Would any poodle cross owners be interested in a separate forum on here where we can (hopefully) talk without judgement?

[DoodlesInTheHouse]

Genuine question. I asked MNHQ about this (under different name, if you are looking at this MNHQ) and they said to ask on here to see if there was interest.

I understand fully the views of some that some poodle crosses are not a good idea for a variety of reasons (puppy farming, health checks, various other reasons etc etc), but we also have our own reasons on why they suited our family, why we chose not to rescue at that time (and very likely will rescue in years ahead) and we are very, very happy with our choices. We are intelligent adults and made an informed choice. I come from a very dog-oriented family and knew what we were doing.

It seems impossible to ask a question about poodle crosses on here without being jumped on. It wouldn't be the done thing if we were talking about breast v formula, or SAHM v working mums, but it seems to be acceptable to ridicule the choices that some of us have made.

Would anyone be interested?

"Not all breeders will take a dog back."

Then I'd not agree that they're good breeders...especially when they already had a new litter in the go in that short period of time.

I didn't say anything at all about your dog's original owners, sadly horrible things do happen to people that mean they can't keep their dogs, there's no judgement in that at all - I reserve that for people who quite happily produce puppies for cash and then don't bother to do everything they should.

tabulahrasa

Fair enough, I'm not saying your point isn't valid or I disagree. I'm just agreeing with OP that it would be good to be able to discuss poodle crosses without judgement as that is what the post is about.

LoveMyWeeDog...just post about your dog though, none of the people who hang about in the doghouse regularly jump on threads about poodle crosses offering judgement.

It really only does come up when someone asks about breeders or buying one.

Tabulahrasa - i have a question if you don't mind? Apart from the irresponsible breeders who take advantage of fashionable puppies (totally will admit to them), irresponsible owners who want fashionable dogs for no other reason than they are fashionable (totally admit to those being an issue too) what are your opinion on poodle crosses? its clear your an experienced dog owner so I was wondering if you have seen any traits that are popular among poodle crosses?

Tabulah - I'm sorry, but I think you have lost track of what your argument against poodle-crosses actually is.

You say: 'It's not just poodle crosses at all, the reason it's currently worse with poodle crosses is firstly that the very few good breeders that exist are concentrating on doing what they're doing, not breeding crosses and secondly the huge issue because poodle crosses even without any health tests are roughly twice the price of fully health tested very carefully bred poodles, they actually attract bad breeders.

There are breeds affected by that as well, French Bulldogs and cavalier King Charles spaniels have both been mentioned on this thread, they're both breeds where you'll find higher than an average amount of bad breeders as well, because they're in demand and expensive'

** You haven't said how many poodle cross breeders you have actually investigated, so I am unsure how you are able to make the claim in the first paragraph that good breeders are not breeding good poodle crosses.

Secondly, and most importantly, you have said that these issues affect French Bulldogs and King Charles spaniels too. So I think it is safe to infer from that that these issues will affect popular breed of dogs simply due to supply and demand, nothing to do with whether or not they have poodle in them or are hybrid breeds.

So, why the vitriol on here towards poodle crosses? As I said earlier, people stupid or ill-informed enough to buy from puppy farms will likely buy from a dud breeder regardless of breed type.

tabulahrasa.....I'm pretty new to mumsnet and have only posted a few times but this thread would put me off posting about my dog after the response the OP has received. It feels a little like I am having to justify where and why I have a poodle cross and it's a shame. I probably am a little sensitive about her because of course I think she's the best wee dog in the world and I couldn't give a hoot what she's crossed with but it would I would have loved to have been able to discuss things like grooming tools and sock stealing without any prejudice.

There are plenty of topics that come up on the Doghouse that bring out the judginess in posters, it's certainly not limited to the owners of poodle crosses.

Earlier on this thread a poster referred to pedigrees as "freaks", every bit as sweeping as anyone suggesting all owners of crosses are irresponsible. The "freaks" and "mutants" comments often come out when showing or pedigrees are mentioned, especially around Crufts.

I've seen people pushing raw feeding on threads here in such a way as to suggest that owners feeding anything else clearly doesn't care enough about the wellbeing of their dogs.

Often on threads when an OP is considering buying a puppy they will be told they should be rescuing instead.

Dogs are something a lot of people are very passionate about and that inevitably leads to almost every decision being one that someone will judge you for, whether on MN, other forums or in the real world.

Personally I don't care whether someone is looking for a pedigree, cross or mongrel, if I feel it would be useful I will offer up advice about finding a reputable breeder and avoiding bad ones.

tabulahrasa....maybe I missed the point?...Did the OP start the thread with a breeding or buying question?

So, why the vitriol on here towards poodle crosses?

Have you ever seen the vitriol towards people who show on threads about Crufts? Some years it's been absolutely spectacular

The actual dogs?

