Is this genuinely a right way to train a dog?

[sarral]

just need to start off saying... I've never had any experience with dogs at all, ever!

so after years of DH wanting a dog(he grew up with dogs) and me being not being massively keen (ie: kids, life admin, home responsibilities, work ect ect to deal with, just always thought a dog would be added pressure) I finally agreed a few years after Dc's had grown up and left home.

so we've had our little cockerpoo for 2 and half years now and tbh I absolutely love him to absolute bits, but it's not the picnic DH convinced me it would be 🤦

He can't be left alone, not even for 5 mins, follows us (me mainly) EVERYWHERE I can't even nip the loo without him crying outside bathroom door. Walks are a nightmare, he's not too bad with DH but when I go, which isn't often now because I just can't deal with his behaviour (the picture of us getting out more, leisurely walking him, having lots of exercise and enjoying leisure time with him are non existent) he goes mad if anyone comes near me, human or other dogs, barks his head off, even if someone just says "hello" to me he kicks off. So we decided to get a trainer in. Now this trainer I found local to us has 5 star reviews, with over 200+ reviews. So went with her as seemed to be the best reviewed trainer for Miles.

So had her out a few times now and it's just not sitting right with me what we've been told to do but as I've never had a dog I'm not sure if I'm being naive or just totally un-informed.
We've been taught to spray water at any barking,moaning, anytime someone knocks at door or visits (this is a massive trigger for him) on walks we've been told and taught how to use a training lead (from my limited knowledge I think this might be called a choke lead??? I'm not 100% sure??)

it just doesn't all sit right me, he's scared of the water spray, It works but it stops working when we stop using it, which is often cos I just don't like making him scared, the training lead worked for DH, but not me, but then I'm too afraid to pull it incase it chokes him😭😭 DH wants to get trainer out again as we literally have no life in we can't leave him or go anywhere without him, I'm reluctant as I'm not sure this is best way to train him but as Ive said I've no experience so don't know if this is the way we should be training. Trainer is fully qualified for 10+ years so not sure if it's just me or not? Any advice would be appreciated.
thank you.

I think you're totally right.
There's a minefield of conflicting information out there and some really bad advice online and tv. I have worked with The Mutty Professor in Bristol (positive reinforcement and vet recommended) who also provides a lot of useful advice on Facebook for free and explains the science..

ahhh thank you, have learnt further up it's a slip lead 🤷🤷
is there a difference between choke and slip lead? sorry to sound dense, just want to do best for our dog

for a small dog i think a harness is the best

As others have said, your trainer is an idiot who should be ditched immediately. A lot of people still believe in the pack theory where dogs have to be dominated to show them who's alpha dog. That's probably why the trainer has positive reviews. Look instead for a trainer (or better still, a behaviourist) who uses positive reinforcement (force free) and ditch tge slip lead etc. We use a Perfect Fit harness and attach his led to the front D ring, which means that we can gently pull him back on himself if he starts to forget he should be walking to heel.

We have a cockapoo and they do take a lot of input - I recognise everything you've posted about yours. Check put scent work classes too if you have any locally, they absolutely love sniffing stuff!

Not much difference really. A choke lead has metal chain rather than the softer rope but they operate the same way. The metal has a tendency to pinch the skin and therefore hurt more on a ‘jab’
But the slow choke effect of the rope is just as bad imo

No no no no
this is not an ethical way to train a dog. Using fear to control a dog, especially an anxious dog, may temporarily ‘fix’ one problem but is a) unethical and horrid for the dog and b) certain to cause you further problems

Go to the ABTC website here: https://abtc.org.uk/ to find properly qualified, ethical trainers near you.

Dogs Trust also have a free advice line which is VERY good

Anyone using aversives (slip leads, sprays, shouting, smacking) to ‘train’ a dog is nothing but cruel and uneducated. The science clearly tells us that this is not the way to create lasting change and will often cause suppressed behaviour and thus more issues

Trust your gut, this trainer isn’t right

he doesn't seem stressed, day to day. I've taught him to sit, paw, wait for treats, he knows "no" he knows "wait" ect... he's actually quite calm day to day just can get bad with knocks on the door or when anyone comes near me. he can see another dog and look away or sometimes give them a sniff all calm and then other days the sight of another dog just sets him right off, He's socialised and has a group of other dogs (albeit family/friends dogs) that he doesn't bat an eyelid with, one day he's fine with strangers, next day he isn't, but is very playful and can be calm going off on his own on his own term for ages but if it's on our terms ie, need to pop out for half hour it's a different story

Use a Halti collar or a Halti no pull harness. (IMO the harness is better).

The trainer is a twat. Positive re-enforcement and ignoring negative behaviour is the way to go. Obviously it’s a lot more complicated than that, but you have to go back to basics.

As for when you’re out, look into puppy socialisation techniques. You’ll have to start again from the start but if you put the work in, you’ll get the rewards.

As @FlyingUnicornWings says.

use: https://companyofanimals.com/uk/brand-product/halti-dog-headcollar/

stopped our retriever from pulling.

Sorry I’m not trying to pick a fight with you but as you say, you have limited knowledge and I do this for a living
he is showing classic signs of separation anxiety and resource guarding.
Both have their cause absolutely rooted in anxiety. Confident, unstressed dogs whose needs are being fully met (mental as well as physical) simply do not exhibit these behaviours

slip
leads can choke also if not used properly

they are for well trained dogs just to act as a tether when they are working frequently - I use one to get dogs from car to house but I know they won’t pull so I’m ok

have tried all this religiously for 2 years, I'm thinking we aren't doing it correctly 😭😭

No, as I say, those things won’t work with a behaviour case unless the root cause of the problem is also addressed

i sometimes kept a ball in my pocket to keep my dog's attention.

we were told harness was wrong way to go, we'd been using a harness, we have several, will try them again 🙏

You have to be very accurate and immediate when using these - click immediately and reward within seconds

dont move on to next step without having to the first bit 100 percent perfect or you will have to go back - when I say perfect being done every time you want the behaviour

why don’t you go to a class? You will get the benefit of building the relationship and seeing it work

what solution do you suggest?

just trying to take in what you've said, thank you but my instant thought is this trainer is a qualified behaviourist 🤷🤷😭😭

There is no one size fits all with equipment. You really need to see someone reputable in person to get in the right track

That’s what I was trying to say upthread. It’s an absolute bloody minefield
I hope you find someone soon

Harnesses give you less control when training

collar is better

no I appreciate your advice, thank you🙏
we were told it's not anxiety or seperation anxiety as he doesn't wee/poo or chew anything when left but I said to trainer.. but he cries /howls surely that's seperation anxiety, I was told no!! I still think it is!!

Sorry but along with everything else that trainer told you…….that’s bullshit
SOME dogs toilet or chew. Not all, by any means

Edit: it is a possibility that it’s a learned attention seeking behaviour of course. FOMO if you like. But the less likely option given his other behaviours

can you give any advice on what we should be doing to ensure his needs and mental stimulation can be met please? thankyou

That's definitely not true - I had a rescue/rehome with separation issues, no toileting or destruction but he'd pant, howl, yip and then distress barking.