Harry & Meghan, all welcome (aka positive thread, now renamed!)

[Roussette]

Here we are, let's inform, discuss, share and respect.

dragging her feet - sorry! Not trying to insinuate that AK was dragging PH by his feet

I'd have to agree that he's not coming across as having much general common sense either

I agree with your post. I do think there's a big difference from saying someone lacks common sense to saying they are dim, as has been said a lot on these threads about H. I think it's unfair to call him 'dim'.

Can I drag us all back by our feet?
The thread seemed to be having a nice discussion and suddenly we're back to name-calling, criticising staff and some secret cabal working at undermining. .. ironically sometimes that's what these threads feel like too

So Mummy195 - you think the fact that M & H didn't make an appointment to have the tiara when her hairdresser was over from Paris, is Angela Kelly's fault?

I think she is far more than a 'proverbial Office Manager' - goodness me, you'll be referring to her as 'that girl' next! She's certainly not employed to think ahead for M & H - I should think HM keeps her pretty busy.

Where is the information saying that she 'didn't avail herself for any dates'? My assumption would be that the tiara had been selected, and would be retrieved from the jewellery store a couple of days before the wedding. In the meantime, Meghan wanted (understandably) to practise, but the tiara was not available as no-one had requested it. But that is only supposition, like you assuming that AK had refused to make an appointment.

@myrtleWilson

He may have had a reason to think AK was dragging his feet mummy, whether he had a legitimate reason to belief so is another matter entirely.

Well, maybe he does have a legitimate reason, why would he just think that out of the blue.

If that is the case, it sure sounds like AK is the proverbial Office Manager who rules the stationery cupboard with an iron fist. lol.

You are keen to denigrate Angela Kelly, aren't you Mummy195.

If you had read her books, you would have discovered that she runs the Queen's wardrobe well in advance, and to a planned schedule. It's not a case of getting up and each day and wondering what to wear! The Queen's schedule is planned in advance, with outfits planned, made or cleaned and refreshed if need be, hats chosen and jewellery selected. She clearly has a comprehensive catalogue of all the Queen's jewels, as she has said that she presents her with some suggestions that seem appropriate to the outfit/the event/the people attending, and the Queen then lets her know which options she wants to go with., or tells her her own preference Clearly, for security reasons she doesn't say where the jewels are kept or how it works, but I am imagining she makes a weekly trip to the vault, takes and signs out everything she needs, then takes them to a local safe where she can bring them to the Queen each day as she is getting ready for each engagement. She brings them to her in the same baskets that the Queen's grandmother, Queen Mary used.

For obvious reasons it is not the same as someone needing an emergency stapler. Also, I would have thought for obvious reasons, there is a clear process that would need to be followed to ensure that the location of each piece of jewellery, and who has assumed custody of it, are known at any point in time.

So, Meghan and Harry were at Buckingham Palace. It sounds like Angela Kelly was not. Who knows where the tiara was? If we're speculating, as you are doing, it could even have been at the Queen's personal jeweller in Tonbridge Wells to be cleaned before the wedding, as it hadn't been worn for decades.

Oh drop it. Since when is an Office Manager a derogatory term or label.

Saying to staff members that the person who is joining the family 'has baggage' is an acceptable thing?? Calling her a showgirl is acceptable??

As I've just said, we don't know do we?
Maybe Angela Kelly was kicking her heels a bit, maybe she didn't answer an email or a phone, maybe she was a bit unavailable and Harry got fed up of waiting to hear of a tiara appointment.
Or maybe, he didn't know he had to arrange this 3 days in advance, maybe he made assumptions he shouldn't have, maybe he should have asked the Queen or one of his or her advisers what was the proper course of action.
We Do Not Know.

To be fair @Roussette that could be the standing title for all future threads!

I would be surprised if we ever find out the truth about what happened with AK unless HMQ permits it. As said further up the thread, she is known for having HMQ’s utmost confidence in discretion. Perhaps that in itself makes her an easy target for the book but more likely some alight was perceived to have happened. Ultimately though AK works for HMQ and considering her busy diary, won’t just be able to drop everything to travel elsewhere even if access to the tiara is as simple as her just needing to be there. It’s quite possible the jewels are kept elsewhere and it needs to be arranged with appropriate security for them to be at a certain location for use. That could prevent access to a specific one whilst a hairdresser was over being able to coincide. I do agree that I feel it’s likely that embarrassment caused the issue rather than anything else.

@Mummy195

Oh drop it. Since when is an Office Manager a derogatory term or label.

Saying to staff members that the person who is joining the family 'has baggage' is an acceptable thing?? Calling her a showgirl is acceptable??

In the way that you used it Mummy, it was certainly intended to be derogatory.

If that is the case, it sure sounds like AK is the proverbial Office Manager who rules the stationery cupboard with an iron fist. lol.

myrtle You are soooo right!

