Beyond Adolescence - a thread to chat about grown up dogs, cake and anything else, excluding coffee.

[SpanielsGalore]

Not going to tag everyone as I don't know who wants to join. Welcome everyone. 😁

I have had two roofers here this morning. After the initial barking at heads appearing over the ridge, the dogs have been so good. They've sat in the garden and watched them working. Greeted them every time they came into the garden and didn't once try to bolt out of the gate. I heard one of the men telling them to 'stay' as he struggled through the gate with a bucket full of water, and then telling them they were 'good dogs'.
They've just finished and as they were leaving one commented on how calm my dogs are and not like 'normal spaniels'. See. Not all working cockers are 'high on crack' and 'manic'. 😇😇😇

Beautiful weather here today. 🌞 I unexpectedly got my car back yesterday. 🥳
Off to the woods to walk the adolescent nutter until she collapses in a heap. 😂

God I just don't know any more with calcium @SpanielsGalore Some of the guidelines say 1 to 1.5 for a giant of 18 months, so the one I ordered last night should be okay at 1.4.

Calibra Junior large breed is 1.3
Essential Estate is 1.8
Jollyes Lifestage is 2.0
Millies Wolfheart countryside is 2.3 😨

If I mixed Calibra with Essential would they balance each other out at around 1.5/1.6 or does it not work like that?

Aaagh! It's driving me nuts.
We just used to chuck James Wellbeloved at our original three.
Am I overthinking this?

@CoubousAndTourmaIet I have no idea either. We're probably both over thinking it. I yearn for the days when you went to the shop and bought the one with the most appealing label.
N is on JWB. She's doing really well on it. Mind you. She was previously fed on Asda's own brand, so practically everything is a step up from that.

Exactly that. Nothing is simple nowadays, is it @SpanielsGalore ?
It's like I said the other day to @VanGoSunflowers , I think it was easier before - there's just information overload now, and it's quite exhausting 😫

Good Morning 😃 It was quiet here yesterday...

A pinch and a punch for the first of the month. White rabbits!
Speaking of rabbits, I'm still down the hole.

We've concluded that Brie is better on Large Breed formulas. Which is another reason Millies Wolfheart doesn't suit her. Not only do they not have a puppy formula, but they don't have a large or giant breed option either. Given that they offer no less than 22 different kibbles, that seems poor. Really it's formulated for sporting breeds, so gundog, hound and terrier. At least she's only on her second batch but we won't be reordering.

So I'm dropping both the MW and the Jollyes Lifestage, but sticking with Essential Estate and Calibra Junior Large Breed. Even though the Calibra isn't the best food out there, it suits her, and it balances out the slightly higher protein and calcium in the Essential. The new kibble (Canine Choice) is on its way, so we'll see how that is as the third option. I'll get the thoughts of our trio of vets at the weekend.

How is P getting on @SpanielsGalore ?

We've never changed any more gradually than doing half and half for one meal and that's normally more about finishing off the end of a bag than anything else.

I have absolutely no scientific evidence to support it, but I'm sure feeding a variety of food means they're more able to cope with changes in diet. It's why i always give leftovers where appropriate.

I had an advert come up today for a doggy advent calendar - £34!!! Have told the girls I don't love them enough 😂

@tizwozliz £34! I hope it has a toy behind every door and not a measly piece of chocolate.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet A slap and a kick for being so quick.
(I don't know the white rabbits thing. Although a distant bell is telling me you say it three times for luck.)

P is up and down. Monday night she was very unsettled and clingy. Constantly up and down all evening disturbing the other two. Yesterday she was much better. The food, that I remortgaged my house for, is being delivered today, so hopefully that will help.
Note: next day shipping does not mean next day delivery. It means it leaves the warehouse the next day and sits around in a parcel delivery depot for another three days.

Oh gosh, I hope that new food is good @SpanielsGalore and, more importantly, that P likes it. Delivery must be a nightmare for you - it's bad enough here and we're not that far from Manchester. Our new food is coming via Evri, it's already day 3 and I'm not holding my breath.

I don't think Briellezeebub will be getting an advent calendar.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet i hadn’t even noticed it chased cats! I must say you made your point far more eloquently than I did on that thread.

I do wish people wouldn’t minimise their dogs behaviours as ‘instinct’ or ‘learnt.’ I remember walking Satan once when DMum first got her, and she snapped at a collie and I was absolutely mortified - even though she was muzzled and on the lead and the collie owner kept saying ‘it’s fine, it does him good to learn not to charge up to little dogs.’

She was so terrified of everything and everyone, yet DMum managed - through years of hard work - to manage her effectively. She almost always walks with my dogs (because it gives her confidence), she’s walked at particular times to avoid her triggers, she’s fed first and separately to handle her resource guarding, she’s never left alone to handle her severe SA etc.

I do worry that lots of people just give up on their dogs, or don’t even bother and minimise it or, even worse, enlist dodgy trainers who do more harm than good!

