Does anyone else struggle to walk their dog during pheasant season?

[Badgershy]

The buggers are absolutely everywhere at the moment. We do 2 walks through private land (which you're allowed to walk in) but they do shoots and have these huge fenced off areas full of pheasants which of course they escape from.

My dog is an 18 month old terrier spaniel Cross with questionable recall at the best of times. We manage him pretty well on a long trailing line but when he's on the scent of something I have to hold the end of it. He's been like a thing possessed this weekend, so so strong, so hyper, darting from side to side, pulling at full strength, completely deaf to me, out of control really. He brought me to tears at one point as I just couldn't get down a steep bank with him. Thankfully there was no one around to watch me scrambling down it on my arse. I returned to the car feeling like a complete failure of a dog owner after passing a few other walkers with their dogs trotting along nicely off lead.

I dont know if I'm looking for advice, sympathy or someone who's experienced the same. I think the answer is to avoid these areas while there's so many pheasants about which is a shame.

Also think of the predatory motor pattern of the Patterdale
Orient - eye-stalk- chase- grab bite - kill bite.

The most rewarding part of this pattern for the terrier is the kill bite, so if the kill bite comes eg grab the rabbit skin shake it toss it bite it then the behaviour is being rewarded in the best way for the dog

Thanks again for all the replies. Some very wise words and I'm feeling confident now to take the easy option and stick to our low key, low excitement walking routes.

I would never ever let my dog chase wildlife. There are ways for him to use that natural hunting instinct. I'm new to dog ownership and even at 18 months I've figured out way to let him burn off that energy. His all time favourite thing to do is a game where I stand on the end of his long line and throw a rabbit skin toy into the bracken, he's fantastic at pouncing on it and returning it to me, complete focused, exhausted by the end of it and most importantly, nothing has had to die for his entertainment!

There are ways for him to use that natural hunting instinct. I'm new to dog ownership and even at 18 months I've figured out way to let him burn off that energy. His all time favourite thing to do is a game where I stand on the end of his long line and throw a rabbit skin toy into the bracken, he's fantastic at pouncing on it and returning it to me, complete focused, exhausted by the end of it and most importantly, nothing has had to die for his entertainment!

Perfect lucky pup! Covers all of his motor patterns. That is the way to have a happy, contented dog, work with what they have and what they need

@Ihaventgottimeforthis

I let my dog chase the pheasants, squirrel & deer in the woods. On our regular routes he tracks me round & appears every couple of mins. I'm not fussed about him disturbing these. He's on lead near farmland, around busy beaches, by cliffs, on the moors. Woods are OK in my book, but then I know he doesn't go far.

Chocolate Labrador by any chance? I wonder if it was your unsupervised dog who knocked my three year old over last month, mouthed at him scratching his face, and had to be hauled off by me and DH, all the time you were nowhere to be seen. DS now terrified of dogs, from asking for a pet dog the previous week.

You deserve to have your dog rehomed, if you can’t be fucked looking after it.

@Changechangychange
What an astonishing, completely unprovoked, personal attack on @Ihaventgottimeforthis.

Chocolate Labrador by any chance? I wonder if it was your unsupervised dog who knocked my three year old over last month, mouthed at him scratching his face, and had to be hauled off by me and DH, all the time you were nowhere to be seen. DS now terrified of dogs, from asking for a pet dog the previous week
There are many, many, many thousands of labradors in the UK.
How can you possibly assume it was this posters dog based purely on the information that it chases wildlife?!

Hope your DS is OK.

My dog is a competing sports dog, very well trained, and luckily I live in a part of the country where I don't have to share my walks with fucking rude people, so no it wasn't me

Just an update.

I took some of the great advice I've had and went to a different forest today, a not very scenic one with just a dirt track running through but of my goodness HUGE success and I've come home relaxed yet buzzing. We did 90 mins with his trailing lead on the floor the whole way, he chased his rabbit skin all the way round, I got some retrieves out of him, a sit/stay when 2 off lead dogs ran past, I dropped it next to him a few times and he did a 'leave it'. Found a nice patch of long grass for him to pounce through and a tree with some kind of animal house at the bottom, he loved getting the skin out of that (I'm amazed we didn't loose it down there!).

