Giant dogs

[Seekingasaintmaybe]

Could I please get some thorough advice from any giant breed owners please?

There is some conflict between DH and I.
Eventually, after all this covid horror, we want another dog.

I would ideally prefer a smaller breed this time.
DH wants to go the other way, he wants a giant breed.
There is a Saint Bernard breeder near us (though she hasn’t a litter for a while now) and he is hinting at a Bernard.

The thing is though, I know they drool a lot and I HATE drooly dogs.
I don’t mind the hair though.

I don’t find them attractive to look at compared to other breeds, they are too heavy set and clunky for my liking (or are their owners just keeping them fat..?)
I have seen some old photographs of beautiful Saint Bernards (muscular and strong but slim) but none of the real life Bernard’s I’ve seen look like that.

I’m also a little scared about my ability to control it and if it goes ‘bad’/develops aggression problems.
There is a Saint Bernard locally that is quite badly behaved, fortunately i haven’t seen it in ages.
It plonks itself down and refuses to move for its owner whenever it fancies and it doesn’t like my dog and lunges when it sees her which is frankly terrifying.

I’m worried incase we get this dog and it turns out to have issues and i can’t control it.
Our current dog is mildly dog reactive/dog selective but she is perfectly capable of making friends (hence wanting another dog) but I don’t typically let her interact with dogs we don’t know.
She’s fairly small and easily controlled but a giant wouldn’t be...

So I’d really appreciate some advice from giant breed owners.
Good and bad.
Are problem behaviours like dog aggression, resource guarding and the like a known problem as with some other breeds?

Could be worth getting in touch with the rescue section of each pedigree club for the breeds you would consider. They may have an adult dog for rehoming that would fit with your current dog and lifestyle.

Basically a Mr/Miss Chill that won't get riled up if your current dog reacts?

I mean, of course that's what people do - but you're comparing a small breed with a giant
Current dog I described as ‘fairly small’, she is knee height so not tiny but not massive either.

Giant breeds can do damage by wagging their tails near your coffee table
It’s a good job I don’t have coffee tables then isn’t it
There isn’t really anything here that could be easily swiped off with a tail, we have minimal decor here.
Though it’s head would be counter height.

A small dog chewing is annoying, but a giant breed that decides to chew your chair could destroy it in seconds
I’m not an idiot vanilla!
I am well aware that a big puppy will cause considerably more damage than a smaller one..
I’m also well aware of their size.
The puppy would be crate trained, taught what’ for chewing and what isn’t.
Just like any other dog.

As I’ve said, if I don’t feel we can give a giant dog a good life we won’t buy one.
There have been some really good points against raised which I will be considering but I feel like the refusal to allow garden trashing and the small house has been swooped on and made out to be the end of ever having one.
ignoring the fact the dog will pretty much never be alone as I’m always here and out and about most of the day.
I really don’t think that’s very fair.

I think if I were you (and of course I'm not) I would tell DH he can have the large breed he wants when he is the one at home doing the majority of carr and training but until then there needs to be a compromise with a breed that you feel comfortable about.

It's a bit like when the man and breadwinner pesters his female partner into having more children when in reality he does a tiny percentage of the parenting and housework that goes with the responsibility let alone the pregnancy and childbirth factor!

I’m not an idiot vanilla!

I never said you were, did I?

Your lifestyle sounds fantastic for a dog, but your expectations in the home just don't sound compatible with a giant breed puppy to me. I don't know why you think that means I'm calling you an idiot though Plenty of other people have said the same thing.

We fenced off our garden because of ours. Half patio and half grass/plants.

I underestimated the damage from seemingly normal things. They are so heavy the feet sank into the grass and it churned up into a mud pit. Then the wee flooded large parts of it and killed the grass so it turned to a swamp. It never happened with our previous dogs but I presume one leonberger wee is about 5 times bigger than a GSD wee.
They also tear up the grass when they run on it.
Anyway patio- problem solved but we have lost a fair bit of garden. Luckily we do have a fair bit of garden to spare.

