The hate towards doddle owners.

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The hate against doodles,
I keep reading about Doodle owners, in a negative way on here, I'm wondering why they is so much negativity around them.

For context I have a poodle cross, who gets treated like a dog, we have used trainers, she goes hiking with us, is groomed regular. Doesn't sleep in our bed, can be left alone for a few hours no problem, and not a fussy eater, just eats dry food.
I didn't pay 1000s for her, paid the same as a cross breed. She has no health issues etc.

Yes she does have traits of both breeds, she can be hyper, and prone to barking at times. But we are aware of her breeds, both working dogs.

So am I unusual in that my doddle is treated like a dog. Or is there an unfair reputation towards doodles and owners?

I couldn't have said it better. I recently adopted a rescue cockerpoo. Originally I went to look at another dog which turned out not to be suitable. Anyway, they brought out T , she got on with my other dog and I brought her home. She was in a terrible state. Her coat was so matted she had to be shaved 😩. She has very clearly had many pregnancies, her teeth are rotten, she is now limping badly on her front leg. It's going to cost a lot of money and time to try and fix her, which is OK as that is what I signed up for.She is only 5 has a chip but ofcourse no one claimed responsibility for her . I look at her and wonder just what hell she has been through .She was found as a stray. Obviously no longer needed.

I know that many breeds that are crossed have similar/ same health issues and of course if genetically both parents are carrieers, puppies will be affected by that condition.

That doesn't remove the believe by people that a cross breed is healthier.

The health issues around pure breeds are well known and recorded unlike doodles.

Did she also own dad? Or go to a stud? What did she mean by “health details”? Full genetic tests?

I have a Yorkshire terrier- a show reject as he is too small for breed standard so was sold to us as pet. The amount of times I get stopped with people actually asking me if they can stud him, because a “teacup yorkie” crossed with whatever their small fluffy white dog is would be “so cute”.

umm no. He’s not a good example of his own breed, despite his siblings going off to final at crufts. Plus umm no, I’m not into irresponsible breeding when you clearly know nothing, and actually think a “teacup” animal is a thing.

The fact is, most doodle owners and buyers seem less fussed about the animal abuse and puppy farming and checking for generational health tests than most pedigree owners.

A well bred doodle that comes from a good and ethical breeder and is sold to the right family is a lovely thing. But that’s a one in a million dog

Comments based on your engagement with posters on this forum ? You must be right then mustn't you ?
Although I'd offer an opinion that lack of response is not necessarily an indication that a view is correct but more an unwillingness to respond to someone who is hectoring and rude .

I love my “doodle” dog and I don’t care if people don’t like the breed. . That’s your opinion . I don’t like marmite doesn’t mean I judge people who do .

I have a 3 year old cockapoo and I wouldn’t change him for the world . He’s crazy but he’s the most loving thing I’ve ever met . I lift my head and he gives me the biggest cuddle . He loves his cuddles as much as I do .

Yes he’s been a pain at times but so are children and we don’t tar having children with the same brush if there’s a “runt” of the litter . If anything happened to my boy I would have another cockapoo in a heart beat over any other breed . I just love them .

You’ll see a lot of “hate” on here because people tend to come on asking before they get a dog.

it’s not actually usually hate of either the owner or the poodle cross (I say usually because it’s the internet, there’s always exceptions) it’s to do with the breeding of them.

we have a huge issue with shitty breeders churning out dogs, people who shouldn’t be breeding, dogs who shouldn’t be being bred from - that’s true across the board, but, with pedigrees there are at least a few decent breeders of most breeds (I’d leave breeds with huge health issues where honestly I don’t think it’s ethical to breed them anymore out) so if you look hard enough you’ll find one.

With poodle crosses - I’ve never come across a single good breeder, the worst is full on horrendous puppy farms, but the best you’ll find is someone just breeding random pets with no real thought to health or structure or temperament.

The other problem when people are considering getting a dog and especially for inexperienced owners is predictability - people need to consider whether a particular dog is actually going to fit with their lifestyle in terms of behaviour, activity levels, grooming, trainability etc.

With a puppy you’ve nothing but breed traits and parents to go on, crossing breeds adds more variables because yes they may well be a fairly even mix of both breeds, but they also might not be, it’s basically a pick and mix of traits and sometimes they even double down, for eg. Cockerpoos with extreme separation anxiety because both breeds can be prone to it.

Your best bet of a dog that is what you want it to get is either an adult rescue where you’re dealing with the dog in front of you or a well bred pedigree puppy because you’ve got the best odds of it turning out as it should.