There's different ways of looking at that one @LandSharksAnonymous neither owner was blameless. But if you know your dog has a strong prey drive, particularly towards cats, it makes no sense to let it off in the dark. If nothing else, unless you're walking somewhere very remote, you are likely to be putting the dog in danger of getting onto a road.

Instinct and the nature v nurture is a bit of a bug bear of mine though, and is why I'm averse to crossing large breeds (contentious issue, I know). Contrary to popular misconception, a GSD is a herding dog, and we all know herding is linked to prey drive so a GSD will chase. If you know this, no matter how well trained your dog is, responsible ownership means managing those risk factors sensibly. Once that big dog was overstimulated by the chase, it was pretty inevitable that it would react to a small dog as being prey and it could have ended badly.

@SpanielsGalore did the food arrive yesterday in the end? And @CoubousAndTourmaIet how about yours?
Hope everyone’s pups, adolescents and fully grown dogs are all good today! Mine is currently curled up on my feet. Clearly doesn’t want me to start work! Luckily I have a morning of virtual meetings so I will do them from the sofa 😂

@LandSharksAnonymous @CoubousAndTourmaIet I had a nose at that thread after seeing your posts here. I find reading those posts quite informative when it comes to dog etiquette- even though I have nothing of value to add!

P's food arrived yesterday afternoon, so we are two meals in now. It's shaped like the little marshmallows you get in hot chocolate. Not that it makes any difference to P. 😂
She eats whatever is put infront of her.
I took her out for a half hour run last night. She's been resting her leg for two weeks and there's no sign of improvement. And we can't investigate further whilst she has pancreatitis. So I thought sod it. She was very happy to have a change of scenery.
The insurance has asked for more info (complete vet history) in order to process her claim. I'm sure it's normal practice, but I'm used to putting in claims for her leg which get paid straight away. But I am a bit worried they won't pay out. At 9 weeks old, P ate a Nerf gun bullet and had an injection to make her vomit. So when I insured her, they excluded everything to do with her digestive tract from entry to exit. I don't know if that includes the pancreas or not.

@SpanielsGalore excuse my ignorance but how long do you think it will be before you know if it’s the right food or not? Are you on poo watch again? Are we ever off poo watch? 😂

I am glad she enjoyed her run. I really hope these issues resolve for you both very soon and I really hope your insurance pays out! Do I recall that you’re with Pet Plan? Again, may be my ignorance but how can they get away with saying an ingested Nerf gun bullet can be connected to any other digestive tract issues?

She snapped at a collie and I was absolutely mortified - even though she was muzzled and on the lead and the collie owner kept saying 'it's fine, it does him good to learn not to charge up to little dogs.'

@LandSharksAnonymous People like that piss me off. You shouldn't have been mortified. You should have been angry. He is totally in the wrong for allowing his dog to run up to an on lead dog, regardless of muzzle.
It's not Satan's job to teach his rude dog some manners. She was a frightened little dog. All the encounter taught her was that other dogs are scary. And that she needs to react to scare them away.

Sorry. I'll get off my soap box now. Having walked a reactive dog for years, I got fed up of people telling me it was my dog's job to teach their dog maners, with no regard for the stress, fear and anxiety it caused my dog. It would take him days to recover from an incident like that.

@SpanielsGalore - Oh completely, he was no innocent. But I was mortified as I hadn't really realised Satan would react like that! That being said, as you say, it's not her job to teach other dogs manners (although she has done wonderfully with Twatdog and made him into a rather well adjusted member of society). I am still so amazed by how far she has come though - from a dog that wouldn't let other dogs, or men, near her she now curls up in the same dog bed as my dogs and sleeps on my dad's chest at night.

How is P doing today after her lovely run last night? I bet she couldn't believe her luck! 😁I'll keep my fingers crossed that the insurance doesn't exclude the pancreatitis...feels like it would be a touch unreasonable?!

@VanGoSunflowers Insurance companies exclude everything if they can! 😁Twatdog had a skin allergy ages ago, and now anything to do with his skin is excluded for two years...Thankfully, we're a year into it, but still.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet Agreed! Inevitable. As we so often say, you really cannot stop years of instincts. There is a reason why spaniels dart in and out of bushes and there is a reason why retrievers bring things back to their humans...