Mine have 0 guarding or patrolling instincts. Maybe that’s just luck.

House wise they have caused considerable damage unintentionally just by being so big. They don’t do it on purpose but they lean on everything and it’s a lot of wear and tear on floors and walls. We don’t allow ours on furniture for obvious reasons and they were not hard to train. I think they do smell quite doggy, they stay damp a while when they get wet which I don’t think helps. I love them though so put up with it but I don’t have an Instagram home

I never said you were, did I?
No, it was just where you said about giants being compared to tinies and causing so much damage and destroying a chair in seconds and I just sat here and thought well duh! They are big, of course they will do more damage quicker!
Do people think I’m stupid/an idiot?!
I know you didn’t specifically call me it.

I think if I were you (and of course I'm not) I would tell DH he can have the large breed he wants when he is the one at home doing the majority of carr and training but until then there needs to be a compromise with a breed that you feel comfortable about
I am thinking this too.

It's a bit like when the man and breadwinner pesters his female partner into having more children when in reality he does a tiny percentage of the parenting and housework that goes with the responsibility let alone the pregnancy and childbirth factor!
It is a bit.
To be fair to DH, it’s me that does most of the dog stuff because he works and I don’t.
It’s not that he can’t be bothered or anything like that.

@Seekingasaintmaybe

I never said you were, did I? No, it was just where you said about giants being compared to tinies and causing so much damage and destroying a chair in seconds and I just sat here and thought well duh! They are big, of course they will do more damage quicker! Do people think I’m stupid/an idiot?! I know you didn’t specifically call me it.

I don't think you're stupid and I'm sorry if you took it that way. But plenty of other posters up-thread have said similar to me.

Even @Leonberger above says that she underestimated the damage her giant breeds could do by virtue of their size alone.

I don't think you're stupid and I'm sorry if you took it that way. But plenty of other posters up-thread have said similar to me
Even @Leonberger above says that she underestimated the damage her giant breeds could do by virtue of their size alone
I know.
I think I maybe overreacted a bit because I was/am riled about the whole house/garden thing.

It’s really irrationally annoyed me thinking that people who in theory leave their dogs alone for large portions of the day or barely exercise them are more worthy owners than me just because they have a big house and let them destroy the garden.

I am listening and taking everything on board, I do understand the apprehension re the lack of car, I am mindful of the possibility of issues with the current dog, I share the concerns about holding back/controlling a giant breed etc.
There is a great deal of thinking to do, it’s in no way confirmed that we are going to buy a giant breed.

DH wants it kept on lead as he doesn’t know if it’ll be reliable off lead and thinks the size might scare people.
Perfectly sensible and yes, if I didn’t trust it to come back I would keep it on lead but again, seems a shame when current dog is off loose.

I honestly don’t see why not allowing a dog to trash my garden when said dog is outside from early morning to late afternoon pretty much everyday is such a big problem?
It’s getting plenty of opportunity to run around, sniff, dig holes etc?

But if you’re going to keep it on lead, it won’t have the same opportunities as your current dog?

If you’ve got a knee-height dog (what breed?) and you’d ideally like a smaller dog, but DH wants a bigger dog, a giant breed really doesn’t seem sensible. I think it’s fine for people to say a small house, garden that’s not for doggy antics and no car means a giant breed isn’t suitable. I’m not sure why that’s controversial. It doesn’t sound like your DH has realistic expectations of the sort of dog you can handle at this stage in your life, that’s what PP are saying is coming across.

It’s really irrationally annoyed me thinking that people who in theory leave their dogs alone for large portions of the day or barely exercise them are more worthy owners than me just because they have a big house and let them destroy the garden.

I don't think anybody on here has said that, nor do they think you're not going to be a good owner :)

But I do think owning a giant breed takes more consideration than a smaller one, just because of their size. I know some amazing owners of giant breeds but they've all said the logistics are difficult sometimes, and that the size can make everyday things difficult.

