Small or medium dog - mini/toy poodle, bichon, maltese or westie?

[icelolly12]

Hi,

Here to pick your brains please..

I'm looking to get a small/medium dog, but keep reading up on various breeds and struggling to make a decision. I am mainly looking at the breeds of mini/toy poodle, bichon, maltese or westie, but open to other breeds too. What I am looking for:

-A dog that doesn't bark much - this is where I'm struggling to get useful info, websites just say 'low/average/high barking' for example but what does this mean in reality for the above small breeds? I really really do not want a 'yappy' dog this would drive me mad as I have noise sensitivity.

-Able to socialise easily with other dogs when walking - I don't want to be that dog owner that everyone hates. What small dogs are less likely to suffer from little dog syndrome? I know a lot is down to socialisation, but some breeds are more prone to being happy around other dogs than others.

-Low shedding/hypoallergenic, low scent and low drool - I don't want a stinky dog like a beagle or a spaniel although I love these dogs, they're not for me.

-easy to housetrain - this is where I'm a bit concerned about a bichon as they're difficult to housetrain apparently?

-Happy to snuggle up on the sofa in peace and contentment while watching tv/reading/chilling - gentle, happy companion dog

-Very affectionate and loving. I want a dog that is owner focused not a cat like dog that doesn't really care that much.

-Happy to come out for both short and long walks - bit worried about some smaller breeds stamina for long hikes as I do like to go for long hikes at weekends etc and obviously want a dog to join me.

So in summary, a sweet, calm loving dog that doesn't bark a lot and will also be great to take across the moors/hills/beach for nice long country walks at weekends.

Any specific experience of breeds would be great in relation to the above points particularly relating to barking- 'yappiness', walk ability- stamina and companionship.

Thanks in advance :-)

@FirewomanSam A havanese will now be added to my list of potentials gosh who'd have thought getting a dog was this difficult?!

@XelaM I don't mind high energy as I will take them out for very long walks and play in garden and take to beach etc, but was your poodle also happy to cuddle up on sofa / chill for extended periods?

My high energy boy today

I had a westie for 14 years ,he was amazing and my best friend 🥰
Very sociable and loved everyone and everything but by heck he barked a lot!

Close relatives have a mini poodle and she is very anxious and yappy. She is attached to one of them, follows them around everywhere, won't settle if they are gone out even if others are home. She is really high maintenance.

I think looking up breeds is all well and good to get an idea but dogs are all individuals as well so there is always an element of risk of the unknown.

Cairns are fabulous little dogs but can be yappy.
We have a Norfolk terrier, one year old and an absolute joy. Needs regular grooming and not too yappy (though she takes her garden patrolling very seriously).

I cant stand barking dogs and have a miniature poodle he rarely barks, if he does I only have to look at him and stops.
They are super easy devoted happy easy to train adaptable little dogs who adore their family. Today mine has walked for 30 mins tomorrow he'll do 2 1/2 hours he doesn't care and he cheerfully goes out in all weathers. He's never had a days illness (he's 9) doesn't shed (an absolute revelation after our previous dogs) and I personally never brush him from one week to the next every 8 weeks he goes to the groomers and they just shave off his fur. Even my non doggy husband likes him.
Go thought the miniature poodle society someone will have list of very reputable breeders who are devoted to the breed with upcoming/current litters. Prepare to be grilled as many breeders worry you're buying one to breed some sort of poodle cross thing.
I was told that many poodle expert think that the black ones are the calmest and the white one the most neurotic. Also don't forget that most poodles are going grey and by 6-7 will probably be very grey this is normal.

@icelolly12 He would sleep in our bed on the pillow under a blanket like a human and have afternoon naps with my grandfather. He snored very loudly and if you tried to move him, he would growl. But he knew exactly when bed- and nap-time was and if the bed was not made up by then, he would sit by the bed and bark at it until you put the pillows and duvets out. Then he would jump on the bed, put his head on a pillow, snuggle in a blanket and snore!