They tend to be nice dogs TBH, but then I like the breeds that most often go into them so I would think that.

I like poodles, not the traditional clip admittedly, but they're intelligent, biddable, what's not to like?

Traits wise, they're not predictable, some are a very half and half mix, some come out very poodly or very the other breed, some look like one breed but behave like the other.

All the most common crosses are either other gun dogs or companion dogs, with similar energy levels and equally as biddable, they're not a hugely incompatible mix.

it's not like some of the other crosses where you're actually wincing at how badly they could turn out, for instance people crossing pugs with JRTs to supposedly get healthier pugs where what you could actually end up with is a dog with a JRT personality trapped in a pug body...

TrionicLettuce...Do you think it would be best to avoid The Doghouse and stick to dog or poodle cross forums?

Sorry you feel that way lovemy feel free to pm me if you would like.

Tabulah has also failed to reply in anything but scant detail to this statement I made: I think you are somewhat destroying your own argument that 'Labradoodles for instance, labs and poodles share hip dysplasia and PRA as issues that should be tested for'. What happened to the responsible breeders of pedigrees there then?

In my opinion, your argument that there aren't very good breeders anywhere is very weak and you have avoided the issue I raised.

Another U-turn by Tabulah

TrionicLettuce...That's a genuine question as I'm quite new to posting and really only joined MN as I'm trying to conceive at the moment. It was a lovely surprise that there was a doghouse section. Maybe I should avoid it though if it's like that

"So I think it is safe to infer from that that these issues will affect popular breed of dogs simply due to supply and demand, nothing to do with whether or not they have poodle in them or are hybrid breeds."

Yes.

I'm not really sure what your point is there TBH.

I really think that what you see as vitriol towards poodle crosses is people concerned about the state of dog breeding trying to inform potential buyers what the issues are.

"Another U-turn by Tabulah"

I'm pretty sure I said in my first few posts that I don't have an issue with crosses themselves, because I don't.

DoodlesInTheHouse....thank you as I doubt there will be a doodle section after this and it would be good to chat about our doodles in a nice environment

So, why the vitriol on here towards poodle crosses?

There is no vitriol towards poodle crosses. They are dogs. It's not their 'fault' they are poodle crosses. It's not a problem that they are poodle crosses. The passionate dog people on here love dogs. Period.

The vitriol is towards breeders of poodle crosses. They shouldn't be doing it. There is no need, no requirement, for a poodle to be crossed with any other breed. It doesn't improve upon a poodle. Poodle crosses can't do anything that poodles can't do. Poodle crosses aren't better than poodles.

The vitriol is toward breeders of any crossbreed. If it suddenly became fashionable for Rottweillers to be crossed with Jack Russell's and be called Jackrotts those breeders would receive the vitriol. For the same reasons. There is NO NEED for people to purposely breed crossbreed mutts.

Lovemyweedog & Lettuce - the dog house can be very informative so don't avoid it. I usually read the posts and not post. However there is a lot of experience there and it is all helpful information.

I think it's important to realise everyone on this thread - and tbh most threads know the arguments for and against pedigrees and so-called designer dogs and everything else. I think the issue is raised so often is the issue. Maybe we should have a live and let live rule - unless someone is specifically asking for the advice regarding breeds and crosses and breeders we should just get on with it.

And to be honest doodles I think her post on the actual dogs as opposed to the breeders was very well rounded and informative.

The cross I always wonder about was the pomskey - OK a husky the size of a Pom is great but a Pom the size of a husky would be . . . An unusual choice.

Well I'm confused now.

'they're intelligent, biddable, what's not to like?'

So people looking for poodle crosses are jumped on when asking for advice because, er, ...?

They are biddible and intelligent and they may inherit health problems that the pedigree dogs they are bred from have anyway?

lovemyweedog , read through some of the threads on grooming / behaviour / training , nobody gives a hoot what sort of dog you have , except for this type of thread there is some good advice to be had .

So people looking for poodle crosses are jumped on when asking for advice because, er, ...?

Because there is no function that a purposely bred poodle cross fulfils that any other dog cannot fulfil. Except to make the breeder money.

doodles , your question has just been answered by exlteve

"The cross I always wonder about was the pomskey - OK a husky the size of a Pom is great but a Pom the size of a husky would be . . . An unusual choice."

That's an incompatible cross that makes you wince... What's even worse though is that the photos you see online are of puppies, the adult ones I've seen are basically just slightly smaller huskies, so anyone who wanted a tiny husky didn't even get that.

Her point is the doodle dogs are lovely dogs and that they are unfortunately the victims of unscrupulous people as are other plenty of other breeds.

Now I want to hear about all your poodle cross dogs and their adorable ways. Does anyone else have a small cross that acts like a larger dog? As in fetch and chase and running around like a lunatic at top speeds?