Growing up we had two rescue Irish wolfhounds, not together, one after the other, but had two other dogs at the same time, both labrador sized rescue mongrels. The first came to us aged 5 and the other just 18 months old. Sadly I now live in a flat and don't have the time for a dog. But if ever my circumstances changed, I'd have another in a heartbeat. They are happy to go on long walks or sleep all day. They are utterly amazing dogs, kind, gentle, with a genuine sense of humour. The youngster shared my single bed! If he managed to get in first he would get his back to the wall with his great dopey head on the pillow and then when I got in, he would do this long groaning grunt and stretch out his legs, pushing me off, or force me to contort to fit him and then do this big contented sigh. He knew exactly what he was doing. Gosh how I miss that hound!

But if you’re going to keep it on lead, it won’t have the same opportunities as your current dog?
I was thinking of using a long line and harness so when we reach ‘open’ areas the puppy absolutely would be able to run about, sniff etc.
I would hope as an adult I could trust it to enjoy off leash freedom but it would depend on how reliable it’s recall turned out to be.

If you’ve got a knee-height dog (what breed?) and you’d ideally like a smaller dog, but DH wants a bigger dog, a giant breed really doesn’t seem sensible. I think it’s fine for people to say a small house, garden that’s not for doggy antics and no car means a giant breed isn’t suitable. I’m not sure why that’s controversial
I think i agree on the car.

But I don’t agree on the garden, why is it so necessary when the dog is out most of the day?

I can see how a small house might be difficult size wise with it getting in the way, knocking stuff over but our house is minimalist anyway so nothing really to knock and the giant breeds are said to be lazy as it is, even to the point of only being able to stroll apparently, after a day of being out and about outside I can’t imagine them having much energy left..?
So how much of an issue is it really?
If the dog is tired after being out all day and sleeps, then the house size isn’t a problem?

@Seekingasaintmaybe

Don't get a giant breed if you are houseproud or fanatical about having a beautiful garden. Our garden is boring. No plants, just balls, chutes and other big garden toys. Reinforced fencing etc. We have old tatty carpets, old skirting boards in our home (downstairs) so if any pee or poo gets on carpets it is no big deal I honestly don’t see why not allowing a dog to trash my garden when said dog is outside from early morning to late afternoon pretty much everyday is such a big problem? It’s getting plenty of opportunity to run around, sniff, dig holes etc?

I also don’t see why I can’t apparently have a nice house?
Current dog as a puppy was played with and crate trained and taught what was acceptable to chew and what wasn’t.
Isn’t that what everyone does with dogs..?
‘Puppy proof’ their house, do what they can to prevent accidents and teach the puppy how to behave in the house and live in harmony with the trained adult dog and an untrashed house?

The more you post the more you are making me think that giant breeds are not for you
And you might be right.
Certainly if they aren’t no capable of long walks they won’t be though it seems the Leo’s at least are.
But that’s the whole point of research and talking to people.
I wouldn’t go and buy one if I didn’t think we could give it a good quality of life.

They wouldn't be out for that long though, as has been mentioned above St.Bernards/Giants aren't capable of that much exercise, especially as puppies but also as adults.

The point about being house proud isn't meaning that you can't have a nice house, it's that St Bernards come with having hair absolutely everywhere and constantly drooling everywhere, this needs cleaning up constantly, also, especially the long haired ones can often smell, while you may not notice it, others will coming in to your house. If this is things that will bother you then probably best looking at another breed.

To be honest, I agree with PPs that a giant breed doesn't sound right for you. They won't be able to keep up with your lifestyle (long walks etc), you don't like their drooling (this gets worse as they grow not better), you don't sound comfortable about being in control of a dog that size.

