Close to despair re separation anxiety

[GiantCheeseMonster]

Just that, really. Dog is 11 months old sprocker spaniel. We did everything by the book - not leaving him to cry as a puppy, micro-absences of a few seconds, room flitting etc. As he grew older it became increasingly obvious he couldn’t tolerate being alone at all. We have Julie Naismith’s book and use her sub-threshold training which got him to a minute alone but now he’s regressed again and I’m back to doing door is a bore and even that freaks him out. I can’t imagine ever being able to leave him for ten minutes, let alone pop to the supermarket. We haven’t been out as a family for months without paying for a dogsitter which is getting expensive and I want to be able to nip out spontaneously - just to go to the neighbour’s for a drink, FGS. We feel trapped in our home and it’s starting to affect our relationship with the dog as it’s so hard not to feel resentful. I’ve read so much online advice and we had a trainer (IMDT registered) who told us to use the sub-threshold method. I am happy to carry on but I just feel that after 5 months of it I should be seeing some progress and I’m not. DH would rehome the dog as he’s so fed up with not even being able to put the bins out without taking him with him on a lead. Any advice or stories of hope are most welcome but please be gentle, I feel at breaking point with it today.

We take him for long walks daily, play games with him (Absolute Dogs courses, that kind of thing) and do scent work and puzzle feeders, Kongs etc so he gets lots of enrichment, before anyone suggests that. We’re good dog owners I think, but this is something on a level I never anticipated.

I've had ddog a year and he has SA and also anxiety so he is difficult to walk. So I couldn't go out without him or with him! And I'm a single parent so it's tricky .

I joined the heroes programme for Julie Nailsmith and it's helped a lot, I find the app takes the stress out and stops me going too fast. We're at a consistent hour now which is giving me some much needed freedom, and I think he will go longer .

He's also now on anxiety medication. But the training has been the key, it wouldn't have got better just with the medication.

I really recommend the Heroes club I was also in complete despair and you have such a lot of support and can directly ask questions of Julie on her vid chats . I'm going to go app only when it renews as I don't need the support now , the app is really good though as it is a clear programme to follow and I would like to get to 2-3 hours so still some way to go

Also to add ddog is the same dog on medication, not spaced out and no side effects, just his 'bowl' is a bit bigger

Also I'd tried the Nailsmith method for 7 months on my own before joining the heroes programme and getting medication and I think I was going too fast and we only got to 20 mins and then kept regressing . I've been on the programme 5 months and we've gone from a few mins to an hour in that time. Plus she did need medication anyway and I got advice on how to approach that . So I've been training her a year to get to this point but I'm really confident that in another year it will be even better.

Thanks, that gives me hope! How much is Heroes if you don’t mind me asking?

I can't remember exactly, but it wasn't break the bank at all. The renewal cost is £19pm to give you an idea, but it's a bit more initially.

Last week I took dd to the opticians and didn't need to get a sitter !! It's those kinds of errands that were the most annoying , and made me feel so despairing . If we can get to 2 hours we can go for lunch!

On medication, I had to see a behaviourist. But it's all claimable on insurance

I have a dog on Prozac for SA. I did my research, took her to the vet to discuss treatment, we got a behaviourist referral and a prescription. We were able to claim everything on insurance. Repeat prescription cost is £20ish a month, not the £100 quoted by a pp. Ddog is absolutely fine on it and it has made the sun threshold training much easier, where before we couldn’t even carry certain pairs of shoes downstairs without her getting stressed out. I totally understand your frustration.

Oh OP my heart goes out to you, this sounds so tough!! Spaniels are notorious for it, they are big cuddly balls of love but sometimes slightly less love would be nice....

Have you been through all the files the 'Dog Training Advice and Support' fb group (the one with like 322k members) -some of it might be similar to Julies advice but there might be some variations you could try, devil in the detail etc.

Have you got any doggy daycares near you, rather than a dogsitter - Obviously not a cheap fix, but if there's a decent daycare if you could do once a week it might build his confidence if he's fine with other people?

Have you tried leaving the radio on? (Might have missed you saying this)

Have you been doing the 'flitting' with all the other stuff on top or have you tried a solid run of just 'flitting' for a bit until its clear he's bored - can you share more on how much/how often/how thats going?

Its not a method thats recommended as generally the advice is not to alert them to the warning signals you are about to leave as it cab trigger the anxiety, but a friends dog who was the same actually got better when he learnt the 'routine'. Hers was out of pure necessity - her shifts changed at work so she HAD to leave him alone for 2 hours until her partner got home - she was in bits worrying even though her neighbour was very supportive. Every time she leaves she puts her shoes/coat on, picks up her keys, grabs her handbag and gives him a kong with treats and off she goes. He howled for a week then tailed off and now sits by the door waiting for his kong and buggers off when she hands it to him. No noise after that. He did then get better with them putting the bins out etc (when a treat wasnt given before leaving) and she can get away with a single treat rather than a kong when she actually leaves the premises now. Again, not normally the recommendation so wouldnt normally be saying it but he now associates the routine+treat with 'im coming back'

I'll have a think and read through some of the good bits i saved when we were training seperation and see if there's any other tricks worth a go

Someone on here did a post once about how they trained their dogs to be left alone-from
memory she took them in the car to somewhere like a post box, got out to post a letter, got back in with no fanfare then left them gradually further away from post box!

also old advice from Jan farrel (most of her stuff is out of date but this worked for us with a rescue with SA) to change the route you leave the house-even going out of a window if necessary but not to make a big deal about it. Just go and come back with no attention. Similar to flitting but changing the routine.

just a couple of things to try but I’d do them in conjunction with medication tbh. Try serenum or get something stronger from vet

There is a huge difference between separation distress and separation anxiety.

