being committed when he was only 8, his father abandoning the family, being smuggled out of his country after a coup in a crate. I think that is pretty impressive.

The DofEd scheme is amazing.

But yes, I find the 'Grandfather to the Nation' stuff a bit much.
The Royal Family will miss him enormously.
He no doubt did long service to the Queen which enabled her to do her duty to her Country (which she seems genuine about).
But I think the BBC / fawning might get a bit much.
My son said today: 'if it was the Queen I could understand it'