Another thing I would consider aswell if you haven't already is how your current dog would react to a dog of that size coming in to your home, it's one thing for her to get on with other dogs, it's another to have to share her home with a giant breed when she is small, they will put grow her very quickly, and especially being male she may not like that. As others have said aswell, with her reacting on the lead, even though it's only when stopped next to a dog, when you're walking her and the pup together, if she reacts to a dog, chances are your giant will too as a way of protecting your other dog and they will be a lot harder to control than a small dog

Deerhound
Deerhound/lurcher
Hovawart
Briard
Bouvier
Rottweiler

They wouldn't be out for that long though, as has been mentioned above St.Bernards/Giants aren't capable of that much exercise, especially as puppies but also as adults
I’m conflicted here because I’m unsure how much is they genuinely can’t vs owners letting them get overweight and not really bothering to exercise them much.
There is a Saint Bernard called Wilfred on Instagram who is out hiking every weekend and I’ve seen videos of Saints doing agility (albeit a much slower pace!).
It seems utterly alarming to me that a healthy dog of any breed couldn’t manage a relaxed walk of 8 miles.
If they genuinely can’t walk that distance then no, they won’t do for me and I would be extremely worried wondering what has gone so far wrong in their breeding.
Especially as comparable breeds like leonbergers and wolfhounds can allegedly manage it.
What is it about the Saint that means they can’t?

And yes, I am aware the puppies need 5 minute per month of age lead walking and no jumping or going up/down stairs.

The point about being house proud isn't meaning that you can't have a nice house, it's that St Bernards come with having hair absolutely everywhere and constantly drooling everywhere, this needs cleaning up constantly
The hair really doesn’t bother me.
I’m not sure about the drool.

especially the long haired ones can often smell, while you may not notice it, others will coming in to your house. If this is things that will bother you then probably best looking at another breed
I’m not too bothered about smell.

To be honest, I agree with PPs that a giant breed doesn't sound right for you. They won't be able to keep up with your lifestyle (long walks etc), you don't like their drooling (this gets worse as they grow not better), you don't sound comfortable about being in control of a dog that size.

Another thing I would consider aswell if you haven't already is how your current dog would react to a dog of that size coming in to your home, it's one thing for her to get on with other dogs, it's another to have to share her home with a giant breed when she is small, they will put grow her very quickly, and especially being male she may not like that. As others have said aswell, with her reacting on the lead, even though it's only when stopped next to a dog, when you're walking her and the pup together, if she reacts to a dog, chances are your giant will too as a way of protecting your other dog and they will be a lot harder to control than a small dog

Oops.

Another thing I would consider aswell if you haven't already is how your current dog would react to a dog of that size coming in to your home, it's one thing for her to get on with other dogs, it's another to have to share her home with a giant breed when she is small, they will put grow her very quickly, and especially being male she may not like that. As others have said aswell, with her reacting on the lead, even though it's only when stopped next to a dog, when you're walking her and the pup together, if she reacts to a dog, chances are your giant will too as a way of protecting your other dog and they will be a lot harder to control than a small dog
She is much more welcoming to dogs that come in to the home than outside.
She isn’t territorial in the slightest and my assumption is that she considers dogs we’ve welcomed in to the house to be trusted friends but doesn’t trust ones we come across outside.

I have heard that male/female pairings have the highest rate of success.

The last point is a potential concern.

Okay.
Say we don’t go for a Saint.
Does anyone have any recommendations for the following criteria:

• Medium to large size
• long coat
• As little drool as possible
• Has enough stamina to do minimum daily 8 mile walks
• Suitable for small house
• Typically have a friendly, gentle disposition
• No known potential major behavioural problems in the breed eg resource guarding in cockers and goldens, dog aggression in Staffs, stranger aggression in Pyrenees and so on and so on.

🤞🏻

Otter hound 😂

What about a standard schnauzer or a bearded collie?

I’ve heard Schnauzers are excessively badly so not sure about that, bearded collie possibly 🤔

Excessively BARKY

I walk a bearded collie and she's absolutely lovely. Calm in the house, will walk for miles, gets on well with the resident cat. Sounds like she may fit pretty well - she's not huge but she has the long hair you want :) doesn't drool or bark either.

Labrador, OP.

Actually, vanilla is right. A collie is the only breed that matches that criteria. Long coat, and they can walk miles.