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The doghouse

If you're worried about your pet's health, please speak to a vet or qualified professional.

My dogs killed a cat :(

216 replies

habibihabibi · 26/02/2016 15:55

I have come home to find my two small poodle cross breed dogs have just torn a small cat apart in our (walled) back garden . I feel sick , they normally take a beating from rowling Tom's whose path them cross on walks on lead.

There is no collar on the poor thing and though we have many strays in the area it looks fancy . Do I have to go door knocking round the neighbourhood ?
Am I liable for anything ?

OP posts:
Arfarfanarf · 27/02/2016 14:51

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

MimsyBorogroves · 27/02/2016 14:52

Not the dogs fault in the slightest. I have dogs who live happily alongside our 3 cats. They play together happily, sleep together happily and two of the cats will occasionally swipe at or bite one of the dogs if they put a paw out of line. I trust them all together as the dogs seem to see them as part of the pack. One of my cats goes out into our garden, the other two are house cats.

If another cat came into our garden though, I know they would be chased. If the dogs got hold of it - I honestly don't know what they'd do. I'd like to think nothing, but it's an instinct. And two or more dogs together can act in pack like behaviours.

I hope you're ok, OP.

OliviaDunham · 27/02/2016 14:52

Sparkling the dog owner isn't responsible legally at all, as cats are "free roaming", as I said earlier in my previous post the dog that attacked my cat jumped the fence and came into my garden - legally they weren't responsible for this either which dos surprise me as the dog had come on to my property.

Floralnomad · 27/02/2016 14:53

The fact that the OP has such a secure walled garden is probably why the cat got killed , my dog is always chasing cats in our garden but they generally skulk around the edge and he makes so much noise that they leg it up a fence ( 6") before he gets them . He did grab a leg of my neighbours cat once as it scrabbled up the fence but I'd heard the commotion and got there in time .

HumptyDumptyBumpty · 27/02/2016 14:53

Apple so the dog is on the deeds, is it? Pays the mortgage? No, didn't think so. The human aspect of property ownership is irrelevant. Neither the dog nor the cat takes it into consideration, it's an artificial construct that would not change the behaviour of either animal.
What matters is two conflicting sets of natural/happy environments: roaming vs killing. You can easily prevent a dog killing. You just choose not to, at the expense of the life (the LIFE) of the cat. Not its happiness, not its right to behave a certain way. Its life. And apparently that choice is okay.

Sucks to be a cat on MN.

Oh, and for the poster who asked, I have no pets, so it's not a choice I have to make. My daughter doesn't live with any animals who might harm her. The cats we had when I was growing up chose not to roam, were happy in the house/garden (nothing to stop them leaving, they just didn't) and not one of the four ever brought in a dead creature, nor did we find remains in the garden.

Dog people think dogs are marvellous, regardless of the evidence. I think all animals have their advantages and disadvantages, and a responsible person takes those into account. Doesn't just throw their hands up and say 'oh, that's dogs, what can you do?'

Imagine it were a toddler boy and a toddler girl, instead of a cat and a dog. Pre-verbal, or at least young enough that they don't 'get' explanations as to how certain behaviours are not acceptable.

The boy bites and seriously hurts the girl, because 'that's what boys do, you can't stop them, besides, it was in his own home which he has no actual ownership of and no concept of'
It's then the girl's fault for being near enough to the boy to allow herself to be bitten. So, that's okay, isn't it? The parents, knowing the boy is prone to biting, and choosing not to keep him away from the girl, or supervise, or teach him not to bite, are not responsible. Their choices are fine.

Jesus.

MrsCampbellBlack · 27/02/2016 14:55

cats v dogs is the new ff v bf Wink

As sparkling said - horrid for everyone involved.

ThroughThickAndThin01 · 27/02/2016 14:55

What are you on about humpty we're talking about cats and dogs, not boys and girls.

HumptyDumptyBumpty · 27/02/2016 14:57

Through I said 'imagine'. That was the clue.
HTH

ThroughThickAndThin01 · 27/02/2016 14:59

Why should we imagine Confused. They're two entirely different scenarios. HTH

PrettyBrightFireflies · 27/02/2016 14:59

And most cats don't do any harm, except possibly a bit of poo and possibly they might kill a bird or a mouse now and again, which is horrid, but it's not someone's pet.

How the hell would cat owners know what their cats get up to while they are roaming?

Sorry, but that has really pissed me off - we have every bloody neighbourhood cat in our garden, tomenting our small furries and goldfish every chance they get.
The rabbit (recently deceased) was a hardnut and used to try and make friends with the cats which were sat on the top of her run trying to work out how to eat her, but the guineas are terrified when the cats bat on the wire - so much so, that I am restricted as to when I can let them out to when I can supervise and chase the damn things off.

AppleSetsSail · 27/02/2016 14:59

Jesus indeed.

Apple so the dog is on the deeds, is it? Pays the mortgage? No, didn't think so. The human aspect of property ownership is irrelevant. Neither the dog nor the cat takes it into consideration, it's an artificial construct that would not change the behaviour of either animal.

The human aspect of property ownership is irrelevant, is it? Let's notify the police!

