Raw feeding advice please?

[NigellasGuest]

My 11 month cocker spaniel is fed raw using complete meals (nutriment, natures menu complete meals) plus duck necks, chicken wings for treats. He has now been refusing the complete meals for a week or so, even if they are half tripe which used to be his favourite!

He will only eat chicken wings and duck necks now. I don't think this is balanced enough - I understand the need to feed 80/10/10% for meat/bone/offal. Does anyone know what percentage of a chicken wing is meat, and what percentage is bone? And what else could I give him? I definitely want to keep feeding raw but I am a bit of a novice!

Chicken wings vary...a big wing may be 50% bone but a small skinny wing can be 75%. Necks are high in bone too.

If you are on fb join raw feeding uk. If not, this is a link to the info files <a class="break-all" href="http://dogsdinner2.m.webs.com/site/mobile?dm_path=%2Fquickstartguide.htm&fw_sig=cbfc2743b337a0fea9e668624666ad16&fw_sig_session_key=1523c69a0611733c579794f9c76a8deb5e7cadab99ecd8f44471ab4dc835a031-85465967&fw_sig_site=85465967&fw_sig_social=1&fw_sig_permissions=none&fw_sig_time=1407768240952&fw_sig_api_key=522b0eedffc137c934fc7268582d53a1&fw_sig_permission_level=0&fw_sig_locale=en-US&fw_sig_partner=webs&fw_sig_tier=1&fw_sig_premium=1&fw_sig_potential_abuse=1&fw_sig_access_token=7076cd1ab7dd5f6aefa75da9566dfc3d6480b696&fw_sig_url=dogsdinner2.webs.com/&fw_sig_is_admin=0&fb_sig_network=fw#0120" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">dogsdinner2.m.webs.com/site/mobile?dm_path=%2Fquickstartguide.htm&fw_sig=cbfc2743b337a0fea9e668624666ad16&fw_sig_session_key=1523c69a0611733c579794f9c76a8deb5e7cadab99ecd8f44471ab4dc835a031-85465967&fw_sig_site=85465967&fw_sig_social=1&fw_sig_permissions=none&fw_sig_time=1407768240952&fw_sig_api_key=522b0eedffc137c934fc7268582d53a1&fw_sig_permission_level=0&fw_sig_locale=en-US&fw_sig_partner=webs&fw_sig_tier=1&fw_sig_premium=1&fw_sig_potential_abuse=1&fw_sig_access_token=7076cd1ab7dd5f6aefa75da9566dfc3d6480b696&fw_sig_url=dogsdinner2.webs.com/&fw_sig_is_admin=0&fb_sig_network=fw#0120

Sorry...couldn't get back to the bottom of that post on my phone after going back to bracket the link!

The page called any old bone gives percentages. BUT. I would recomend first reading the part on help, my dog won't eat. You probably won't want to do it. It goes against everything you want to do when your dog won't eat but it is the best advice because ypu can't afford to be held to ransome on a raw diet. I have been there. My dog can go 3 or 4 days but I have always won in the end.

Will he eat other stuff if you serve it with duck necks/chicken wings?
I don't worry about bone percentage, just feed according to how the poo is. If its getting too soft I'll up the bone intake, will cut it down and give more meat or fish if they're having trouble getting v hard poos out.
Chicken wing is mostly bone, you could balance it out with something boneless like Nutriment beef. Or minced beef from supermarket. Sainsbury's value mince is the cheapest I've found (£1.40 for 400g), their 2.5 Kg bags of frozen chicken pieces (legs, drumsticks, wings) also good value.

If he's refusing complete meals he may also refuse boneless meals. When I started sourcing from suppliers and giving my dogs chunks of meat, they turned their noses on mince and any ready made meals. At first I added some unseasoned chicken stock and slices of liver to get them to eat. Now if I have to feed ready made and they don't eat, I just stand my ground. They quickly got the idea that it's that or nothing else they're getting.

Reminds me of a mum I know who gives her kids burgers, fish fingers and stuff and not make them eat the veg.

Yes it did occur to me that surely he wouldn't starve himself if there's decent food on offer! And yes I have tried hiding a chicken wing in a pile of nutriment, ender - he just eats the wing. His poos are all right, very small though and definitely not soft, but not really really hard either.

I might try some minced turkey from Tescos, I remember he used to eat that and hasn't had it for ages.

Is tripe a kind of offal?

Tripe is classed as muscle. High in probiotic but is quite fatty too. I usually use that in addition to another meat and not as a replacement.

Ok, I don't understand where tripe fits in - it's sort of meat but can't be used as meat in the percentage thing?

is it all right to try him on minced beef, the human sort?

It fits in as meat. The percentage thing is 80% muscle meat which is boneless mince and chunks, tripe and heart etc. Offal is basically the secreting organs like liver, kidney etc. The percentages are a sensible rough guide but I don't have the scales out anymore. You do get used to it.

Human minced beef is fine too.

aha ok - so as he likes tripe (as in, the complete meals with added tripe) I can try buying a carton of pure tripe and adding that to human mince / complete meals, and then gradually reduce the amount of tripe perhaps. That's a plan!

BTW this morning and this evening he has eaten a bit of nutriment complete meal which I had wrapped the chicken necks in, and then after the necks had been eaten he then ate a bit more of the nutriment, which is definitely progress.

Tripe is abit of a superfood tbh, really nutritious so as long as weight isn't an issue there is nothing wrong with a spoonful in every meal, alot of raw feeders give small amounts daily.

Have you tried heart? Mine loves both beef and lamb heart. Fairly easy to get hold of - I've even found sliced heart in Tesco.

that's a good idea as it seems heart is muscle meat, so I'm going to give it a try! currently he is enjoying turkey mince (for humans) so thank goodness he is eating but he can't just have turkey mince indefinitely.....

can anybody advise - WRT the percentage thing, is it ok to do that across the week sometimes, rather than every meal being 80-10-10? It's just that he just ate a meal consisting almost entirely of chicken liver, with a bit of turkey mince.

Yes, balance over time is what matters.