Harry & Meghan, all welcome (aka positive thread, now renamed!)

[Roussette]

Here we are, let's inform, discuss, share and respect.

Saville Row too surely, then? I think Wiliam and Harry follow their father's lead in having tailored suits. Prince Charles is an excellent advertisement for British tailoring.

Maybe it was dream of hers to have a Givenchy wedding dress. Why can't she have the designers she wants on her wedding day?

For a lot of nationalities, including I'd say Americans, the French are the absolute pinnacle of style and quality when it comes to clothes and grooming (and wine). You can afford a French designer, a French hairdresser, you've really made it!

The English and the French have long had a degree of animosity between them. It's more jokey than actual war these days but I think it's still there. So the English don't rate French stuff as vastly superior to English stuff. But I think we are alone in this.

The English can't understand why Meghan would want French designers rather than English. But the rest of the world can understand.

Well mens fashion doesnt have the same impact, it is less likely a man will flip through magazines with photos of the royals say I HAVE TO HAVE THAT SUIT!

Yeah it's a bit sexist but ultimately the female royals wield a lot more trend setting power than the males, and should want to promote British industry shouldn't they?

ultimately the female royals wield a lot more trend setting power than the males, and should want to promote British industry shouldn't they?

I do agree with you but I also think that a wedding day really should be a time when you can have who and what you want (within reason - and not an intended dig at tiaragate) at the best of times, let alone when so many people will be watching.

Going back to the earlier wedding dress talk, I wouldn’t have wanted any of the royal wedding dresses for myself but have loved all of the evening ones I’ve seen and I was also a fan of Pippa’s outfit at W&K’s wedding.

Yes and if she had purchased it with her own money fine, but the public spent 300 grand to promote a French fashion house. Definitely getting off on the wrong foot there..

Harry doesn't strike me as someone who has any interest in his own clothes or dressing a particular way. Men historically have been able to get away with this, especially if they're high status. Though it tends to change when trouble comes along: Dominic Cummings and Mark Zuckerberg are both casual verging on scruffy dressers, but Zuckerberg wore a suit for his testimony to Congress and Cummings at least put a shirt on for his Rose
Garden eyesight broadcast to the nation. Harry might need to consider doing the same now that he has stepped away from the default cachet of being royal and needs to establish his own credibility on the celeb / public speaker / philanthropy circuit.

They weren't promoting a french fashion house as such. It was a british designer after all. Yes she worked at Givenchy but up till then she had worked with British companies.

Personally I think wearing the dress of your choice on your wedding day is very normal !

I can’t do links but there’s an article in the DM which says Kate is devastated by some of the details in Finding Freedom

@Serenster

Saville Row too surely, then? I think Wiliam and Harry follow their father's lead in having tailored suits. Prince Charles is an excellent advertisement for British tailoring.

You should skip over to the Royal Style & Beauty threads if not already there.

There has been lots of discussion about William’s fleeces and Harry possibly only have one polo shirt. Unfortunately I don’t think either son inherited either parents fashion sense. Military uniform is different as it has to be tailored to the wearer.

I really cannot get my head round the idea that H&M had no input or were not aware of the disclosures in the book
They’ve kept very quiet about it all

@Roussette

They weren't promoting a french fashion house as such. It was a british designer after all. Yes she worked at Givenchy but up till then she had worked with British companies.

Personally I think wearing the dress of your choice on your wedding day is very normal !

I suppose the big question is 'who paid for it'? If she did, it's up to her who she selected, although ignoring the fact that her new role was in supporting Britain seems a very early mis-step.

But yes, very normal to wear the dress of your choice on your wedding day, as long as you can afford it.

I can’t do links but there’s an article in the DM which says Kate is devastated by some of the details in Finding Freedom

From what I gather the only two people shown in a bad light in the book are H&M themselves. The worst thing it seems to say about Kate is that whilst working, looking after two young children and pregnant (did she have HG with Louis?) that she wasn’t as friendly and welcoming as Meghan felt she should have been.

Yes, I find it difficult to think that had Meghan been planning her wedding to A.N.Other she'd have wanted the flowers of the Commonwealth embroidered on her veil. It was a nod to the role she was adopting. Choosing a British design house would have gone down really well. Which comes back to a theme of her time as a senior royal - the role she took on was one in which she was often going to have to compromise on doing what she wanted for the sake of the bigger picture.

(When I worked for a public body we used to say our touchstone was the Daily Mail test - "how would you feel if this behaviour was reported on in the Daily Mail?" Which amuses me now, because can you imagine the reaction that would have gotten if you'd suggested it to Meghan Markle, given the state of relations between the two )

Although Meghan said the exact opposite at the engagement interview.

@ajandjjmum

Although Meghan said the exact opposite at the engagement interview.

Sorry - referring to last sentence of Sunbathing's thread.

The DM article says "devastated" in the headline & "deeply affected" later!

Could be that she's pissed off about someone prattling to the media about the RF as much as anything.

I agree though, that there's nothing that paints her in a bad light, only the two who are the subject of it!

@ajandjjmum

Although Meghan said the exact opposite at the engagement interview.

Ah, thanks, I didn’t watch their interview talk. So I suppose the engagement interview is something that surely even those who defend H&M the most must agree is their own words? In that case, since it contradicts a book that they say they didn’t provide interviews for, I’m going to assume Finding Freedom is wrong and Kate was lovely and welcoming to them.

From the Royal Family website:

continuing to honour their duty to The Queen, the Commonwealth, and their patronages.

Sounds so much better than collaborating although I don’t think they have been doing much honouring the Queen recently!

I strongly suspect she was advised to choose a British brand. The dress was the main visual anticipation of the day and a lot of thought would have gone into it.

Yes the designer was British but the fashion house wasn't. I think it was churlish given the simplicity of the dress and the amount the public spent on it.

I don't think she has ever felt any real desire to assimilate into Britain if I'm honest, I dont think she cared what the public thought.

Even though Kate doesn't come across badly about the lift to the shops, I wouldn't be surprised if she was still hurt/pissed off because the intention is to make her look bad and unwelcoming. Along with the digs at William. Whether that be Omid, Caroline, the sources or MM herself that's behind it.

@TofinoSurf

Even though Kate doesn't come across badly about the lift to the shops, I wouldn't be surprised if she was still hurt/pissed off because the intention is to make her look bad and unwelcoming. Along with the digs at William. Whether that be Omid, Caroline, the sources or MM herself that's behind it.

Yes, the intent to cause upset and distress is there. It's petty and vengeful.

Does anyone know how serialisation in papers works? Do the papers get to choose what they publish or are they told by the authors/publishers? I’m assuming most papers want to publish the chapters that are most likely to generate revenue but at the same time, the authors will want to hold things back so people still buy the book.

I suspect that for all her status, Kate is not full of herself, and would be genuinely upset to be perceived as unpleasant or unwelcoming. She has many long-standing relationships with women, as well as her Mum and sister, and knows how to treat people.

Equally I'm not sure that she would be gushy and all over someone, which could be misconstrued as 'unwelcoming' by someone with different (unrealistic) expectations.

I just think it was a cultural difference. Brits are generally a little aloof compared to the Americans. If Meghan had spent a bit more time here before the wedding I think she wouldve learned that & not taken things the wrong way. She expected everyone to bend to her, not the other way round.