On the sofa he always took up the best spot in front of the TV and didn't like to be moved from there either. I wouldn't say he loved it if anyone was sitting next to him in his spot He did get very jealous though if you tried to kiss or hug anyone in the household, he would be there like a shot interfering in the middle and trying to get all the attention! He was also food-obsessed and you could always win over his heart with a treat

@poodlefan

I cant stand barking dogs and have a miniature poodle he rarely barks, if he does I only have to look at him and stops. They are super easy devoted happy easy to train adaptable little dogs who adore their family. Today mine has walked for 30 mins tomorrow he'll do 2 1/2 hours he doesn't care and he cheerfully goes out in all weathers. He's never had a days illness (he's 9) doesn't shed (an absolute revelation after our previous dogs) and I personally never brush him from one week to the next every 8 weeks he goes to the groomers and they just shave off his fur. Even my non doggy husband likes him. Go thought the miniature poodle society someone will have list of very reputable breeders who are devoted to the breed with upcoming/current litters. Prepare to be grilled as many breeders worry you're buying one to breed some sort of poodle cross thing. I was told that many poodle expert think that the black ones are the calmest and the white one the most neurotic. Also don't forget that most poodles are going grey and by 6-7 will probably be very grey this is normal.

Aww I think this breed sounds perfect for me!!!

Definitely no interest in breeding them, but happy to answer questions from breeder as it shows they're interested in who they're selling to.

Interesting that different colour coats have different traits... I'm drawn to the more red coat do you know if this has any negative traits?

@OohMrDarcy aww how gorgeous!!! He looks like such a character

I'm drawn to the more red coat do you know if this has any negative traits?
Most poodles have fading gene and their coats tend to lighten, often quite dramatically eg a deep, dark red puppy can become a pale apricot at maturity

[quote XelaM]@icelolly12 He would sleep in our bed on the pillow under a blanket like a human and have afternoon naps with my grandfather. He snored very loudly and if you tried to move him, he would growl. But he knew exactly when bed- and nap-time was and if the bed was not made up by then, he would sit by the bed and bark at it until you put the pillows and duvets out. Then he would jump on the bed, put his head on a pillow, snuggle in a blanket and snore!

On the sofa he always took up the best spot in front of the TV and didn't like to be moved from there either. I wouldn't say he loved it if anyone was sitting next to him in his spot He did get very jealous though if you tried to kiss or hug anyone in the household, he would be there like a shot interfering in the middle and trying to get all the attention! He was also food-obsessed and you could always win over his heart with a treat[/quote]
Awww he sounds a treasure!!! I love the afternoon naps with your Grandfather! How adorable

Oh he is best pup ever. Adorable, occasionally cheeky and stubborn (like all teenagers) but still a superstar. Love him so much

I’ve had two bichons. Both were easy to house train and both are very happy to be left for periods of time as long as they have the run of the downstairs.

The first had major skin problems for a month but that was purely due to him catching mange from playing in the long grass in our local park where there were known to be foxes. No issue once that had cleared up.

The second occasionally has a slight irritation but we just have to put a collar thing on to stop him licking.

They both barked if people were about/someone comes to the door but it’s a proper dog bark, not a happy one.

They need a lot of upkeep with regards to grooming and daily brushing. They can have slightly sensitive tummies, (usually when the in laws feed him human food grrrr)

"Interesting that different colour coats have different traits... I'm drawn to the more red coat do you know if this has any negative traits?"
I don't know that much about them in terms of traits and colour, red ones were less fashionable when I bought mine. Personally I wouldn't make colour my priority (although I have to admit having owned grey horses for years I would never own a white one too difficult to keep clean) for me it would all be about finding the right breeder who is expecting a litter of puppies; the breeder I bought mine from (she only breeds black ones) only breeds one litter every 2-3 years and they don't seem to have particular large litters mine was one of 4.

Completely agree about not worrying too much on colour- particularly as poodles can change colour sometimes. Mine was born looking like a black / red phantom ( dad is red, mum is black) he is now our technicolour pup so planning for a colour may be useless! The others in the litter were all black bar the little girl who has stayed a true phantom.