Dogs that have improved by the flitting method or leaving them something to chew or just getting them used to being on their own is separation distress and worlds away from true separation anxiety.

Have you tried leaving noise on for him? For mine I leave both the tv and an audiobook on. They have doggy YouTube with natural noise and ducks to watch 😂 and listen to Stephen fry! It's consistent and helps them feel a bit more secure.
Have you tried rescue remedy? Has been life changing for my nervous rescue and got us through some really tricky times.
I would definitely look at getting a behaviourist on board they will have dealt with these issues before.
It will take time!
Will he stay in the car alone? Can you leave him in the car whilst you go to your meeting?

By dogsitter, I mean daycare really - it’s a home environment but she usually has 4 or 5 dogs there. He is fine with other people, I am his first love but he’s not particularly hyper-attached to me and is happy to be with someone else.

Radio does nothing. Nor does leaving him with food. He’s a very foodie dog but if he’s alone he wouldn’t even eat a roast chicken if it was in front of him.

I flit constantly. Seriously, I make it a habit every day. He can choose whether or not to follow me but invariably he does. He doesn’t get bored and lie down ever.

Yes, I’m in DTAS and have read their guides - they advise the sub-threshold method which is what we’re doing basically.

I think he needs meds. He’s just so far beyond a lot of what people are suggesting. I understand why people suggest things like radios or TV or kongs because I would’ve done too, before I got him. He’s on a whole other level of anxiety about being alone. It’s not that he doesn’t like it and grumbles. He’s genuinely petrified of being alone.

There’s not a chance he’d be in a calm enough state to notice the TV unfortunately.

He’s a brilliant traveller and loves the car if people are in it, but if I left him alone in it passers-by would be reporting me to the RSPCA for sure.

This is exactly how we dealt with our rescue lurcher. He used to howl the street down before he discovered he could see the entire driveway from the landing window.

Get another dog? So he is not alone?

I can’t risk two of them possibly being like this. And I don’t have the budget for insurance, food, vet bills etc for another dog at the moment.

Fully sympathise OP, unless you experience it no one can really understand it. I honestly think you should go down the medication route, my vet prescribed cbd oil, it certainly relaxed my dog when we needed to leave her for short periods, worth looking into.

As someone who lives in a terraced house next door to a set of dogs like that, it's seriously like a form of torture. I don't hear anything from the neighbours, except their dogs who howl like someone is electrocuting them for what seems like an eternity (usually actually only 30 minutes). I have had 2 previous sets of neighbours, both in the same house and never heard either of them.

If you had to go out and leave a dog to cry I would at least want warning so I could go to the office (or possibly offer to dog sit)

Maybe that sounds mean, but honestly I used to like dogs and after living next to these dogs and the amount they howl I am really not a fan.

*two previous sets of neighbours with dogs

Aw separation anxiety is awful :( My cockapoo was an absolute nightmare, got himself worked into such a frenzy when he was left alone for even 20 minutes... chewed carpets and did the toilet EVERYWHERE, trembled in the corner whenever he thought we were leaving him. We got another puppy when he was 1 and he was never like that again! I think he was just lonely! He went from being surrounded by his siblings and his parents and other dogs, to our house with 3 humans and no other animals. Looking back he must have been a bit confused. Not that I'm suggesting the solution to having a tricky time with a dog is to get more dogs... but maybe he is lonely? Before we got my younger dog I sent him to doggy day care if he was going to be alone for any length of time, he absolutely loved it and it meant I could enjoy my day or get on with my work without stressing about him. It wasn't cheap but it was worth it!

Get a cat?

I don't think our dog had true SA anxiety but he sounds very much like yours at that age.

I couldn't leave him alone at all. I mean even in the room by himself. Even if he was asleep he would jump up and follow me. As for leaving him in the house or car, that was just a complete no no.

Somewhere around 12 months however he suddenly decided to sleep on a chair in a different room. It was totally random but I assume just part of him maturing.

Now I can leave him but only for a couple of hours. Anymore than that and he doesn't like it. We do leave him with relatives but even then he is just watching and waiting for our return though he won't cry/fuss.

He still would choose to be with us 24/7 but can at least tolerate a couple of hours alone.

11 months is still quite young, so don't loose hope xx

This isn't usually advised for SA, you could end up with two with SA!

Sprockers are dogs with a high prey-drive and a desire to chase small furry things.

Probably not a good idea 🤣

We actually have three cats! He wants to chase them but obviously we don’t allow this.

My older dogs used to be fine but the little one being distressed means they don't settle now either.

And yes, people don't get how bad stuff can be. I can't read the advice/comments about dogs & fireworks as it's too basic & people really don't understand the dog is at risk because they are so distressed.

With fireworks, we use drugs now, made a massive difference. Tho I probably undermedicate as I'm uncomfortable about it.

Definitely talk to the vet again.