If it comes up on a thread like this I’d say all that or if someone is looking to get a puppy, but I wouldn’t randomly lecture someone who has one or even judge them, they got a dog, they love their dog and dogs are great so mostly it all turns out well for them.

standard poodles are amazing, but I love all dogs. Here is your poodle fix lol

I think it's partly because they've become so ubiquitous...and like other posters have said, many have come from bandwagon-jumping puppy farms.

I'm not sold on them because I don't find any curly dogs appealing. Just a personal choice. Other people seem to find them cute. That's grand.

If people genuinely cared about their dogs health and the life and well-being of the parents, they would never buy a dog that by nature does not come from the best stock and is mostly churned out by puppy farmers.

The healthiest dogs are not being used to breed mongrels or designer doodles. That's just a basic fact - it's not hectoring, or rude. Just logic.

It's comments based off over 20 years breeding and being incredibly involved in the breeding world - and having friends and relatives who are involved in helping these abused cockers and poodles once they outlive their use (i.e. can no longer be bred from).

They're around but you'd mistake them for doodles.

Not many poodle owners have them groomed like a stereotypical poodle, one reason being it's very expensive to keep up. Also, many poodle owners just prefer the teddy cut.

the teddy bear cut means less frequent trips to the groomers to keep it looking fresh and usually cheaper if the groomer works £/hour.

If people genuinely cared about their dogs health and the life and well-being of the parents, they would never buy a dog that by nature does not come from the best stock and is mostly churned out by puppy farmers

But what would be the definition of best stock?
I believe the doodle (sadly not in its current form), does actually have a place in doggy society.

People want a small to medium sized dog that doesn't shed, that's easy to train and family friendly. They want an easy going dog , a heavily dog and one that is suitable to urban living- including being left for 4-6 hours while the owners go to work. Most pure breed dogs do not offer this.

Humans have always selected animals to suit their needs. An urban doodle would be just that. But it means some carful and selective breeding. And yes, breeding from pets as we are looking at pets not guard, retrieving or hunting dogs.

The doodle is here to stay. (And I have pedigree dogs & a rescue cockapoo that I wouldn't recommend to anyone!)

“If people genuinely cared about their dogs health and the life and well-being of the parents, they would never buy a dog that by nature does not come from the best stock and is mostly churned out by puppy farmers.”

I think actually that a lot of them just don’t know any better.

Yes buyers should research - but realistically if you’ve met a poodle cross, liked it do gone home and googled it, you’ll just get all the positive stuff and misinformation. It doesn’t come up with a big warning or anything.

@Ylvamoon to me, it's the healthiest examples of their breeds. And I think this about every dog breed, or cross.

I think that Golden Retriever breeding regulations should be tightened, for example. And no dogs with hip scores higher than a total of 14 should be bred from. I think the current breed average (17) is far too high and breeders who breed from dogs with scores that high are unethical. No one should be buying a Goldie where either parent has a PRA score of 1 or above. No one should be buying a Goldie where either parent has an elbow score that isn't 0. There's no need for these dogs to be bred from, not when there is such good 'pedigree' stock out there.

Ditto with doodles. Much of the adult dogs I see, for example of Pets4home, being bred from dogs that have very poor health scores and as @tabulahrasa says, people don't know better. They don't even have good health scores, just bad ones.

But it's worse than that. It's the lack of care that people show to these dogs that are used for breeding, and the health of the litter, that really gets me. You don't really see it anywhere else...just in 'designer dogs'. People who buy pedigrees seem to be more hot on avoiding puppy farms, recognising breed limitations and issues and (most importantly) health tests from both parents. Possibly because pedigrees are more expensive, so people are more financially invested in it - which isn't really right, but at least people take more care.

Personally, I agree with you. I think doodles could be a lovely subset of various breeds - if they were bred responsibly. My issue at the moment is they are often not and people continuing to buy unhealthy, often puppy-farmed dogs, are just awful.

Thing is, a poodle is more likely to fit that bill than a doodle.

if you want a small, non shedding, easy to train dog why on earth would you take that dog, and cross it with something that isn’t, and expect the resulting offspring to retain the non shedding genetics of one of its parents?

a non shedding poodle crossed with a shedding dog like a lab or spaniel will not get you a non shedding dog. In fact you may end up with worst of both worlds, a combined coat which felts, needs regular grooming, and sheds.

this is what I don’t get. You have a dog completely bred for those characteristics, but people seem convinced you need to cross it with something that isn’t, and by some magic miracle you’ll still have a dog that has those characteristics. When in reality you’re outbreeding to get rid of them.

it’s not just the poodle either. There are several breeds that fit that description. My yorkie is small, non shedding, easy to train, family friendly, and is happy to stay at home keeping the world safe from mice.