I have no idea to any of it I'm afraid. 🙈 😂
I am always on poo watch. But I don't photograph it anymore, so I am improving. (My sprocker had IBD and it was useful to show the vet his more unusual offerings.)
This food is purely for the 6% fat content. Once this bag is gone, I'll take her off it. It's too expensive for long-term use.
The Country Kibble is only 11% fat, which is lower than a lot of the others so I might put her back on that. She was doing really well on it and had finely gained some weight.
It doesn't help that no one is really sure what causes it. The vet said something about the pancreas reacting to being squashed by other organs, so could it be season related? My biology knowledge is shockingly poor.
Yes I am with PetPlan. I didn't insure P straight away as she came with the four weeks KC insurance. In that time, she needed to be made to vomit and had her anal glands emptied. So when I switched to PetPlan, they stuck the exclusions on. God knows how they justify it. I can understand not covering ingesting foreign objects, but anything to do with the digestive tract seems harsh.
I spoke to someone once and they said after two years I could apply to have the exclusions lifted. But then she ate a rubber glove she found on the beach. 🙄

You're never off poo watch @VanGoSunflowers , sorry but it's a permanent part of your life now😆

I hope the food suits P @SpanielsGalore Regarding the insurance, I hope it's not a get out clause for them but I would have thought the pancreas is a different thing from stomach or bowel. It may depend what your vet says about a likely cause. Would low fat be classified as a prescription diet? I wonder if that comes into the equation anywhere.

@LandSharksAnonymous That thread has now turned into big dog bashing by that same poster who crops up on every thread and I've just let my snark out a bit which may not be a good thing...😬

@LandSharksAnonymous Sorry. I shouldn't have told you how you should feel. That is probably very unPC of me. I would probably have given him a mouthful and then cried for days.
It's so hard when you have a dog like mine and Satan. I don't think people who have always had 'normal' dogs appreciate it. I also think they teach you a lot more though. I only know as much as I do about dogs (their behaviour and body language) because I had a dog with issues and needed to help him.
It's amazing how far Satan has come. 💖 She was lucky to find a family who were so committed to helping her.
And I'm glad she sorted TD out for you. 😂 I think teaching manners within a family 'pack' is different. I'm forever moaning that P let K get away with murder and left me with an unruly monster.

@CoubousAndTourmaIet I read that ridiculous post. I am frightened of GS. Therefore no one should own one. I was going to call her out on it, but I got accused of attacking her last time.
I'm keeping a tally of how many dogs her family owned. We're on 33+ now.

The only prescription food covered by PetPlan is for kidney stones or crystals. My IBD dog needed prescription food, but they wouldn't cover it. Seemed a bit unfair to me.

They've literally excluded everything from mouth to abuse for P. A Google diagram shows the pancreas as being to the side, so I am hoping it is covered even though it's involved in the digestive process.

FFS That should say 'mouth to anus'. My tablet is horrified by the word and changed it to abuse. Posted in a hurry as had to dash out.

@SpanielsGalore Well I must say that it should have read 'anus' makes for a far more logical read.I was thinking to myself 'why on earth would they have excluded abuse...'

And no offence taken so absolutely no apology needed! I knew what you meant 😁And tbf if it had been my dogs, I would have reacted quite poorly - but with Satan I've always been a bit less inclined to be feisty. I am so glad DMum took on Satan because, like you say, I've learnt so much about dogs from her...but equally I don't think she could do it again.

We've spoken before about being on edge the whole time and even with Satan being 99.9% better now, DMum does still worry. But maybe we should send Satan up to Scotland to sort out K - she'd probably only need 24 hours. She's very good at teaching manners 😂

@CoubousAndTourmaIet that thread is just bonkers now. OP should have muzzled her dog - but not because of the breed or it's size. It should be muzzled as it has a prey-drive and chases cats. But people getting hysterical detract from the real issue - that both owners have issues with their dogs that need addressing/managing.

Speaking of 'issues' that need 'managing' apparently Eris is back up to her usual tricks with Twatdog. Quite glad I'm in the office today and don't need to deal with. Not sure who is seedier - the nasty little piranha, or her big brother. 😩

@LandSharksAnonymous I am totally with your Mum there. I loved my dog. We pretty much had to change our lives to fit around him. But there is absolutely no way I would want to go through it again.
We had about 12 years of stressful, always on edge walks. Then he got dementia and forgot he was afraid of things. We finally had the dog we'd wanted, but it brought a whole new level of sadness, as it showed how much of him had gone. IYSWIM

Poor K. I don't think she'd cope with being told off. 😂 She's really not as bad as I make her out to be anymore. She is much more respectful of dogs we meet out on walks now. It's only P she terrorises. Most times they play well together, but sometimes she gets a bit OTT and bites P's ears. Then she gets put the other side of the stair gate for a few minutes to calm down.

Ewwww Eris. 🤢 Hopefully she'll grow out of that one. Does she still try to feed off Pen?

I've had a good laugh at that other thread. I'm surprised she hasn't accused people of attacking her yet.

I'm not sure it needed to be muzzled @LandSharksAnonymous , just kept on a lead for an after dark walk. The gist of it seemed to be that because it was dark she didn't see the cat and the small dog owner didn't see her dog. If both dogs were on a lead there wouldn't have been any issue.

In some ways, the people who just hate all dogs are easier to understand than the ones who claim to love dogs but hate selected breeds.

In any case that thread has been zapped...

That is very odd.
So maybe she did accuse people of attacking her...🤔

I assumed the OP asked for it to be deleted, since it had gone off topic.