I think I've been trying to run before we can walk. We have come such a long way since the puppy days but I need to understand his and my own limits. We're both a work in progress. On the drive back 2 labs ran out infront of the car, I wasn't go fast so it wasn't a dramatic stop or anything like that but the owner look frantic. It did feel a bit like the universe telling me I've got the right idea.

Here he is, 'hunting' his toy down the hole.

Blurred tail in the pic as it was wagging so fast

Oh and I should have said, the whole point of my update really was that this forest has NO damn pheasants in it! Made the world of difference.

Great photo OP! glad you and he both had a blast!

What a lovely update

[quote Colourmylife1]@Changechangychange
What an astonishing, completely unprovoked, personal attack on @Ihaventgottimeforthis.[/quote]
The point is, how does she know it's not? It was somebodies dog.

On the pheasant point. Whatever your views on the rights and wrong of pheasant shoots, its a legal business (normally). A living bird is worth roughly £25, maybe more nowadays. Allowing your dog to chase, possibly injure or kill, is damaging somebodies business. It's not on, no different from sheep worrying.

@tilder I’m not diminishing the attack on the PP’s DS but there is roughly a 1 in 10 million chance that it was the OP’s dog who was responsible.

Sorry not OP’s dog - I mean @Ihaventgottimeforthis ‘s dog

Technically tilder once released, pheasants are legally classed as wild birds. Shoot managers are very keen on that point, and they also couldn't give a shiny shit about their welfare.
It's very different from farmed livestock.

If a farmer left nearly half their livestock to be killed by foxes or starvation or road vehicles, causing multiple accidents & near misses, there would be uproar. But shoots rear & release millions of pheasants into the countryside, outweighing the biomass of native birds by two times, without giving a fig for their welfare beyond trying to blast them out of the air with lead shot that then pollutes the environment.
So I'm not losing any sleep over their businesses, or over the fact my dog flushes them out of the undergrowth.

[quote Colourmylife1]@tilder I’m not diminishing the attack on the PP’s DS but there is roughly a 1 in 10 million chance that it was the OP’s dog who was responsible.[/quote]
Which is the argument used by every owner who does this with their dog in order to justify continuing to do it.

@Ihaventgottimeforthis

Technically tilder once released, pheasants are legally classed as wild birds. Shoot managers are very keen on that point, and they also couldn't give a shiny shit about their welfare. It's very different from farmed livestock.

I wasn't making a case for or against pheasant shoots. I am fully aware of the arguments on both sides, but allowing dogs free rein to chase them and other animals is not an appropriate way to address the concerns.

I do however think allowing dogs to chase wildlife is wrong. For multiple reasons. And to try and insinuate that your dog in some way takes the place of an apex predator to justify the behaviour is not accurate.

Plus are you in the UK? Not come across many elk in UK woodlands recently.

Yep I'm in the UK. If there were elk around I'm not sure I would be out walking in the woods at all...
My thought process goes broadly - is my dog safe? Are there other people around? Is there livestock around? Is the wildlife vulnerable? If I'm happy on those counts I will yes let him flush a pheasant, put a squirrel up a tree or on a rare occasion follow a deer for a couple of minutes - we're not talking Richmond Park here, more like the odd Roe loitering deep in the wood.
I see his influence as low-level disturbance, not that different to me walking by myself. But a PP did make a good point that if everyone did that it is a different ball game, I guess I have a certain amount of privilege with my dog & my location.
But just because I don't mind my dog scaring squirrels it doesn't mean he is neglected, badly trained and out of control or that I couldn't care less if he disappeared & attacked small children

@tilder sorry I genuinely don’t follow your logic so I’ll bow out!

Wasn't the most coherent post ever! Apologies. I didn't mean to be aggressive either, am sorry if it came across in that way.

I guess what I meant was I struggle with people thinking it's fine for a dog to be off the lead, charging around and out of sight. But not ok when a dog is off the lead, charging around, out of site and takes out a toddler. Nobody ever thinks it will be their dog. I bet owner of said dog didn't think it would be theirs either.

I now dog walk for 2 families, which i love. One has dreadful recall and off lead only in a private fenced area. The other has great recall under certain circumstances. Am sure both would love to charge about with abandon, but they don't. Because it's not just about them.

@tilder thanks for the explanation and I absolutely agree with what you say. My 6.5 month Springer is going back on the long lead as his hitherto impeccable recall appears to have gone out the window and he chased off after a rabbit tonight. Teenager already?

I love a Springer. But I would not have the energy! Beautiful dogs.