People want a small to medium sized dog that doesn't shed, that's easy to train and family friendly. They want an easy going dog , a heavily dog and one that is suitable to urban living- including being left for 4-6 hours while the owners go to work. Most pure breed dogs do not offer this

You've just described a mini poodle.

That's just your experience though. I have an amazing cavapoo with the best temperament. The toy poodle round the corner yaps at every dog it sees when out walking (and in the house) and a local miniature poodle snarls at every dog which passes its garden gate. Whenever it passes my dog off lead (at least six times now) it attacks it snarling and biting. I have to pick my dog up now whenever I see it as the owner isn't able to control it and it makes a beeline for my dog. Ddog has never been attacked by a doodle. Every one he meets is very friendly.

I think lots of people don't actually like the look of the poodle. Even when its not cut like a poodle the doodle crosses still tend to look nicer/cuter. That is why doodles are more popular than poodles. Many dog breeds were developed over time for their looks and that is what has happened with doodles compared to poodles.

But getting a doodle for looks makes absolutely no sense as there's no way of knowing what they're going to look like when they grow up.

Just get a poodle with a teddy cut, or one of the multiple other breeds out there that would fit the bill instead.

This is the problem though
If You actively dislike poodles, why would you get a dog where that's at least 50% of their genetic makeup?

They are no more prone to cavalier traits than they are poodle traits.

This kind of marketing of them is part of them problem as people end up with dogs that is a significant portion of a breed with traits they don't like or isn't set up for them

I know for example someone who knew they didn't want a spaniel because it was too high energy and didn't have the right set up so got a doodle, which ended up with the spaniels energy level, and equally dogs where people don't want terrier traits so breed in poodle for those terrier traits to come out strong.

If people wouldn't get either of the parent breeds in their entirety then they should be incredibly wary about getting a mix of it because you are getting any ratio and combination of looks, personality and health from the breeds.

A labradoodle might look like a labrador with a crimp, or like a poodle. It might be 90% lab personality wise or 90% poodle and anywhere in between. If you dont want one of those things, it's a massive gamble

We all get different traits in different proportions from our parents

Puppy mill dogs are normally crudely euthanised so it's unusual that alot of them seem to be coming up for rescue as "strays". Alot of rescues now bid on ex puppy mill dogs and then rehome them, but they're paying for the ex breeders. Many tears is especially bad for this.

I really want a bullshit but I don't think they have crossed bulldogs and shitzu's yet.

I didn't actively dislike poodles when we got the dog. I am just giving some examples of poodles we have met since having our dog, to explain that you can't say poodles are better than doodles based just on the dogs you know. Anyway, our dog is only 25% poodle and has just enough poodle in him to stop his hair shedding😜

Apologies it's just a really common narrative where people actively know they don't want a breed (usually for a good reason!) So try to avoid it but end up meeting a doodle breeder who sells them a pup with significant portion of an undesirable breed which sets them and their dogs up to fail

I'd also argue that that 25% won't have just given your dog his coat, it will be part of their personality. Unfortunately it's a common marketing from breeders that the poodle part only comes the coat somehow.

I know that's not what you might be saying but it's a really common lie (that ends up with dogs in rescue) that there's any form of control over what any breed mix inherits and in what quantities so that all doodles in a litter come out with a standard

We know it's not true in families. We know our siblings all inherit different things from different people in different ratios, but somehow there's a narrative that all doodles will come out a certain way

oh he's mainly cavalier but I'm sure there's some poodle in there somewhere. Hopefully a bit of their intelligence 😂Do poodles like to eat socks??🙃

I have two cockapoos….one looks like a spaniel and one like a poodle. I can tell immediately if someone is “sniffy” about cockapoos from the way they ask if I breed my dogs (I don’t, both are neutered) or if they ask “is it a poodle/spaniel”.

I always say no, they’re cockapoo’s and watch for the lip curl 😂 I appreciate they are divisive, but I don’t care what others think. Both of my dogs are healthy and happy. I met the parents…..I did as much due diligence as I could but chose a commercial breeder o er a family pet because of the health checks etc. The breeder was always happy for me to pop in and see the puppies so I had no concerns about parentage.

I don’t judge people with pedigree dogs where they have been bred selectively to produce certain traits nor do I appreciate being judged because I chose a particular cross breed. Some people just like to judge/feel superior/put others down. Sad really…..cockapoos can be difficult but with the right handling they are such friendly easy to train and happy dogs, that it’s worth the odd negative comment. Luckily, more people want to pet them than be judgey