We have a Havanese. They are VERY different to poodles so you need to think about the sort of dog you want. (In general) poodles are everyone's friend at the park. They go up to everyone with big waggy tails and race around with other dogs. Our Havanese is OUR best friend. He adores us but is relatively indifferent to strangers.

If you are after any non-shedding breed it means you will need to invest more time in grooming, which can be hard work if the dog isn't keen to be groomed. Otherwise you will be spending your evenings detangling matted hair.

Our Havanese woofs rather than yaps. Barks at postman etc. Doesn't bark for the sake of barking like the 2 poodle crosses next door though. Yorkies are lovely but definitely yap! He was easy to toilet train, but you do need to invest the time with any breed to toilet train them well. God luck in choosing!

We have a mini poodle. She's great!

We did lots of socialisation with her. She's very bonded to our whole family.

Doesn't bark a lot but definitely will bark more if she's bored. For reasons only known to her she will go crazy if the cat jumps over the gate

She is so expressive! You always know what she's thinking.

Exercise is fine. She copes with a little walk or a long one. Mine is a bit of a princess though and doesn't like the rain or wind!

Best of all she's super cuddly- like a teddy bear!

She does have some separation anxiety but mostly it's me feeling guilty when I leave her because she looks sad when she knows she's not coming with us.

And grooming is expensive. I don't do anything in between grooms though unless she needs a wash.

My vote is you should definitely get one!

Most terrier breeds have a tendency for yapping tbh. My mum's had a Westie a Yorke cross and a maltipoo and they were all yappy (the westie less so though).
I actually think, based on your description, a whippet would be almost perfect

Another option could be a lhasa apso? Temperament wise they are the most beautiful dogs, full of personality, affectionate and playful. They do have long coats (can be clipped short) but they don't shed.
My DB has one and I've not known it to be particularly barky either. They can also take as much or as little exercise as you want to give them.

We have a 15 week old schnoodle.

He meets your criteria. He is very quiet. He is so laid back. He was a bit nervous on his first walks but he is getting more and more confident. Toilet training was a breeze.
Loves to sit on the sofa of an evening.

Perfect basically 😁

A good poodle fits the bill. Would you consider rehoming an older rescue dog? A fair number of older dogs are left orphaned when their owner die or falls ill. Shelters will know what dog has the right temperament for you. I think there is even an organisation that specialises in pre-loved poodles. There's been so much overbreeding and puppy-farming that it's hard to rely on any particular breed.

"red phantom ( dad is red, mum is black) he is now our technicolour pup"
I'm not knocking OohMrDarcy's dog in any way and I'm sure he's absolutely gorgeous but as far as I know the KK and the miniature poodle club/society or whatever they are called only recognise solid colours. Many backyard breeders of all breeds make colour e.g. blue merle a priority over health/temperament and a big selling point with a matching price tag. Just beware; knowledgable reputable breeders are likely to only have poodles of solid clouds.

KC not KK!!

"There's been so much overbreeding and puppy-farming that it's hard to rely on any particular breed."
I dint agree if you go to a very reputable breeder and buy a dog you should get a dog that conforms to the breed standard.
I have a book about miniature poodles you would have thought my dog wrote it everything the book says about them he is. Before purchasing him I spent a long time talking to reputable breeders about the characteristics of the breed again what they said they are like is exactly what he is. We've owned other pedigree dogs all from reputable breeders same thing.
If you go through a reputable breeder (you may have to wait months or even years to get a dog as many don't breed puppies every year) you should get a good example of the breed in terms of appearance and temperament because they are totally committed to the breed and know enough about their bitch and the chosen dog to try and breed in the characteristics and appearance that conforms to the breed standard/expecations. We have a friend who breeds malenois for guarding/the army/security etc they also win at crufts, he knows his two bitches and their strengths and weaknesses and very carefully researches the right dog to enhance them. I personally wouldn't own one for all the money on the world but they are highly sought by those who want one as they meet the requirements for that breed and for working in a guarding role people know exactly what they are getting when they buy one.