Of course neither the dog nor the cat is aware of who owns the property, the owner is. I have a dog; I have a garden. I will allow my dog to to whatever the hell she wants to do in my garden. My dog happens to be a golden retriever and she is as docile a dog as you'll ever find but if she decides to kill a cat that ventures into my garden I am hardly going to start supervising her in the garden because she is there several hours a day.

I suggest that you consider property rights on behalf of your cat because as you have noted he is not capable of doing so.

What matters is two conflicting sets of natural/happy environments: roaming vs killing. You can easily prevent a dog killing. You just choose not to, at the expense of the life (the LIFE) of the cat. Not its happiness, not its right to behave a certain way. Its life. And apparently that choice is okay.

As above, I will absolutely not supervise my dog in my garden. It is fully fenced and she spends half the day out there. It is not my job to protect other people's cats who happen to come into my garden.

Sparklingbrook · 27/02/2016 14:59

Sparkling the dog owner isn't responsible legally at all

I don't think I said they were. Confused

I think we should bear in mind this thread is in The Doghouse topic so there are probably going to be more opinions from dog owners.

AppleSetsSail · 27/02/2016 15:01

^

Sparklingbrook · 27/02/2016 15:02

Anyone would think the OP had posted this in AIBU.

AppleSetsSail · 27/02/2016 15:07

I am just agog at the idea that dog owners should supervise them in their own gardens.

Quick survey, dog owners - how many hours a day does your dog spend in the garden? Would you mind quitting your job or leaving your children alone inside so you could sit outside with your dog, maintaining the safety of the neighbourhood cats that might enter?

Seems reasonable.

Murphyslaw21 · 27/02/2016 15:09

Oh dear, I would take too the vets as it could be chipped.

RidersOnTheStorm · 27/02/2016 15:10

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

Peaceandloveeveryone · 27/02/2016 15:15

I (as lots of other posters have also mentioned) have a dog and a cat. There are some crazy people on this thread.

SirVixofVixHall · 27/02/2016 15:24

I have a dog, but I do rather agree with the pp who said that she wouldn't allow a pet that would kill a cat to have that opportunity. I've had cats, I would have been completely devastated if one had been killed by a dog. "ripped apart" God that is just ghastly. So although op, i really feel for you, and I understand that you are upset, and that you could not possibly have known what would happen, I would no longer leave both dogs together unattended in the garden if they were mine. I think it is possible that if it had been just one dog, then it might not have happened. Esp given the breed, not one known for cat hating. I agree take the remains to a vet to scan. And I would also now let the dogs out one at a time, try and supervise them in the garden, and warn neighours that they have form with cats. V Sorry for you and the cat's owners that this has happened.

LimeJellyHead · 27/02/2016 15:25

Hennifer: You can train dogs or keep them in the house or on a lead

Really! On a lead in their own gardens.

Out of interest, do you have a dog and garden yourself?

I am afraid if you let your cat out and basically allow them to go into other people's property, you takes your chances. I'm not saying it's nice but it is how it is. You don't know dogs very well if you think a dog who is capable of killing a cat is somehow bad. Dogs are dogs. Cats are cats. That's how it is. Do you think a cat that kills a mouse or bird is someone not a fit pet? Do you find that behaviour abhorrent? I bet not. But somehow you think it different if a dog kills a cat in their own garden.

As humans we class dogs and cats as pets, therefore giving them special status above the bird or mouse etc... but please bear in mind that dogs and cats do not see the world like humans.

OliviaDunham · 27/02/2016 15:26

Sorry sparkling, I thought that when you said I wonder what the vet would say, I thought you meant legally speaking - my misunderstanding, apologies.

HumptyDumptyBumpty · 27/02/2016 15:29

FFS, my example of small children was to put the same situation out there with different participants, who can be reasonably closely modelled on the original situation. Both pets and small children cannot be relied upon to know what's okay and what's not. Both pets and small children need guidance. So, if it's not okay to just accept a child hurting another child (I.e. Not justifying it on the basis of a) it's 'natural' and b) the one hurt should somehow know to stay away from the hurter) why is it okay for a pet owner to just accept their pet killing another pet?

Dogs and cats can be trained to shit and piss in specific areas/circumstances. Dogs can be trained to sit, lie down, roll over, raise a paw.

And yet they 'cannot' be trained to not kill. So, they aren't actually domesticated then. Why would you have a wild animal in your house?

And for the people who keep referring to 'my' cat, RTFT. I don't have one.

Sparklingbrook · 27/02/2016 15:29

Oh no, sorry Olivia, I sort of meant when faced with scanning the remnants of a cat that had been killed by 2 dogs to try and find an owner.
I suppose it would be the vets personal opinion though.

ThroughThickAndThin01 · 27/02/2016 15:29

SirVix I really don't think most people would have time to organise the ops dog care as you suggest, in a private garden. There's no way I have time to be in the garden each time my dogs are there. There's no way I would let only one out if the other wants to go out as well. It's just not practical.

HumptyDumptyBumpty · 27/02/2016 15:31

Oh, and apple as you well understood, the human aspect of property ownership is irrelevant to the cats and dogs involved and their behaviour. Neither knows the difference between 'their own home/garden' and 'another person's home/garden'.

Unless you're saying that your dog will kill in its own garden, but know to control this urge when in public?

In which case, I go back to my point that you should extend this training to encompass: 'don't kill other people's animals'.

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