For obvious reasons it is not the same as someone needing an emergency stapler

🤣🤣

Well, maybe he does have a legitimate reason, why would he just think that out of the blue.

Quite possibly because he has no idea how the ordering and wearing of HMQ’s jewellery works. I’m going to speculate here that Harry has never had a need before to borrow one of HMQ’s tiaras and it’s reasonable to assume he therefore doesn’t understand the procedures and processes. Quite possibly he saw insistent on abiding by the rules in place as obstruction. If I need a new laptop from work, there will be one in the IT department and people might be in who can access it but I will need to have completed the paperwork and had it signed off before I can waltz off out of the building with it. In so many way the RF is a business first and foremost.

Isn't part of her job to hand out the tiaras? Then if there are long procedures, she should inform the person needing it in advance, and have it cleaned in advance, after all she would know that a hair dressing rehearsal is due.

Saying to staff members that the person who is joining the family 'has baggage' is an acceptable thing?? Calling her a showgirl is acceptable?

Dealing with the latter first, I am sure that any number of people, in the Palace, in the media and in the country/world have called Meghan a showgirl, as there was a well known 1957 movie starring Laurence Olivier and Marilyn Monroe called "The Prince and the Showgirl". Hence the term has been applied to any royal prince in a relationship with someone connected with show business - to Grace Kelly and Prince Ranier, and to Prince Andrew and Koo Stark as two past examples. So no, I don't think it's unacceptable for the most part. I think it's an attempt to make a playful reference, generally.

As for the second, Meghan was divorced and estranged from all bit one member of her family. That counts as baggage in the way that term is used in normal conversation, surely?

This is getting ridiculous now.

@Mummy195

Isn't part of her job to hand out the tiaras? Then if there are long procedures, she should inform the person needing it in advance, and have it cleaned in advance, after all she would know that a hair dressing rehearsal is due.

Telepathy is an essential skill for HM's dresser.

There was something on twitter in the last couple of days that William and AK teamed up to stop MM wearing any of the Queen's jewels. Two things about this:

• not sure I can see William scheming with Angela
• I have this image of a room full of jewels and all the Royal ladies getting to wear them apart from Meghan - if that was the case, well I would have been super pissed off if I were her

Isn't part of her job to hand out the tiaras? Then if there are long procedures, she should inform the person needing it in advance, and have it cleaned in advance, after all she would know that a hair dressing rehearsal is due.

We don’t know. Likewise we don’t know if perhaps she explained the process or sent through paperwork explaining how it worked and this was ignored or assumed it could be overridden. We don’t know.

We also don’t know she would know that a hair dressing rehearsal is due. Why should she for someone who isn’t effectively in her part of the office that she doesn’t work for? We could assume she would expect there to be one but again, we don’t know and I can’t imagine it would be her job to chase anyone up to find out if there would be.

Surely Harry and Meghan’s own palace staff would be responsible for organising movement of said tiara- not Angela Kelley’s job to run around after them. It sounds as though Meghan just wanted everyone to run around after her because she had organised the hair stylist to come but hasn’t coordinated her office and the queens office

@Serenster

Saying to staff members that the person who is joining the family 'has baggage' is an acceptable thing?? Calling her a showgirl is acceptable?

Dealing with the latter first, I am sure that any number of people, in the Palace, in the media and in the country/world have called Meghan a showgirl, as there was a well known 1957 movie starring Laurence Olivier and Marilyn Monroe called "The Prince and the Showgirl". Hence the term has been applied to any royal prince in a relationship with someone connected with show business - to Grace Kelly and Prince Ranier, and to Prince Andrew and Koo Stark as two past examples. So no, I don't think it's unacceptable for the most part. I think it's an attempt to make a playful reference, generally.

As for the second, Meghan was divorced and estranged from all bit one member of her family. That counts as baggage in the way that term is used in normal conversation, surely?

So you all have a problem with office manager on this thread, but showgirl at the palace is a playful reference.

Meghan was not estranged to her father before the wedding. I do not see how divorce will be baggage, since Anne, PA, PC were all divorced with children.

The Queen doesn't do lots of sharing of jewelry. She is more similar to the Danes than the Dutch or the Swedes in that respect.

I would definitely describe Charles as having baggage! I don't think it is massively negative, just a reflection of someone of a certain age who has a bit of life experience.

Most of my knowledge of Charles is based on The Crown but I would say he has quite a lot of issues.

@wufti

Surely Harry and Meghan’s own palace staff would be responsible for organising movement of said tiara- not Angela Kelley’s job to run around after them. It sounds as though Meghan just wanted everyone to run around after her because she had organised the hair stylist to come but hasn’t coordinated her office and the queens office

Maybe AK was giving SR staff the runaround.